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  1. #181
    Scarab Lord Moon Blade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barnabas View Post
    Sure Blizzard needs a cash shop because they aren't attracting new players. Yet you never see Blizzard advertising the chest in the marketing of MOP. If they advertised the chest, put cata in there (worst expansion really worth an extra $10), and maybe gave new players some incentive to level to 90 (heirloom type gear?) then subs would climb again. Then someone chimes in with well it's only an extra 10 dollars versus buying a new game. We are talking about attracting new players and giving incentive to level to 90 then do an entire new grind.
    Some new players being fickle and having a short attention span isn't worth trashing the entirety of your content to appease.
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  2. #182
    Quote Originally Posted by iggie View Post
    I pay around $5 a month for my play time and nothing for expansions. I do agree though, blizzard is getting more greedy. Look how they mangled Diablo 3 with the AH/RMAH pay 2 win they had set up. It's only a matter of time before their greed spreads to WoW. Hopefully I'm playing something else sooner than later.
    You mean the AH/RMAH that they agreed was a disaster and are shutting down in a few months? Yes they messed up, they admitted to it, and they're moving away from that. So the odds of that "greed spreading to WoW" is quickly approaching "never" if it hasn't surpassed it already.

  3. #183
    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Blade View Post
    Some new players being fickle and having a short attention span isn't worth trashing the entirety of your content to appease.
    You are a bit late to that party (realization) if that is your retort. Because that erosion happened expansions ago. You think all these changes they've made to make everything easy are for the hardcore players that have no life?

  4. #184
    Field Marshal Castochi's Avatar
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    A cheat code is used to facilitate your progress in the game. In a game such as World of Warcraft, if you could buy cheat codes to facilitate your character's progress and thus signifying a pay-to-win system, I would unsub on the spot along with probably millions of other players, and I'm confident when I say the day WoW becomes pay-to-win will be the day the game completely dies.

    The difference with WoW is that anything you can buy from the Blizzard store such as pets, mounts, appearance changes, race changes, char transfers and the horrible-ass xmog helms that look like crap all are cosmetic or quality of life purchases that do not affect your character's progress in any way shape or form.

    About Blizzard's business model, yeah, I don't love it too much either. Having to buy the game, expansions and a subscription fee on top of that plain sucks... But Blizzard has earned the right to maintain that business model. Ten years ago this business model was the most profitable for any MMO out there, and WoW wasn't the only game to use this. Take a quick look at a more recent game: RIFT. I bought RIFT and played it for several months until the game bored me and I quit. Months later, I learned that RIFT was starting to merge servers and go to a free-to-play model with cosmetic micro transactions. This is where I say Blizzard has earned the right to maintain this business model. How many other MMOs have been forced to go free-to-play simply because WoW is an overall better game and is the King of MMOs in the market?

    This thread is simply another one of those "Let's whine about unnecessarily about stuff that hasn't changed for a decade and probably never will". Blizzard has said that it may make sense that WoW goes to a free-to-play scheme in the future, but not unless that means a more profitable business model. If I were Blizzard, I would maintain the current business model that they've earned the right to maintain, until a.) Free-to-play becomes more profitable or b.) Blizzard makes another, better MMO that provides more revenue than WoW, and in this case I would transfer the current WoW business model to THAT game.

  5. #185
    Scarab Lord slime's Avatar
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    In the end, whether you wanna argue someone is a blizzfanboy or not, the arguement that you dont have to buy or play any of this shit is a clear cut winner. You don't have to play time/money wasting mmos unless you want to. You don't have to buy cosmetic things in that said mmo if you don't want to. Even things you do want to do - like transfer realms, or race change you don't HAVE to do - trust me there are a few 90s i'd like to move, but it will be a cold day in hell that i give blizz anymore than my monthly sub cost.

    When they cross-over to paying for things that matter, then I might *sigh* or something.

    DLC is a much more dangerous animal. With DLC there is a grey line that can constantly be moved by the maker of the product as to where the paid for game ends and the DLC begins.

  6. #186
    Over 9000! Snowraven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    Oh come on, that is such a ridiculous slippery slope and you know it.

    Yes, Blizzard, like any company, is concerned with their bottom line. Yes, Blizzard, like any company, thinks of ways to make more money, but we also all know there is a limit to what they'd do. One, because the playerbase would never accept it, and two, because there are plenty of people at Blizzard who are there to do what Blizzard does: make great games.

