1. #1

    Frustrated with numbers in 25 man Raid

    Is anyone else frustrated with their numbers in 25 man raids?

    I have been playing 2H frost. Ilevel apx 539 and still cant come up much past 8th dps in our 25 man normal raids. Usually settling around 145k dps or so depending on the fight. I have tried different stat priorities and talents but I still feel like even when I play near perfectly I cant compete with the other classes.

    Does anyone else feel this way?

  2. #2
    Nope, pretty much always 1st with 553 iLvL. Even though my other teammates playing other classes are very good.

    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...Helperz/simple

    http://www.wowprogress.com/guild/eu/...urder+of+Crows

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by MegaKeeperMan View Post
    Nope, pretty much always 1st with 553 iLvL. Even though my other teammates playing other classes are very good.

    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...Helperz/simple

    http://www.wowprogress.com/guild/eu/...urder+of+Crows
    As DW is pretty weak without a few core items and a solid iLvL I am sorry to tell you the truth about your teammates: They don't play their classes good at all. If they get beaten by a dk with missing core items which would still only bring him to about upper middle of the pack, they can't play their classes very good.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by anon1482 View Post
    Is anyone else frustrated with their numbers in 25 man raids?

    I have been playing 2H frost. Ilevel apx 539 and still cant come up much past 8th dps in our 25 man normal raids. Usually settling around 145k dps or so depending on the fight. I have tried different stat priorities and talents but I still feel like even when I play near perfectly I cant compete with the other classes.

    Does anyone else feel this way?
    Gear. You need more to do big numbers. But if you are only doing 145k I assume there are other issues. Without some logs and an armory link, not much we can do.

    Make a post here if you want some help. http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...-Fix-My-DK-DPS


    Also mega, looking up your logs you would be middle of the pack most fights in my 25 man.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by dkdk View Post
    Gear. You need more to do big numbers. But if you are only doing 145k I assume there are other issues. Without some logs and an armory link, not much we can do.

    Make a post here if you want some help. http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...-Fix-My-DK-DPS


    Also mega, looking up your logs you would be middle of the pack most fights in my 25 man.
    Perhaps I would be middle of the pack, but I do believe I still play well. Ranked pretty good on some fights, 11th on spoils yesterday. But yes, what you're saying is true, my teammates are under-performing. What's your guild name by the way? Would be interesting to have a look at how the classes in your guild vs. mine are performing. Going to need to squeeze the dps output for Thok.

  6. #6
    Not to be mean but your performance on your raids has little to no relevance on how frost performs overall.

    You more or less need the Galakras and Thok trinkets for frost to show it's full potential. Even then DW takes the cake. If you're dead set on 2h, well, I'd go UH before getting those trinkets.

  7. #7
    While we get a considerable dps jump from the combination of cdr/amp/2set/4set its naive to assume we are the only ones to get so big dps pushes.

    We won't be at the top on high gear same skill level compared to classes like warlocks or mages.
    Currently the numbers show mainly which classes got the most gear in the starting weeks, also no distinction between flex, normal and heroic on raidbots and partly false boss tracking is messing overall numbers up.
    For example protectors, in flex you can just burst them into oblivion, but frost burst is nothing compared to an affliction lock who can burst for like 2 million dps. If the encounter dies after like 2 minutes if not even earlier you got a warlock with other 500k dps and a dk with like 350k, but if this fight lasted like 5 minutes or even longer the affliction might be down to 350k and the dk still doing 300k because a frost dk doesn't burst but has high sustained dmg.
    Also are you tanking all 3 bosses together or are you tanking one outside the camp? The second version damages our dps way more than the warlocks who can multidot anyway.

    Were we end up dps wise is still to wait for as all players have to be geared and scale differently with it. Also boss tactics matter on that part and more efficient ways of bruning bosses will come up in the next weeks and months.

    For performing low on your raid you have to check on the following:

    Are you equally geared to the ones you compete with?
    Is the boss fight in question better suited for someone tactic/mechanic wise?
    Are the final dps on the boss of comparable worth ranking wise?

