Thread: SoO LFR nerfed.

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  1. #21
    Mechagnome
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    IMO, they should've also nerfed add health by 10%, not only Nazgrim's own.
    Overall, was needed.
    Old Gods made me do it.

  2. #22
    Everyone saying its good for a casual like me, that's just silly, just because your casual doesn't mean all content needs to be a god damn face roll.
    work for something for once.

  3. #23
    I've done these fights now as all 3 roles (Prot Warrior, WW Monk, Holydin). My opinions are as follows:

    Kor'kron Dark Shaman
    Changes on Raid Finder difficulty:

    -Wavebinger Kardris' Falling Ash now deals 200,000 Fire damage (down from 999,999).
    -Foul Slimes' Foulness aura now deals 30,000 Nature damage (down from 50,000).
    -Fixed an issue where placement of Earthbreaker Haromm's Ashen Wall was not always perpendicular to the direction he's facing.
    I never had an issue with avoiding the Falling Ash. It's a giant, bright red glowing circle. Kind of hard to miss. The Ashen Wall I can see being annoying as, when I Tank, I make the effort to position things properly to make it easier for the raid. Having the Ashen Wall lined up along the outskirts of the area as opposed to running right through the middle makes the fight so much easier.

    General Nazgrim
    Changes on Raid Finder difficulty:

    -General Nazgrim's health has been reduced by 10%.
    -General Nazgrim's Ravager now hits for 200,000 damage.
    -General Nazgrim now gains 1 Rage when struck in Defensive Stance (down from 2 Rage).
    -General Nazgrim now gains 2 Rage for each target struck by Heroic Shockwave's Aftershocks (down from 3 Rage).
    -General Nazgrim now gains 2 Rage from Kor'kron Banner (down from 3 Rage).
    -Kor'kron Warshaman's Earth Shield now heals for 2% of maximum health (down from 5%).
    -Kor'kron Warshaman's Empowered Chain Heal now heals for 4% of maximum health (down from 10%).
    The health reduction helps with his Enrage timer for the LFR crowd. I've been in there and got him on the second shot (first shot was due to people standing in the only Ravager Axe flying around). I don't think it was necessary but it will make life a little easier for the LFR people. The Ravager doing less damage wasn't needed. It's a pretty obvious graphic and easy to avoid. The Rage changes will, again, help the LFR crowd as they can't seem to stop pressing buttons during his Defensive stance and have trouble doing anything but tunneling the boss. The changes to the Warshaman also weren't necessary as it is very easy to keep them interrupted from casting their heal.

    I'm not going to get all nuts over making LFR easier because, honestly, if it means I spend an hour less in there on each character (6 characters total I run with), then that's fine by me. These items never really affected me because I actually look at my screen when I play but if it helps the masses, I'm all for it.

    EDIT:
    the pulsing orbs in Nuroshen need to be more noticeable as you barely know they are there, and sha is fine.
    I have read that if they are stunned before they die, they won't drop the orbs. Is anyone able to confirm this? I keep forgetting to try it, I just soak the orb, lol.
    Last edited by Ugum; 2013-10-03 at 01:28 PM.

  4. #24
    Legendary! Evil Inside's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celticmoon View Post
    It seems a few of the bosses in SoO LFR have been nerfed. Was this the right move, or should they just of left it alone? Are you happy or angry about it?

    Kor'kron Dark Shaman
    Changes on Raid Finder difficulty:

    -Wavebinger Kardris' Falling Ash now deals 200,000 Fire damage (down from 999,999).
    -Foul Slimes' Foulness aura now deals 30,000 Nature damage (down from 50,000).
    -Fixed an issue where placement of Earthbreaker Haromm's Ashen Wall was not always perpendicular to the direction he's facing.