    Everything you've just posted is hyped-up and sensationalist nonsense. Why shouldn't they charge for convenience items like race changes or transfers? Why shouldn't they charge for new pets or mounts not found in game? Why can't they have premium items just like all of the free MMO's you listed?

    On that topic, it's easy to make a free game but it's hard to make a lasting game with a truly dedicated playerbase like World of Warcraft has. You can list all of the free MMO's you want but none of them have the cachet of World of Warcraft. None of them have entered popular culture like WoW has.
    Because free to play MMOs are free to play. For WoW you pay a subscription. I think that's reason enough.

    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    No kidding. I recently played a free-to-play phone came and calculated everything I spent in it in two months.

    3 $49.99 reloads of "donuts" (Simpsons!) + 5 $.99 Golden Tickets + 1 $9.99 reload of donuts. About $165 in two months. How much did I spend on World of Warcraft? 1 race change for $25, and two months sub: $57 total.

    $165 vs $57. Micro transactions creep up on you. You can frequently spend a lot more in a micro-transaction game than you ever would in World of Warcraft. Granted, not everyone will. My partner never spends money on games like that.



    There is a limit. I can guarantee we'd speak very vocally with our wallets if Blizzard charged for raids
    Let's calculate how much I spent in GW2 then since you're giving an example. I bought it when it launched, but because it was cheaper in my country, 40 euros. And I didn't pay a single cent since then, yet got all the content and I never felt I needed to buy something. In fact, I can get most stuff I want by farming gold! Well how about that! So 1 year for 40 euros.
    Now let's look at WoW. Again, expansion would have been cheaper, 40 euros... plus 15 per month. That would mean 220 euros per year. And for that money I still don't get free character transfers at least once in a blue moon or... a free name change at least 1 per year or something similar. Heck, if my server died, I would not get a transfer more likely unless I pay!

    The idea is that unless you're absolutely forced to buy something, buying it is just out of your own choice.
    In WoW you're forced to buy the expansion and pay the fee if you want to play.
    In GW2 I was only forced to buy the game.


    Do you see the difference?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    They're still not selling gear...
    No, they're not selling gear with stats. Yet. They are selling gear, for now the gear is just cosmetic helms though. For now.

  7. #187
    Quote Originally Posted by Snowraven View Post
    No, they're not selling gear with stats. Yet. They are selling gear, for now the gear is just cosmetic helms though. For now.
    I think you got a nice jump off that slippery slope, now pack it up and get back to what Blizzard has sold from the store instead of hinting at stuff they might sell, maybe, possibly, probably never.

  8. #188
    Quote Originally Posted by Snowraven View Post
    Because free to play MMOs are free to play. For WoW you pay a subscription. I think that's reason enough.


    Let's calculate how much I spent in GW2 then since you're giving an example. I bought it when it launched, but because it was cheaper in my country, 40 euros. And I didn't pay a single cent since then, yet got all the content and I never felt I needed to buy something. In fact, I can get most stuff I want by farming gold! Well how about that! So 1 year for 40 euros.
    Now let's look at WoW. Again, expansion would have been cheaper, 40 euros... plus 15 per month. That would mean 220 euros per year. And for that money I still don't get free character transfers at least once in a blue moon or... a free name change at least 1 per year or something similar. Heck, if my server died, I would not get a transfer more likely unless I pay!

    The idea is that unless you're absolutely forced to buy something, buying it is just out of your own choice.
    In WoW you're forced to buy the expansion and pay the fee if you want to play.
    In GW2 I was only forced to buy the game.


    Do you see the difference?

    - - - Updated - - -


    No, they're not selling gear with stats. Yet. They are selling gear, for now the gear is just cosmetic helms though. For now.
    Yeah, the raging success of the transmog gear Blizzard says themselves failed spectacularly will totally make them put more out.

    Christ almighty, I know some of you have hard ons for hating everything Blizzard does anymore because they must've touched you in the middle of the night. Please, try not to let it cloud any further posts from you.

  9. #189
    I have bought a couple of mounts and the helmets. Goes good with my transmogs. I could get a full game on steam-sale for the same price, so it's kinda stupid, however I play wow far more than any other game, so I think it's worth it. You don't need these items, so I have nothing against this added feature.
    Mother pus bucket!

