1. #1

    Shadow priest dps problems

    Hello,

    my name is Lumea and start recently playing wow again since cata. I want to raid again on high level but i keep struggling on my dps.
    my haste cap is 10142 for the extra tick on VT and my normal dps is like 70-85k dps and i know it can be way higher but i really dont have a clue what i do wrong. I hope some of you know what i do wrong or give me tips about it.


    greeting,

    Lumea

    - - - Updated - - -

    since i cant link anything yet:

    Ingame name: Lumea
    Realm: Outland

    Dps vid: YT>lumeavideo > dps test

    UPDATE LOGS

    Had some logs of ToT, dps increased from 90>100-105k

    world of logs slash this:
    /reports/k977vt51bhbkr3x9/

    greeting,

    Lumea
    Last edited by zhaliax; 2013-09-23 at 12:00 AM.

  2. #2
    Logs are a way better way to determine issue with rotation, However I did notice a few things from the video.

    1. You're delaying Mind Blast quite a bit, usually putting in a full 3 tick mind flay after it comes off cooldown, and even using mind flay after getting your 3rd orb instead of going straight into Devouring

    2. You're not clipping Shadow Word: Insanity. It behaves the same as Mind Flay for clipping, so you can cast the channel between the 2nd and 3rd tick, and it will add the 3 ticks instead of stopping between. You're getting 6 ticks of SWI per Devouring when you could be getting probably 10 in your haste level. If you do this properly, you will refresh the channel just as devouring is about to fall off and get an additional 3 ticks past the 6 second duration. Because of this, your rotation will be Mind Blast, Devouring, SWI, SWI, SWI (clipped early if necessary to allow gcd to finish in time to get one more cast) SWI (past the duration of DP), Mind Blast (as it will be just coming back off cooldown. Due to this you will likely need to get used to refreshing VT and SWP early in these situations.

    3. You're letting your dots fall off and are re-applying once that's done, In the cast of VT you're losing about 2-3 ticks every time you do this, so only likely getting about 80% of the damage you should be out of your dots. If you cast SWP or VT so your cast finishes between the last two ticks (usually between 1.5 and 0 seconds remaining, this window is shorter with higher haste) it will extend your dot without it missing any ticks.

  3. #3
    Mechagnome Deyana's Avatar
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    How much do you expect to do with that itemlevel and no legendary quests items? Sure the mentioned things can help you but not in some kind of unrealistic measures you seem to believe. I have my own little priest which did 60k dps yesterday on dummies with only own buffs, no flask etc (ilevel 504 or so) but later in raid this 60k turned into 115k because of raid buffs, food and flask and of course some adds. My only recommendation would be to stay away from dummies and get into real raid. If you still do less there than everyone else with similar itemlevel, you can start worrying again.

  4. #4
    Titan Winter Blossom's Avatar
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    Icy-Veins.com has a great DPS guide for Shadow Priests. Give it a read

    http://www.icy-veins.com/shadow-prie...-pve-dps-guide

  5. #5
    Dreadlord veiledy0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deyana View Post
    How much do you expect to do with that itemlevel and no legendary quests items? Sure the mentioned things can help you but not in some kind of unrealistic measures you seem to believe.
    LMG does actually increase your DPS by an unrealistic amount.

    Quote Originally Posted by Celticmoon View Post
    Icy-Veins.com has a great DPS guide for Shadow Priests.
    Their guide is quite shallow, and wrong on some stuff.
    When you cried I'd wipe away all of your tears
    When you'd scream I'd fight away all of your fears
    And I held your hand through all of these years

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by veiledy0 View Post
    Their guide is quite shallow
    Compared to some of the other guides out there, I agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by veiledy0 View Post
    and wrong on some stuff.
    Care to give any examples? I happen to know the guy who does some reviews for it.

    EDIT: What I mean by this, of course, is that if there's something wrong please tell me about it so I can pass it along to the proper channels to get it fixed. If there isn't anything incorrect with it, per se, and you're just not a fan of their guides in general, please say that instead of giving a generic "wrong on some stuff" answer.

  7. #7
    Dreadlord veiledy0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twintop View Post
    Care to give any examples? I happen to know the guy who does some reviews for it.
    It places MB above SW: D, says PI should be used as often as possible, that you do not need to concern yourself with ToF just because it's a passive, and that T6 talents should be used on cooldown whenever you can damage multiple targets with it, which is all wrong. It also says you should use Hymn of Hope if your healers require you to use it, in which case you should just tell them to fu*k off.
    When you cried I'd wipe away all of your tears
    When you'd scream I'd fight away all of your fears
    And I held your hand through all of these years

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by veiledy0 View Post
    It places MB above SW: D
    Agreed.

