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  1. #181
    Quote Originally Posted by supertony51 View Post
    Jut using my experiences and listing limitations within the military provided healthcare to show..even at a personal level...that Gov't provided healthcare isn't all its cracked up to be.

    Maybe some other countries have it running better than how the military is doing it, but if what im experiencing is what the rest of the population would be subjected to.....well...life would suck for ya'll
    What you described is basic American Healthcare - not just exclusive to the Military.

    My last Doctor I had did not accept walk-ins, and I had to wait nearly 2 weeks to get an appointment in.

    Methinks you mentally live in a VERY isolated world of just your piddley small slice of military life.
    "Tell them only that the Lich King is dead... and that World of Warcraft... died with him..."

    Quote Originally Posted by BenBos View Post
    That's the ONLY reason you would post 9600 posts over 3 years: a mission of hate.

  2. #182
    Quote Originally Posted by StormFX View Post
    Of course you won't. Long as you get your free shit.
    Nothing is free it is a question of PRIORITIES. And spending taxpayer dollars on a true public healthcare system is a VERY VERY VERY good thing to do.

  3. #183
    Quote Originally Posted by Grummgug View Post
    Obamacare is a dead end.

    Science will find a cure for aging in our lifetimes, rendering most health care needs moot because the vast bulk of the costs associated with health care occur among the elderly. With aging cured, you're just looking at minimal insurance to cover catastrophic injury which will not cost much....at least until they come up with a solution to catastrophic injury which will occur not too much longer than the cure for aging.

    We should see the cure for aging in the 2030s. If we are extremely unlucky, it will come in the 2040s. If we are extremely lucky, it will arrive next decade. But it is coming. The ironic thing is, by the time the government finally hammers out all of the issues with Obamacare (if it doesn't get repealed) it will become obsolete.

    We'll see an incredible and amazing revolution in health care in the next couple of decades....and it will have nothing to do with Obamacare.
    ...wow... yeah - I can believe many things, but I cannot believe that at all. We can't even pin down a simple reason/cause for Cancer (nevermind a cure), and you're expecting immortality in the next 15+ years!?

    Unless, of course, your idea for immortality is to fully replace every human organ (including the brain) with cybernetic implants, essentially creating the Cybermen from Doctor Who...
    "Tell them only that the Lich King is dead... and that World of Warcraft... died with him..."

    Quote Originally Posted by BenBos View Post
    That's the ONLY reason you would post 9600 posts over 3 years: a mission of hate.

  4. #184
    Quote Originally Posted by supertony51 View Post
    Personally I like the Free market model.
    What's free market to you?

    Is a grocery store setup around a free market? You go to the doctor and you pay for what you need as you need it?

    Or free market insurance? You get a quote and the company can deny you because they find you're too risky and then you die because you couldn't afford/get coverage.

    Both of those have holes you can drive a truck through, I'm not sure if there is another free market setup you could explain.

    Part A, get cancer can't afford treatment, no one can except the extreme rich.

    Part B, get cancer and insurance company drops you(like auto insurance does if you destroy your record).

    Part C?

  5. #185
    human being should not be able to profit directly off of other human's lives. Free market is all well and good for things people can wait on and find a better price for, but when you have cancer and you either pay the bill or die there is no choosing a better price or avoiding the price gouge. you pay the bill, and that is that.

    Here in Canada i am really thankful for the general coverage all citizens have. A while back i sliced my finger wide open, and if i was in the states i would have had to decide if i was going to keep my finger or make rent. That is a decision no one should have to make.

  6. #186
    Warchief Bantokar's Avatar
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    Social healthcare like most of western Europe.

    I just can´t understand how anyone from America could not want this, especially when considering how they are being raped by the medicinal/insurance industry. Somehow they have been brainwashed into thinking a bit more tax is the devils work. However the free healthcare, free education, 6 weeks paid vacation for everyone and 40.000$ a year minimum wage are actually pretty nice things to have
    8 year olds Dude.