    General Nazgrim
    Changes on Raid Finder difficulty:

    -General Nazgrim's health has been reduced by 10%.
    -General Nazgrim's Ravager now hits for 200,000 damage.
    -General Nazgrim now gains 1 Rage when struck in Defensive Stance (down from 2 Rage).
    -General Nazgrim now gains 2 Rage for each target struck by Heroic Shockwave's Aftershocks (down from 3 Rage).
    -General Nazgrim now gains 2 Rage from Kor'kron Banner (down from 3 Rage).
    -Kor'kron Warshaman's Earth Shield now heals for 2% of maximum health (down from 5%).
    -Kor'kron Warshaman's Empowered Chain Heal now heals for 4% of maximum health (down from 10%).
    It was needed. I mean come on "Wavebinger Kardris' Falling Ash now deals 200,000 Fire damage (down from 999,999)" that is way overtuned for lfr.
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  5. #25
    Stood in the Fire Snorkles's Avatar
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    Nazgrim is just a poorly designed fight. On flex/normal (or any group who focuses adds down for that matter) you often find yourself just twiddling your thumbs for 20 seconds during defensive stances.

    Which is unfortunate given he's probably one of the more significant bosses to the player (if horde).

  6. #26
    Don't know really.... The fights are freaking easy, only reason people are dying on LFR is because they are mentally challenged and can't follow basic mechanics. I guess It will help - as much as a like things more challenging, waiting 30 minutes for tanks after each Dark Shaman attempt sucks.

  7. #27
    totally happy about those changes, i really hate having to spend too much time in lfr because surrounded of monkeys.
    every nerf is accepted in lfr.

  8. #28
    Pit Lord
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    while i can see why some people dislike the nerfs.. i think they are forgetting what the intent is. LFR is intended to be something semi quick, like an hour, MAYBE an hour and a half to complete. that includes mistakes or wipes. as it was before the nerfs the average times were much longer, and simply negated the intent.

    people with very little time to commit to a raiding guild/schedule, probably dont have the time to spend in an LFR that lasts 2-3-4 hours. with the trash, wipes, and waiting on replacements i can easily see some LFR groups spending crazy amounts of time in there. more-so then the intended short duration wings for people with limited available time.
    Quote Originally Posted by ablib View Post
    I do realize that this is an internet forum full of morons, however in real life, no one questions me, people look to me for the answer, look up to me, trust me. To have dipshits on a video game forum question me, is insulting.

  9. #29
    Titan Kelimbror's Avatar
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    To be honest, people upset about this don't understand LFR's place in the raiding dynamic. These changes are made to specifically address chaotic fight mechanics stemming from inability to properly communicate. The assumption is that communication during the fight will be nonexistent, which is a fair.

    LFR will not have ventrilo, will not be able to effectively announce when to stop DPS, when to switch, etc. Yes, we all know that there are people typing pretty much 100% of the fight, but they should be actively playing the game and not having to capslock instructions for an encounter's duration.

    There's no inherent challenge or feeling of accomplishment from wiping multiple times until your Determ is stacked high enough and you faceroll the encounter. It's just an arbitrary measure. Do I feel kinda sad that it will rapidly get easier? I think so. Does this mean I need to complain about LFR? Nope. It means I should probably find a group to run flex or normals with.
    BAD WOLF

  10. #30
    Those two WERE slightly overtuned for the typical LFR crowd, to be fair. They're "easy" to do when you can explain them to everyone in the group and have them understand their role, but having that happen in LFR--especially when half the time there appears to be a very real language barrier depending on your battle group--was a rarity. Nazgrim especially is a DPS race with qualifiers (you need to take him down before the timer, but you can't hit him in Defensive stance and you MUST take down the adds as they spawn) and in LFR DPS isn't exactly eye-popping to begin with unless there happens to be someone in there from "Normal" raids who's just after tokens for their cloak.

    For example, we spent a good 3 minutes pre-Nazgrim explaining to people that they need to prioritize adds (Shaman first) and stop all damage on Nazgrim during Defensive stance (including making sure ALL pet classes had pets set to Passive and were able to call them off at the correct time). The first defensive phase comes and half the raid is still whaling on Nazgrim like he IS the veritable loot piñata. Those of us with time to type spam the chat with various "STOP DPS" messages and eventually most people get the hint just in time for the defensive phase to end. The second defensive phase comes and again half the raid is banging their heads against his shield. We get them to focus on the adds quicker this time but there's still 5 pets nipping at his heels.

    After the inevitable wipe we ask what the hell went wrong and why didn't they listen and a few of them owned up to being awful/not listening to directions and another few didn't understand English. *sigh*

    I can understand why people think that everyone should "just learn the fight!" and that they believe these nerfs were unnecessary, but really, from my viewpoint they absolutely were given my experience with it.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Benggaul View Post
    (including making sure ALL pet classes had pets set to Passive and were able to call them off at the correct time).
    Pets and minions don't give him rage.