    Quote Originally Posted by veiledy0 View Post
    says PI should be used as often as possible
    Which you should, because if you don't you'll end up losing casts of it over the course of a fight by constantly waiting. Timing it and lining it up with other procs/buffs is something (IMO) outside the scope of this guide.

    Quote Originally Posted by veiledy0 View Post
    that you do not need to concern yourself with ToF just because it's a passive
    Look at the descriptions on the other two abilities listed there. They have active components to them that change what you need to do when it comes off CD or a proc happens. ToF occurs and you don't have to change what you're doing. Perhaps making mention somewhere else in the guide that you can increase uptime of ToF by attacking other targets that get low is in order, but if you're multidotting anyway you'll get those procs in the first place.

    Quote Originally Posted by veiledy0 View Post
    and that T6 talents should be used on cooldown whenever you can damage multiple targets with it, which is all wrong.
    The phrasing on that is a little strange because of the comma when they are two different thoughts (on cooldown, or, when you can hit multiple targets).

    Quote Originally Posted by veiledy0 View Post
    It also says you should use Hymn of Hope if your healers require you to use it, in which case you should just tell them to fu*k off.
    Haters gonna hate? :3


    EDIT: For clarity, I make recommendations for guide updates but don't actually do any of the writing/phrasing/layout/updates. With that being said, I can (and will) pass along any critiques. Remember, I just want what's best for the community in general.

  9. #9
    Titan Winter Blossom's Avatar
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    Well, he can also try out HowtoPriest.com

  10. #10
    Mechagnome Deyana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by veiledy0 View Post
    LMG does actually increase your DPS by an unrealistic amount.
    You misunderstood my post, I was talking about the rotation improvement tips that the guy before me suggested as "the mentioned things".
    Sure I was expressing myself in a bit messy way but if you read it and use your brain, you would understand what I meant.

  11. #11
    Bloodsail Admiral Frmercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celticmoon View Post
    Well, he can also try out HowtoPriest.com
    I heard the guy who writes the Shadow guide from there is an ass.

  12. #12
    Had some logs of ToT, dps increased from 90>100-105k

    world of logs slash this:
    /reports/k977vt51bhbkr3x9/

  13. #13
    The logs confirm most of what I mentioned in my earlier post. You're delaying Mind Blast (and even Divine Insight procs) to cast mind flay furthar. Dots are falling off and or being refreshed slightly after instead of before the last tick. That said, it's not the worst dot uptime I've seen. Can definitely use some work, especially around the movement phases.

    Average time between mind blasts is 10.5 seconds on your Jin'rokh kill. This should be around 9 or 9.5 seconds when you are not using Divine Insight, and even lower when you are. Couple times you had Divine Insight procs up for extended periods of time (one of them was actually longer than Mind Blast's cooldown).

    T90 talents were only used twice on your Jin'rokh kill, Not only do they do strong heals, they can do some fairly impressive damage as well. With a 15 second cooldown, it should've been used around 11 or 12 times during that kill. It should be higher priority than Mind Flay, but not higher than dots or Mind Blast/SWD. Its a useful ability for movement phase as well.

    Still need to work on Shadow Word: Insanity, As I mentioned before, It can be clipped like Mind Flay. So you can cast it before the cast ends again and it will continue. 4 of the times you used it, you got 1 or 2 casts off during, and One you got 3 (the 3rd cast on this one was perfect starting time for extending past Devouring, but you could've gotten at least 1 extra tick in by clipping previous casts)

    Based on the timing, you should be able to sneak in at least another 2 Shadow Word: Death as well. Remember to cast two back to back and wait for the cooldown to come back up.

    The bars on this image should give you a better idea as far as timing goes on how far off you are on some abilities. http://i.imgur.com/0hHbr9G.png
    Last edited by Nestar; 2013-09-23 at 06:56 AM.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Nestar View Post
    The bars on this image should give you a better idea as far as timing goes on how far off you are on some abilities.
    Are those green bar thingies premium-only? Because I NEED THEM FOR MY THEORYCRAFT.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Tharid View Post
    Are those green bar thingies premium-only? Because I NEED THEM FOR MY THEORYCRAFT.
    Nope, If you go to the buffs cast tab or the buffs gained tab, there are Pound Symbols (#) clicking on that will add that bar to the list above, (add them in whatever order you want), Once they're up the red X on the right side will get rid of a row.