  7. #187
    Quote Originally Posted by Bantokar View Post
    Social healthcare like most of western Europe.

    I just can´t understand how anyone from America could not want this, especially when considering how they are being raped by the medicinal/insurance industry. Somehow they have been brainwashed into thinking a bit more tax is the devils work. However the free healthcare, free education, 6 weeks paid vacation for everyone and 40.000$ a year minimum wage are actually pretty nice things to have
    We're Murrica. Our motto is "Screw you, I got mine"

    *shrug*

  8. #188
    The Lightbringer Yirrah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirPiken View Post
    Free health care doesn't exist. Med school isn't free, and doctor's shouldn't be forced to work for no compensation. Medicine also isn't free.

    Just because the government forces someone else to pay for it doesn't make it free. Even if you are on the receiving end of this "free" health care, it still comes with a political cost. You now have to continue to vote for the people that gave you the "free" candy. I'm sure that is just a coincidence though.
    No-one is forcing anyone to pay, your payment of taxes is part of your social contract with the nation in which you hold a citizenship. You may at any time renounce your citizenship and move to a country where there are no taxation. The fact that most such countries has no infrastructure and is plagued by unrest and outright war may however dissuade you from this choice, but that is YOUR choice.
    Want ACTA? No? Say NO to TTIP! Want GMO's? No? Say NO to TTIP! Want your country controlled by US buisness interests? No? Say NO to TTIP!

  9. #189
    I would make the "bronze" packages baseline in America, government run. They'd use the cost cutting tool HMO's used to use until people QQ'ed to much and sent our healthcare costs to be 85+% higher than pretty much every industrialized country. People could buy more comprehensive insurance out of pocket if they wanted. All preventative medicine would be covered, including the tools needs to curb smoking/obesity. All surgeries and medications required on illnesses with drastically higher rates due to smoking or obesity would require out of pocket additional insurance policies for those who smoke/are obese or would have to be paid out of pocket.

    This would provide the best balance of prevent care, improving general health, while allowing people to live their lives as they choose, taking full responsibility for those choices. It would also remove incentives to make less money to get benefits, and remove incentives for businesses to do weird things to their employees to dodge paying. Companies that want to impress/attract employees could still offer the additional private coverage plans.

    And yes, everyone hate HMO's. But, seriously... this is our system:

  10. #190
    How do you think Healthcare should be run in the US or world?
    By individuals, of course.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by QQingshaman View Post
    human being should not be able to profit directly off of other human's lives. Free market is all well and good for things people can wait on and find a better price for, but when you have cancer and you either pay the bill or die there is no choosing a better price or avoiding the price gouge. you pay the bill, and that is that.

    Here in Canada i am really thankful for the general coverage all citizens have. A while back i sliced my finger wide open, and if i was in the states i would have had to decide if i was going to keep my finger or make rent. That is a decision no one should have to make.
    Why should I have to pay for your irresponsible choices? You'd only have to decide between rent and having a finger if you were so irresponsible that you wasted all your money, didn't think to save any of it, and lived a life of instant gratification, only because you expected other people to foot the bill. I'm not responsible for your actions. YOU ARE.

  11. #191
    Like us filthy filthy lefty socialists in Western Europe of course.

    How else?!

  12. #192
    Quote Originally Posted by paralleluniverse View Post
    Obamacare fixes this.

    No one can be denied coverage, insurance companies can't pick and choose anymore.

    Everyone must be insured or face a fine, so the free rider problem you mention is now solved.
    More like obamacare just spreads the cost and forces younger people to buy insurance to support older adults. It will fail in the end because most people under 35 will just take the penalty because its cheaper than buying into health care insurance that they probably won't hardly use.
    Last edited by Submerge; 2013-10-02 at 03:41 PM.

  13. #193
    I live in Canada, and nobody here can undertand the US healthcare system, and I imagine its the same throughout Europe.

    Here, you get sick, you're covered. I dont even know what insurance I have or dont, and I dont care. I dont need to worry about it. To tell people that they cant have healthcare because they cant afford it is absurd.