  12. #32
    Very happy it got nerfed, my group yesterday was a fucking nightmare. I was 2nd on dps as the tank, 80% of the dps couldn't even break 80k, had to wipe 4 times before people that weren't afking / slacking managed to kill it. Fucking afkers, I really wish they'd all die.

  13. #33
    Scarab Lord Mokoshne's Avatar
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    a few of them deserved to be nerfed because it was kind of annoying wiping for an hour on Nazgrim
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  14. #34

  15. #35
    The Nazgrim fight is frustrating, I was in a group wiping on him with 4 stacks of determination :-( Afraid when having people who don't know what to do can wipe the raid, it gets immensely difficult on LFR where you just can't control everyone. He should reflect 100% of damage in defensive stance on LFR rather then gain rage, so people are individually punished without wiping us.
    "If you look out of the window as a human being, at nature, all of nature is unconditionally and absolutely beautiful wherever it is. Whether it's a jungle. Whether it's a desert. Whether it's the Arctic wastes. Or even your own back garden. The only ugly things you will ever see when you look out of the window are things made by man." - Stephen Fry

  16. #36
    Grunt ronaldmc's Avatar
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    Personally, I believe the problem of LFR SoO is that it is too time consuming for a raid mode that is supposed to be quick and smooth (because if you have time and/or want something more challenging you have 3 other raid modes to go). Wiping is a part of the problem because it extends the time needed to finish the run. Reducing the number of trash mobs, mob healing and health pools and time consuming mechanics like having an NPC die on Galakrass that resets the fight would also help in this direction. Note that I'm not asking for these to be done, only pointing out some possible adjustment points to the problem I see.

  17. #37
    I don't know. Don't really care either way.

    I can say that every time I've gotten to the shaman in lfr, it's been nothing but a clusterfuck of the highest order. Last nights group, with a stack of determination, actually hit the enrage timer. There were about 24 folks alive at that point.
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  18. #38
    Flex Wing 2, most commonly heard things: "Man, this is much better than LFR." "Yeah, people listen or they get booted."

    LFR Wing 2, most commonly heard things: "GET OUT OF THE FIRE" "STOP STANDING IN BAD" "GET OFF NAZGRIM, HE'S IN DEFENSIVE STANCE"
    Garrosh: "LOK'TAR! HAVE A HAMBURGER."


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  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Evil Inside View Post
    It was needed. I mean come on "Wavebinger Kardris' Falling Ash now deals 200,000 Fire damage (down from 999,999)" that is way overtuned for lfr.
    It's a giant red circle with extremely clear and noticeable graphics that you have like 30 seconds to move out of. That's just another step in the direction of "stand in whatever you want and the 3-4 healers that aren't afk/dps spec will just heal you through it".

    IMO instead of nerfing LFR they should make sure people have an incentive to learn:
    -Make PG silver a requirement (hint: it's extremely easy)
    -Only characters that have passed the character audit can join (everything gemmed/enchanted, even with cheap gems/enchants)
    -Allow reports for bad play/trolling/afk that actually have a meaningful impact. You were reported by 50 people for afk last week? Too bad, you get a week long ban from all random matchmaking tools. Next time it will be more.
    -If you want to go extreme limit loot to only decent performers. You did less than 2% of the groups damage on that boss or the adds that needed to die? Just pressing a button to join LFR should not qualify you for loot just because you are a special snowflake (it could be disabled/tweaked for fights with very specific mechanics like norushen or tanks/healers of course)

    A game where you are guaranteed to win is not a game.
    Last edited by honj90; 2013-10-03 at 02:30 PM.

  20. #40
    Needed.


    I personally hate LFR, but if you do LFR (and I do) it is very hard to stop someone from being a moron...and I've found a lot of time that moron is usually very highly geared.

    I've seen heroic SOO geared rogues do nothing but attack General the whole time including causing tons of Ravagers flying around. One wipe was 7 of them....it tore the raid a new one.

    He was actively getting the whole raid killed...you shouldn't be able to do that in LFR so easily.

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