  16. #16
    Hello shadowpriests of MMO,

    Here a reaction of Lumea's raidleader since we encountered some dps issues again yesterday. First of all I'm giving him my compliments for seeking ways to improve his dps , not something most people/raiders actually do when they encounter some issues.

    So since last week we started raiding SoO and as we killed the first two bosses quite quickly. However the third boss gave us some problems. Tactwise it took a try or three before we got used to orb rotation and pioritizing adds but after that we ran into a third problem - the enrage timer. Now I know that getting purified late into the fight influences the dps of players but I/we still felt that when we entered the 50% burn phase the dps of certain players had to be better. After a while I decided to switch Lumea around with a Monk what worked out in the end. However I didn't find it quite fun to replace Lumea since I actually want him to be in our solid raid team.

    My question is to you fellow shadowpriests; is it his gear that still holds him back that much (512) or is still something in his rotation? Cause gearwise I could take a look in another ToT run what might gear him up a bit more.
    Logs of the last three raids we had in SoO

    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/ks9021mypmeuif0c/
    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j7aqq43foad5ejom/ (Flex)
    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/am1uysixncqohmgt/

  17. #17
    My opinion is that his gear is really hlds him back ...512 its nor a TOT gear lev and managing 100k on Galakras and nearly 90 on some others its not bad
    And gear wise? there are a lot of drops in TOT to gear him up
    Belt and neck pretty poor (489 now? when u got timeless isle 535 is not good), bracers with more haste, boots, head with more haste, legendary meta gem will help him a lot, not mentioning legendary cloak. Almost all his gear could be replaced with the ToT drops (boots from tailoring craf - haste+2gemsx320 haste)
    Last edited by tereu5; 2013-09-30 at 08:13 AM.

  18. #18
    Mechagnome Deyana's Avatar
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    Looking at the logs, it seems that Lumea is not multidotting enough. Luckily I had some logs from my own shadowpriest when we had a guild flex. I'm not saying I'm some kind of pro player, but I did manage to have 114k dps on protectors with 503-504 something ilevel, while he had 101k. If it was made with 512, it's definitely too little.
    So yeah, as I said, multidotting. Here is my log, you can do the math how many more ticks of SW:P I had there and consider that I'm not used to multidotting at all.

    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-b7...?s=2182&e=2649

    And always try to score a hit on low hp targets to keep twisted fate up.
    And use flask and 300 stat food.

    EDIT: oh nvm, Lumea not using twisted fate. I've got nothing to say about the other talent though, never tried it. Let someone else say if it is viable or not.
    Last edited by Deyana; 2013-09-30 at 08:18 AM.

  19. #19
    Talents most likely are fight specific....loads of movement and few adds - ToF would be good (especially if you could't find a sweet spot to stand still at least for the time while the Insanity is channelled)

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Spartex View Post
    Hello shadowpriests of MMO,

    Here a reaction of Lumea's raidleader since we encountered some dps issues again yesterday. First of all I'm giving him my compliments for seeking ways to improve his dps , not something most people/raiders actually do when they encounter some issues.

    So since last week we started raiding SoO and as we killed the first two bosses quite quickly. However the third boss gave us some problems. Tactwise it took a try or three before we got used to orb rotation and pioritizing adds but after that we ran into a third problem - the enrage timer. Now I know that getting purified late into the fight influences the dps of players but I/we still felt that when we entered the 50% burn phase the dps of certain players had to be better. After a while I decided to switch Lumea around with a Monk what worked out in the end. However I didn't find it quite fun to replace Lumea since I actually want him to be in our solid raid team.

    My question is to you fellow shadowpriests; is it his gear that still holds him back that much (512) or is still something in his rotation? Cause gearwise I could take a look in another ToT run what might gear him up a bit more.
    Logs of the last three raids we had in SoO

    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/ks9021mypmeuif0c/
    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j7aqq43foad5ejom/ (Flex)
    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/am1uysixncqohmgt/
    He's still really struggling with dot uptime and priority.
    45 Mind Blasts using Divine Insight when the fight was long enough to get 62 without. Protectors specifically, he could probably double what he's doing damage wise, and a good 50-60% on the other fights.
    Based on the timing I'm seeing, It doesn't look like he's using dot timers. he's applying both dots, then refreshing them all 3+ seconds after they fall off, Again putting Mind Flay ahead of Mind Blast priority wise.

    I highly recommend spending some time on a target dummy. Set his recount to healing or something so he cant see how much damage he's doing, and just stay at it, until he can do 5 minutes straight without having a single dot fall off or delaying Mind Blast.

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