    I heard it being discussed on the radio this morning too, and we simply cannot understand your health care system, or your opinions of why you cant give people free healthcare.

    Our system isnt perfect, we can sometimes have long waitlists for surgeries, some hospitals are getting a little rundown, and there are other problems. However, the biggest problem we would ever find is people being left behind, and the Canadian public wouldnt allow it.

    Good job Democrats. This exact reform might not be the best way to go about it, but hopefully you will be remembered for initiating the movement of universal healthcare in the US.

  14. #194
    Quote Originally Posted by Anodur View Post
    Why should I have to pay for your irresponsible choices? You'd only have to decide between rent and having a finger if you were so irresponsible that you wasted all your money, didn't think to save any of it, and lived a life of instant gratification, only because you expected other people to foot the bill. I'm not responsible for your actions. YOU ARE.
    apparently no one in the history of the world has ever lost shifts, or been laid off, or maybe, just maybe, i'm a student who cant afford to put money away. cause ya know, school is expensive and shit. Your assumptions about how i live my life make you look like a real asshole, and what a coincidence,

    By individuals, of course.
    you want people profiting off of misfortune.

  15. #195
    Bloodsail Admiral Shadee's Avatar
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    It should be run by the free market. If you get sick and can't afford it than too bad.

  16. #196
    Government controlled.
    extra fees for extra services (like dental)
    Everyone pays a monthly fee BUT Rich people pay more than poor people. (i pay 120 atm, so someone rich should pay around 250 )
    Medicare covers all costs, when insured.

    We should make a government controlled pharmaceutical operation. now THAT would cut medicare costs like 50%.

  17. #197
    Quote Originally Posted by araine View Post
    Full government controlled so we get rid of the for profit motive. Hospitals etc should also be government owned and operated most of the time since failing to do so just means you let more for profit motives drive up the cost.
    What a joke.

    You'd have nothing but horribly-run facilities and the insurance companies laughing even further to the bank.

    Privatize EVERYTHING, let companies within the market compete to offer the best service at the best price.

    Fucking socialists.

    "There are two types of guys in this world. Guys who sniff their fingers after scratching their balls, and dirty fucking liars." -StylesClashv3
    "Elo Hell is where the Ego is greater than the Elo." -Bystekhilcar

  18. #198
    Quote Originally Posted by Toxigen View Post
    What a joke.

    You'd have nothing but horribly-run facilities and the insurance companies laughing even further to the bank.

    Privatize EVERYTHING, let companies within the market compete to offer the best service at the best price.

    Fucking socialists.
    They tried privating dentists here (they all had the same price tag, but now they could decide their own).
    Costs went up by 30% overall and service went down caus more teeth pulled = more cash earned.

    Fuck socialists indeed, let's get telemarketers calling for the cheapest cancer treatment in town (without service, caus we need to exploit the cancer patient because we greedy) and death/live ratio. Thats so much better than caring for your fellow man.

  19. #199
    Old God Grizzly Willy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toxigen View Post
    What a joke.

    You'd have nothing but horribly-run facilities and the insurance companies laughing even further to the bank.

    Privatize EVERYTHING, let companies within the market compete to offer the best service at the best price.

    Fucking socialists.
    Is that what is happening in Sweden, Denmark, or the UK? I mean, we have plenty of members on these boards that have socialized healthcare, and I recall them being rather happy with it.

    And what makes socialism bad, anyways?

  20. #200
    Titan Kalis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toxigen View Post
    What a joke.

    You'd have nothing but horribly-run facilities and the insurance companies laughing even further to the bank.

    Privatize EVERYTHING, let companies within the market compete to offer the best service at the best price.

    Fucking socialists.
    Yeah, because that NHS and other nations' equivalents have "...horribly-run facilities and the insurance companies laughing even further to the bank"

    Free Market Healthcare...for people that like to pay more for their healthcare than they have to.
    Last edited by Kalis; 2013-10-02 at 08:49 PM.

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