  10. #190
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    Nah, Blizzard aren't polite enough to tell us when they're caressing our bums. Every extra fee they want to add is already included in the monthly fee, micro transactions, and price of new x-packs. You really think that the entirety of your 15 bucks when buying a blizzard store pet goes to making more blizzard store pets? Or the entirety of your monthly fee goes to making sure the service is provided to you? 80% is pocket money for them and always been. xD

    I have always known this is how it works but y'know what? They are worth it because I'm still paying and enjoying myself :>
    Something, Something, Something, Dark Side.

  11. #191
    Quote Originally Posted by Ausr View Post
    Yeah, the raging success of the transmog gear Blizzard says themselves failed spectacularly will totally make them put more out.

    Christ almighty, I know some of you have hard ons for hating everything Blizzard does anymore because they must've touched you in the middle of the night. Please, try not to let it cloud any further posts from you.
    I have not seen any posts from Blizzard regarding sales figures of the helms, do you have a link?

    To be honest is it appalling that you would use the subject of sexual abuse in such a way.

  12. #192
    Quote Originally Posted by Snowraven View Post
    Because free to play MMOs are free to play. For WoW you pay a subscription. I think that's reason enough.


    Let's calculate how much I spent in GW2 then since you're giving an example. I bought it when it launched, but because it was cheaper in my country, 40 euros. And I didn't pay a single cent since then, yet got all the content and I never felt I needed to buy something. In fact, I can get most stuff I want by farming gold! Well how about that! So 1 year for 40 euros.
    Now let's look at WoW. Again, expansion would have been cheaper, 40 euros... plus 15 per month. That would mean 220 euros per year. And for that money I still don't get free character transfers at least once in a blue moon or... a free name change at least 1 per year or something similar. Heck, if my server died, I would not get a transfer more likely unless I pay!

    The idea is that unless you're absolutely forced to buy something, buying it is just out of your own choice.
    In WoW you're forced to buy the expansion and pay the fee if you want to play.
    In GW2 I was only forced to buy the game.


    Do you see the difference?

    - - - Updated - - -


    No, they're not selling gear with stats. Yet. They are selling gear, for now the gear is just cosmetic helms though. For now.
    I prefer to look at WoW as a price per expansion number rather than a price per year number. So:
    Vanilla: apprx 520
    Burning Crusade: apprx 520
    Wrath: apprx: 520
    Cataclysm: apprx 520
    Pandas: 260 and counting, with no beta yet I'm assuming 520

    That's a big price tag for a video game.

    Regarding the selling of cosmetic armor, this one's kinda weird. The challenge of the game is managed regardless of numeric values as we'll see with the stat crunch, so most things in the game are primarily cosmetic including stats. They do offer a pet that can be sold for gold though, so they are selling in game advantages, which I believe is the main concern with selling things in game.

  13. #193
    Quote Originally Posted by Trassk View Post
    I do wonder what they intend to bleed the players for next? new raids (download raids for $5 each)?, instant max level? there probably even charge us for character model updates when there finished, calling it now, this is what they will do.
    You're delusional if you think they would go through with something like this. And, from my standpoint, I don't see Blizzard making the mistakes here, it's fucking Activision. Activision has been a poison to Blizzard ever since they came together. It's hard to believe a strong company like Blizzard, after seeing the Feats they reached in Wrath of the Lich King with their highest player base would make a fool of themselves, by themselves, with something as bad as the Cata expansion and Diablo 3. All of these mistakes we're are seeing "by Blizzard" is actually Activision screwing everything over.

  14. #194
    Scarab Lord Gimlix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trassk View Post
    because its for one class type only, and blizzard figures if they can make armor that everyone can use, like the helmets, then they can get everyone buying them.
    He has a point Trassk, admit it.
    They had the chance to put that set in the shop and they didn't
    Pretty sure they won't do the kind of event like the helmet again, blizzard knows what to do when negativity comes in place.
    » Active MMO-Champion visitor since: 12-12-2012 «
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    Quote Originally Posted by bloodkin View Post
    no king rules forever, but WoW is a stubborn bastard.

  15. #195
    Quote Originally Posted by Snowraven View Post
    Because free to play MMOs are free to play. For WoW you pay a subscription. I think that's reason enough.


    Let's calculate how much I spent in GW2 then since you're giving an example. I bought it when it launched, but because it was cheaper in my country, 40 euros. And I didn't pay a single cent since then, yet got all the content and I never felt I needed to buy something. In fact, I can get most stuff I want by farming gold! Well how about that! So 1 year for 40 euros.
    Now let's look at WoW. Again, expansion would have been cheaper, 40 euros... plus 15 per month. That would mean 220 euros per year. And for that money I still don't get free character transfers at least once in a blue moon or... a free name change at least 1 per year or something similar. Heck, if my server died, I would not get a transfer more likely unless I pay!

