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  1. #161
    I don't think the raiding has changed much, I personally always found raiding kinda easy from my POV as a healer. 5 Mans are WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY easier now. Back in TBC unless you completely outgeared the instance, to complete a 5 man you had to cc multiple mobs in each pull and have a kill order, for example one mob sheeped, one mob hunter trapped, another mob sapped then you would kill skull first and then X or something along those lines. Now when you do a 5 man its just the tank runs in collects the mobs and everyone aoe's them down and you move on. BUT in saying that, I honestly think if people took their nostalgia out of the picture they would not be able to put up with having to co-ordinate CC and proper kill orders just to complete every single trash pull and would just cry for nerfs so its easy like it is now.

    The worst part of the game in MoP is the way gearing up works.

    In TBC you could farm heroic dungeons and get gear from there, then also buy a tonne of gear with badges (now points) and be easily ready to raid entry level raids such as kara and whatever. In MoP to gear you had to go out and complete dailys for over 9000 different factions for THE REST OF YOUR LIFE in order to unlock the ability to use he same points (which you also had to farm up ontop of the other farming) in order to buy any gear of the entry level gear.

    NOTE: In Wrath and Cata I had a max level of every class and all of them had atleast one spec that was in raid gear, most of which also had a raid geared offspec. In MoP I have 2 level 90s, one is in pre throne of thunder gear, and blues for offspec, the other is in blue pvp gear. All because the way the gear was gated really put me off the game.

    There is probably some other things I intended to talk about but it's now 1:30am and I need to goto sleep as I will be getting up for work in a few hours and im already struggling to keep my eyes open. Goodnight

  2. #162
    Quote Originally Posted by wych View Post
    Blizzard themselves said that more people now are raiding than ever, and the majority of subs lost came from China
    Yeah more people are raiding because LFR which i don't consider raiding. half the ppl are either afk or doing no dmg while 2-4 ppl pull retarded amounts of dmg and carry the raid.

  3. #163
    Sure i don't have full MoP raiding experience and i can without a doubt say after i did the first raid i could give 2 shits about raiding in MoP it sucks. i'd rather do LFR real quick see the encounter and be on my way.
    Plays games on easiest setting, says MoP PvE is a joke. Don't get me wrong, none of it is OMGWTFBBQ difficult, barring fights a handful of fights, but a lot of it is considerably more difficult than raids in the past. The degree of personal responsiblity in a raid has skyrocketed, this being especially apparent in 10mans. 25mans can't be compared to 10mans, just like how you can't use LFR as a measure of difficulty, considering some of the boss abilities are just flat out removed, as it's not designed to be very hard at all.

  4. #164
    High Overlord
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    Raiding is harder today than in TBC but people are a lot better too.

  5. #165
    Quote Originally Posted by Kreeshak View Post
    I was having a night of nostalgia and was stalking wow progress to see if any of the people I used to raid with daily still played.

    What impressed me is the world ranking we were getting back then compared to the ranking we get now.
    More specifically we were top1600 worldwide in TBC as opposed to top6000 now.

    The question that popped up immediately was did the game actually become harder after all these years? And that what I'd like to discuss.

    For your own agenda, what ranks did you get in TBC as opposed to nowadays?
    My guild has been about the same except we were 25 then.
    Always around the 400 mark NA no idea world rank.
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  6. #166
    You can't even compare because they are basically two different things, Some things are harder some things a easier. The games has evolved, stop comparing apples to oranges and move on.

  7. #167
    TBC had more to do than just raiding and dailies as well. Faction grinding, attunements. Heroic instance farming. Remember too that some BiS gear could be found in heroic dungeons as well. So there were less raiders as well due to additional stuff to do and due to lack of raiding options. You still need to compare the Nerf schedules as well. They nerfed heroics hard early on in TBC and sunwell was arguably one of the hardest raids ever pre Nerf.

    In a nutshell, lack of raid options and increased out of raid content really bring down the raid numbers. Plus I'm sure the attunements and gearing through the harder heroics in TBC added to that as well when it came to gearing for raids

  8. #168
    Stood in the Fire
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    Quote Originally Posted by Airwaves View Post
    It got harder in wrath. Heroic LK is harder then anything in BC. And please don't count broken bosses. The game is ALOT harder then it ever was.
    It got WAY easier in Wrath. . . All but maybe 3 bosses were easy. Yogg+0 was probably harder than anything in TBC; I would hesitate to say Heroic Lich King because a great part of the perceived difficulty was the huge gear check.

    The game is easier than ever before.

