Subtlety pve?

[Sesshou]

Sub can technically use slow weapons with a hemo build.

Except there is absolutely no bonus to a hemo build unlike back in DS, so I don't see why that would ever be recommended.

[Fluorescent0]

Except there is absolutely no bonus to a hemo build unlike back in DS, so I don't see why that would ever be recommended.

High disparity in itemlevel between the weapons.

[Sesshou]

High disparity in itemlevel between the weapons.

Is that actually relevant? I didn't see anything Kilj said that would indicate it is.

Besides, he didn't say a specific weapon, just its favoring slow which is a general statement and should not be true. Obviously there are certain specific cases with specific weapon sets.

[Deleted]

Playing sub atm and going with combat os as soon as i get fists. It seems that some fights are awful as sub like Protectors hc, Sha of pride hc etc... But fights like norushen im going to top :3

[Chancie]

I would really appreciate some feedback on my sub kill of Iron Juggernaut.

Our tanks positioned the boss badly so I got knocked back a few times - please bear that in mind.

http://worldoflogs.com/reports/61aah...?s=2881&e=3296

[Deleted]

Our tanks positioned the boss badly so I got knocked back a few times - please bear that in mind.

You can Shs->Cloak->Shs all of those no matter where the boss is.

As for logs, you should definitely have more FW uptime, especially when ur abusing glyph of Vanish w/ Subterfuge, sth like 60%. Dropped Sanguinary Vein once but thats the fly time I guess.

And u could delay the sixth ShD cos of incoming trinket proc.

Also I feel like blowing SB and ShD earlier on pull due to Renataki proc is better than waiting for FW drop, but thats 100% my personal opinion, nothing relevant.

[Deleted]

Without 4p15, you shouldn't use Shadow Blades and Shadow Dance together. It will also help you using all your Sinapse Springs (only 5 uses for a 6+ min fight).
You forget to use Preparation a second time.

I got knocked back a few times

Shadow steps the first and third knockback, and cloak the second.

[mongoose6]

After muckin' about a bit, I'm seeing eviserates during FW while SV is applied doing more damage per cast than rupture. Rupture again overtakes Evis outside of FW which makes me think that using rupture at all during the first 50 seconds of the fight is a waste of combo points (assuming you have hemo glyphed). Basically if you have five CP's during FW, Evis>Rupture. Outside of FW, Rupture>Evis if rupture isn't present. Is this right? Is there something I'm missing here?

[T18Z]

Without 4p15, you shouldn't use Shadow Blades and Shadow Dance together. It will also help you using all your Sinapse Springs (only 5 uses for a 6+ min fight).
You forget to use Preparation a second time.


Shadow steps the first and third knockback, and cloak the second.

Shadowcraft states that you should use shadow blades in conjunction with shadow dance, regardless of 4p tier 15 or not, it's a damage increase to do so. Using shadowblades without find weakness results in a 7k loss, using only on find weakness results in a 3k loss, in comparison to using SB with ShD.

The above is specific to my character.

[timbo117]

i got softfoots last resort warforged last night and decided to go sub from mut ( of course my first wep drop from soO isnt a dagger -.-) and tryed it out and its amazing i currently have 35k agi didnt even have to change any of my reforges or gems and im pulling heaps more loving the 1 mill eviscerates ^.^

[kilj]

So slow weapon mh?

[intrinsc]

So slow weapon mh?

If you don't want to use Backstab ever, then sure.

[Enhshamanlol]

So slow weapon mh?

i mean. you could but really its not that great. you can still use ambush in shadowdance tho but still ehhhhhhh

[Sesshou]

So slow weapon mh?

What potential gain do you see from a slow mh? If hemo somehow actually beats out backstab, you are still better off with fast weapons for more poison procs. I seriously doubt hemo (aside from when you gain dps from the dot) out does backstab though so... Are you talking about some specific case of a large ilvl gap and just not mentioning it?

[kilj]

Oh no I already am using double dagger..... http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...Kakashi/simple

Just srsly getting confused with shadowcraft and people being like.... Ya I use fist mh... and stuff

[Deleted]

Could anyone tell me if my gear would be sufficient for rolling sub? I am currently assa and I am want to try something new after the recent nerf. -.-

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...u%C3%A8/simple

[intrinsc]

Out of the top 5 ranked rogues in wowprogress's simDPS rankings, only one is using a slow OFF HAND, not a mainhand. Backstab is still best. Maybe Dryyan or Ahdehl can chime in on why Dryyan is sporting a sword on the off hand.

[Deleted]

Most likely because his offhand is higher ilvl than his dagger equivalent, i have a 574 and a 553 OH, 574 is a mace and 553 a dagger but the 574 is better to use

[Warstar]

Outside of combat the OH weapon for rogues is pretty much a glorified stat stick which is why the sha touched weapons were so good for so long because of that legendary agi gem in them. The actual dps gain from the weapon attack itself is pretty small since it's divided in half. Mut is stuck with 2 daggers, combat can use either cause their just cool like that but sub seems that as long as you have a good dagger for back stabbing that whatever your higher ilv oh would be the higher dps gain since you probably gain more from the bonus stats on it than anything else you gain from it. Even poison proc damage will be increased because of your higher stats. I'm guessing that the grossly inflated stats from a 553 slow weapon would out weigh the poison proc amount from a 522 dagger.

Also poison damage for a sub/combat rogue isn't nearly as important as it is for assassination so the over all damage increase will most likely be higher than a few more poison applications. Both combat and sub are predominately physical damage dealers compared to assassinations predominately poison damage.

[Coldkil]

A sub rogue with a MH dagger and a slow OH just looks horrible

Anyway i assume the slow offhand is used simply because provides the best damage (maybe he had an underpar oh).