    The idea is that unless you're absolutely forced to buy something, buying it is just out of your own choice.
    In WoW you're forced to buy the expansion and pay the fee if you want to play.
    In GW2 I was only forced to buy the game.


    Do you see the difference?
    You completely through his point to the side and didn't even take account for it. So what you didn't spend more money on GW2 in a year compared to WoW. You're comparing a Ferrari to a beat up Truck. World of Warcraft has probably given you a better run for your money over the years than GW2 will ever give you. On top of that, he stated "Micro transactions CAN creep up on you." THEY DO! I stopped playing WoW a while back to start playing DC Universe Online. They have a free to play model, but you can buy your expansions, so you can do more dungeons, raids, etc. You can also purchase tokens to reset raids so you can get more gear in the given week. They had a sale for triple the currency on your purchase. I spent $100 on the game, got $300 worth of currency out of it, used maybe $30 of it and got into Dota 2. Still have $200 something left on the account and I don't even play it. Point is, when there is something that looks cool and seems like it is going to benefit you, people with wallets are going to oblige.

  16. #196
    Bloodsail Admiral Baine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mmochampionuserone View Post
    sucsusfool.
    woot?
    /10 chars

    Infracted: Please post constructively. Thank you. [ML]
    Last edited by MoanaLisa; 2013-09-29 at 09:49 PM.

  17. #197
    Quote Originally Posted by Tommo View Post
    What annoys me is that Blizzard managed fine before they introduced the shop, infact they done fine before they even had anything near the cash cow that is WoW. Their game is declining slightly, lets not bullshit ourselves, and thats fine, its still one of the biggest MMOs out there.

    The way to keep their profits up isnt to stab the playerbase in the back by giving them exclusive content at unreasonable prices. Its to admit their mistakes, downsize, and get their server populations back in order, instead of pretending that they can still accomodate the current playerbase by spreading them thin on too many servers.

    The cash shop is so unnecessary for a multinational, mega company like Blizzard, which still has several other top games. If anything all it does is makes them lose face and trust, all for minor profits im sure they could piss away in a day and not even blink. Our subscription is enough, if they want to give us options for cosmetics put them in the damn game in the form of challenges or whatever, doesnt need to be HC content, just easy stuff thats fun.

    The reason smaller games have cash shops is because they truly need the profits, World of Warcraft is above the profits they get from the cash shop. The only good thing ive seen from the shop is the charity fund raising, thats about it for me.
    Please just stop.
    When you call yourself an Indian or a Muslim or a Christian or a European, or anything else, you are being violent. Do you see why it is violent? Because you are separating yourself from the rest of mankind. When you separate yourself by belief, by nationality, by tradition, it breeds violence. So a man who is seeking to understand violence does not belong to any country, to any religion, to any political party or partial system; he is concerned with the total understanding of mankind.

  18. #198
    High Overlord
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    Gotten too expensive? The sub price hasn't ever changed...how has it possibly gotten more expensive? If you're paying for optional features like a race change or a server transfer that's on you. Your fault.
    We are still in the Second Great Depression, also known as the Great Recession. It's pretty hard to find a comfortable economic ground that allows people to play WoW these days.

    Personally, unless the terms "Premade Exclusive Group Content" and "Item Squish" are removed from WoW's dictionary in the next expansion, both of which are highly unlikely, WoW's value is stinted for me. And I'm one of the ex-players who spent hundreds of dollars just to keep playing in the hopes that maybe there would be everything for everyone instead of everything for a small group of people who act like lobbyists in Blizzard's statistics department.
    A wise saying once said "A wise man builds a foundation from the bricks others have thrown at him."

  19. #199
    Quote Originally Posted by Trassk View Post
    I do wonder what they intend to bleed the players for next? new raids (download raids for $5 each)?
    Might not be a bad idea. Given how expensive they are to make and how few players actually enjoy them "the way they were meant to be played". Don't see why the majority should fund content they never really see and don't really enjoy.

  20. #200
    As a long time Street Fighter player and member of the FGC, and also a fan of Blizzard games, I have never spent money on microtransactions because I've never had to in order to win.

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