  9. #169
    Only raiding has gotten harder, anything else has gotten more convient, faster and easiere.

    Bad game design when the only thing to challenge you with are few things inn the entire game imo.

    Yes, there exsist terrible grinds inn the game just as back then, but that can't really be said is challenging kinda.
    One reason for WoW decline I often hear is that its an old game and naturally people get bored with it. But TV is much older and people still watch that. Surely if a thing you once enjoyed keept staying fun, you would still use it?

  10. #170
    Pandaren Monk Mush's Avatar
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    People are seriously getting difficult and overtuned/broken confused.

  11. #171
    I am Murloc! ringpriest's Avatar
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    As others have pointed out, raid bosses on non-easy modes are tactically more difficult, although they tend to lack the raw hitting power of older raid bosses. Everything else is much easier.

  12. #172
    Mechagnome Raidboss's Avatar
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    Let's see...

    Attunments....gone
    Requiring CC....gone
    Tanks worrying about threat....gone
    Resist gear....gone

    Just to name a few reasons why things are easier

  13. #173
    The game has gotten much easier since TBC, too easy IMO. The only part where you could debate it is with heroic modes, everything else tho is a lot easier tho IMO.

  14. #174
    Epic! Felarion's Avatar
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    In terms of raids i think mop is harder than tbc,especially mechanic wise. If we assume that tbc raids are on level of today heroic content.

    However tbc was also brutal in any other activity such as 5 mans,accesability to raiding,leveling etc, so if we talking about game as a whole then tbc is harder.

  15. #175
    Mechagnome
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    Quote Originally Posted by lazzy View Post
    yeah more people are raiding because lfr which i don't consider raiding. Half the ppl are either afk or doing no dmg while 2-4 ppl pull retarded amounts of dmg and carry the raid.
    hahahah! Yes!

    Quote Originally Posted by Raidbozz View Post
    Let's see...

    Attunments....gone
    Requiring CC....gone
    Tanks worrying about threat....gone
    Resist gear....gone

    Just to name a few reasons why things are easier

    Kiting gone (ubrs)
    slows gone
    snares gone

    all that's left is raids. The rest is meaningless snorefest grind because it's so easy.
    Hell, healing in elemental ftw

  16. #176
    Stood in the Fire Florescent Purple's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by urasim View Post
    The game has gotten much, much easier. Going from hour-long-wipe-fest heroic 5 mans in BC, to 15 minute roll-your-face-on-keyboard-easy heroic 5 mans in the last 3 expansions. Normal raids in BC were like heroic raids nowadays.

    Not saying that getting easier is worse for the the game or anyone playing it.

    I don't really know what I ranked world wide, but server I was always number one by a large margin.
    Wrong, try comparing the tactics now to TBC and tell me the same thing. It's a load of shit. Players have gotten better, guilds have recruited better players, took the game more seriously & raided a shit ton more hours than back in TBC. Use your brain. Method have probably spent more hours on Lei Shen HC progression in thoughs few days than you probably have raided this entire expansion.
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  17. #177
    Herald of the Titans Lord Pebbleton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nemesiz View Post
    Short answer, yes. Long answer, no.
    Which is wrong, because "yes" has one more letter compared to "no".

  18. #178
    Quote Originally Posted by chrisisvacant View Post
    Hydross, Shahrazz, and maybe A'lar if your tanks were otherwise squishy.
    Also for Flame tanks on Illidan.

    Sunwell was rather hard raid, but highly dependent on raid composition.

    But heroic raid are much harder now imo.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Oncereborn View Post
    In TBC you could farm heroic dungeons and get gear from there, then also buy a tonne of gear with badges (now points) and be easily ready to raid entry level raids such as kara and whatever. In MoP to gear you had to go out and complete dailys for over 9000 different factions for THE REST OF YOUR LIFE in order to unlock the ability to use he same points (which you also had to farm up ontop of the other farming) in order to buy any gear of the entry level gear.
    To even ACCESS heroic dungeons in TBC you had to be revered with specific faction. By running normal over.. and over.. and over.

  19. #179
    Quote Originally Posted by Raidbozz View Post
    Let's see...

    Attunments....gone
    Requiring CC....gone
    Tanks worrying about threat....gone
    Resist gear....gone

    Just to name a few reasons why things are easier
    As a tank back in the days i never ever worried about threat, except for healers maybe.
    I can see what you see not - vision milky then eyes rot. When you turn, they will be gone - whispering their hidden song...

  20. #180
    Old God adam86shadow's Avatar
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    I would say the game became incredibly easier

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