    If your raidmembers get no rankings but you, aside now from gear or excpetionla luck, you are likely to perform better. If its the other way around, you're doing it wrong.
    None of both scenarios shows the strength of their class, but the strength of the player.
    http://www.wow-heroes.com/character/eu/Azshara/raikh/

    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...Raikh/advanced

    Humans love to hate. They neither have to think nor to understand to hate something or someone and still they find a cause and solution for their problems.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by MegaKeeperMan View Post
    Perhaps I would be middle of the pack, but I do believe I still play well. Ranked pretty good on some fights, 11th on spoils yesterday. But yes, what you're saying is true, my teammates are under-performing. What's your guild name by the way? Would be interesting to have a look at how the classes in your guild vs. mine are performing. Going to need to squeeze the dps output for Thok.
    Here is our log from our first night last week. I wasn't in there but our other frost dk was.

    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-bi8lhq937h3jem8f/

    By no means am I saying that you are performing poorly, you beat me on most of the fights, but I also haven't had any luck on trinkets yet and just got a weapon on Thursday.

  9. #9
    Few things to do well very early, get 2 T16, get Galakras (even Flex version is ok to start with), get a weapon update, spec DW frost.
    Now if u ever play with competent people u'll never see the light of top 3 except some rare exception.
    Am working on Klaxxi HC and i can tell you that even though we do fine we get annihilated by most casters and ferals/wars easily.

    Now don't get me wrong, we do fine because otherwise i wouldn't have a spot and be geared as i am, but i bring other things such as grips (yes they are imba for progress), a rez, amz and "good" dps overall. People laugh about those a lot but they guarantee you a spot.

    Don't loose faith and use the fix my dps thread if needed.

  10. #10
    @op 2-hand is still really good, you just need to optimize your gear askmrrobot.com is pretty close to optimizing gear. without a link i cant say why you'd only be pulling that little dps witht that ilevel you should be much higher.

    @mega, you're playing very well for not having the amp trinket nor any tier 16 gear. while they are correct about your fellow guildies, most could have been a bit nicer about how they said it. with that being said if your happy where you are great and stay and help them learn to max dps better, but you're playing at a much higher caliber, and as such could compete in a much more progressed guild. only then will you be middle of the pack lol

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by damescool View Post
    @op 2-hand is still really good, you just need to optimize your gear askmrrobot.com is pretty close to optimizing gear. without a link i cant say why you'd only be pulling that little dps witht that ilevel you should be much higher.
    MrRobot is horrendously bad for dk's this tier, stat prioreties flip flop all over depending on what you have so it's not something that should be relied upon too heavily. Almost each item I get now I re-sim my toon to see what I should go for, it keeps flipping between crit and haste due to my high mastery. Though if you look at MrRobot for me, he calls for vast amounts of crit when it's really not needed.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Maxweii View Post
    MrRobot is horrendously bad for dk's this tier, stat prioreties flip flop all over depending on what you have so it's not something that should be relied upon too heavily. Almost each item I get now I re-sim my toon to see what I should go for, it keeps flipping between crit and haste due to my high mastery. Though if you look at MrRobot for me, he calls for vast amounts of crit when it's really not needed.
    i should of stated to sim yourself get the stat weights and put them into askmrrobot. its not a science, but i think for him it should really help, if he's only pulling 150k. sort of like telling dks starting out to use clc-dk even thou its not best for max dps dks, but it helps new ones or those having problems with their priority.

  13. #13
    Having an addon play the game for you doesn't help you learn anything.

  14. #14
    High Overlord Lamperouqe's Avatar
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    We can definitely perform with the help of some rng (2p bonus >_< that's probably as close to topping single target I will get this tier), but generally we shouldn't be topping dps or anything. DW gets a powerspike with thoks and 2p, and another one with galakras trinket and 4p, which are pretty core for DW dps. There are a few fights that DW excels on which include cleave and rapid target switching, but on pure single target you shouldn't be expecting to be up there near the top in a raid with equally skilled and geared players. All that said, we are a decent, middle of the pack class bringing mostly grips to the raid with AMZ being situational but useful at times.

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