1. #1

    An addition to the LFR formation tool which could be useful

    What I think LFR needs is a limited raid assist role on top of the current raid assist role.

    for clarity: currently, The raid leader and raid assist roles are basically the same as on normal, except they don't have an autokick. What I think LFR needs is a hidden opt-in option (toggleable only by a special /slash command and requiring you to toggle it on a per-raid basis) which is only documented in the support section and can be vetoed by the raidleader and raid assists in case of abuse.

    what this opt-in option does is give you access to raid marker icons and raid area markers, as well as a limited version of the raid warning which you can only use for a select few universal raid warnings which are transmitted similar to the bright yellow raid warnings, but can't be turned off by addons. the raidwarnings are predefined and cannot be changed and are as follows:

    1) %playername, please stop damaging the boss.
    2) %playername, please stop damaging the non-boss targets.
    3) %playername, please move to the marked player (this also marks the player who is targeted when using this with a giant golden arrow).
    4) %playername, please move away from the marked player.
    5) %playername, please focus on the marked enemy (this marks your current enemy target with a giant red skull).

    All options are given through an extra action bar with appropriate buttons. 1, 2 and 5 are only sent to DPS, while 3 and 4 are sent to everyone but the tanks. the idea is that the tanks should already be aware of the content.

    to limit abuse, this option is limited to 5 players: both tanks and 3 opt-in players, 2 DPS and 1 healers, with the highest equipped itemlevel. the idea behind the highest itemlevel is that they are less likely to be random trolls.

    if you haven't been vetoed during the run, you completed the entire run from the moment you entered and you maintained an average performance of a certain stage (something which shouldn't be hard to achieve, and using damage without negative modifiers, just to ensure that you actively participated in the content) during your alive time (so a death doesn't cost you your reward), you get a call to arms bag for the effort. this effect does stack with any active call to arms effects which were active at the time you queued. This is to incentivise people to opt in, and also to encourage better geared players to enter this so you got a higher chance at success.

    I don't know if this idea will work, or if there are fundamental flaws with it. I just often had the idea during LFR boss fights with multiple wipes, like Nazgrim recently or older bosses, that we might have had success 1 or 2 attempts earlier if there was even a semblance of leadership. Currently, there's just an opt-in for leadership, and the tanks get assist at all times, but you often have random people opting in and then not leading, while the tanks are too busy. The idea is that with an option for limited leadership with a small reward, you have some people join who are willing to put in the extra effort to help the raid succeed.

    IMPORTANT!!!!!

    this is only a rough idea I had. I'm less interested in the actual implementation of the idea. I just want to know if the general concept of a low profile opt-in incentive for helping to lead the raid could be viable to increase success rate.

  2. #2
    Pit Lord Cyrops's Avatar
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    I doubt people would pay attention to those warnings, heck I have DBM and I simply choose to ignore it sometimes, just cause I know what will happen anyway.

    Finished reading, highest ilvl players? really? that is your best solution? Since when ilvl is an indication to anything?
    Maybe IF the system picked people with highest score in endless PG, _maybe_ that would be 'somewhat' accurate.
    Anyway, a skilled player doesn't always make a skilled raid leader.
    Besides, when you are a RL, your performance drops 1/3rd

    Besides, I already see how people would abuse such a system.
    Last edited by Cyrops; 2013-09-27 at 11:15 AM.

  3. #3
    Do you have a better way to filter out some of the trolls in advance? One that's objective and honest?

  4. #4
    Pit Lord Cyrops's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nzall View Post
    Do you have a better way to filter out some of the trolls in advance? One that's objective and honest?
    Any system can be beaten
    There is no way to make a fair system.
    You can only get the next best thing, like I suggested with PG.
    But remember the main thing LFR is ment for: letting people see content.
    In my opinion LFR should give loot of even lower ilvl, like 5 ilvl higher than 5man heroics. Fights should be made easier, even. After FLEX introduction, the LFR could be forgotten to people who want to transition from 5mans to raiding.
    But the main thing that needs to change is other people attitude.
    Raid leader being 500ilvl wanting people with 540+ to carry him in a raid. I blame the people who do carry him.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Cyrops View Post
    But the main thing that needs to change is other people attitude.
    Raid leader being 500ilvl wanting people with 540+ to carry him in a raid. I blame the people who do carry him.
    I think if you ask such a wish to a genie after asking for a bridge over the british channel and being denied for plausiblity, the genie would ask "How many lanes?" almost instantly.

    to just show that you are extremely unlikely to change the attitude of the average player.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also, LFR is not meant for "letting people see the content" as is commonly misconcepted.

    it's actually so that players who cannot participate in organized raiding or PvP have even a semblance of progression and don't end up unsubbing because they have nothing to do.

  6. #6
    I'd be happy enough if you could get say assist if you'd killed a certain number of the bosses on normal mode personally. It's currently just far too much hassle to beg for assist off the tanks when you're queued as healer/DPS...that and the fact that there's no personal reward for helping out in LFR; you're lucky if you even get a thank you. They'll probably never add any sort of reward to 'leading' in LFR because it would just get abused.

    I'm always happy to mark skull/place markers for the LFRlets to follow as that's minimal effort, but needing to beg for assist to be able mark in the first place means I generally can't be bothered. I don't want RL as I'm not interested in the hassle - if I wanted to explain tactics to 24 clueless players I'd run a casual 25-man guild. I would however love to be able to put down marks, as the tanks don't generally bother.

    The idea of warnings is interesting and I can see where you're coming from, but... the players you get in LFR don't want to listen to say/RW. They resent someone telling them how to play or what to do. As such, they're not going to listen to anything however shiney and flashy you make it, so it would be a total waste of time. Yes, I'm making a total generalisation there, but I assume you can see my point.

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