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  1. #141
    I appreciate this guide, as well as this entire forum. Although I don't contribute much, I would appreciate a sticky to this excellent thread.

    Along w/Kuni's thread, they have both helped this former holy priest learn (albeit not yet master) frost mage ... a class and character that I am thoroughly enjoying. /cheers

  2. #142
    How far behind does the haste build fall on single target fights in SoO? Is it a huge difference or very slight? Is the haste build a lot better on cleave fights?

  3. #143
    Warchief Akraen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gambitpma View Post
    How far behind does the haste build fall on single target fights in SoO? Is it a huge difference or very slight? Is the haste build a lot better on cleave fights?
    Barely noticeable if you are good with bomb uptime and snapshotting.

    I honestly perform significantly better single target with 19k haste and 9k mastery than when I try mix or mastery but I credit that to the other benefits of haste: stutter cast movement, increased Windows of opportunity, more casts within proc windows, etc.

  4. #144
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    Quick question, should I use an ice lance without FoF when I have 5 icicles stored up?

  5. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by Qaniki View Post
    Quick question, should I use an ice lance without FoF when I have 5 icicles stored up?
    Icicles will fire automatically. There is no need to maintain them.

  6. #146
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    Please help make that common knowledge. It is potentially the most widespread and damaging unknown to so many mages out there.

    Only time to ever throw an ice lance without FoF is if you are moving and have nothing else to spend a GCD on. Even refresh a bomb with a high duration before using it. Even fire blast before it. Hell even arcane explosion before it. Hell even use a vanity item before it.

  7. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by Akraen View Post
    Only time to ever throw an ice lance without FoF is if you are moving and have nothing else to spend a GCD on. Even refresh a bomb with a high duration before using it. Even fire blast before it. Hell even arcane explosion before it. Hell even use a vanity item before it.
    Wouldn't it be also beneficial to unload them regardless is FoF procced or not in situations where mob is just about to die and there is no close mob you would attack in next 30sec? Just no to waste 5 stored Icicles that will expire if nothing is soon attacked.

  8. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mauro View Post
    Wouldn't it be also beneficial to unload them regardless is FoF procced or not in situations where mob is just about to die and there is no close mob you would attack in next 30sec? Just no to waste 5 stored Icicles that will expire if nothing is soon attacked.
    Yes, but when does that happen? Maybe my mind is just on heroics.

    You can fire one at Garrosh as he sucks you into another realm and that is effective DPS. I just think people who still don't understand icicles aren't ready for that level of nuance.

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by Mauro View Post
    Wouldn't it be also beneficial to unload them regardless is FoF procced or not in situations where mob is just about to die and there is no close mob you would attack in next 30sec? Just no to waste 5 stored Icicles that will expire if nothing is soon attacked.
    I don't think min/maxing really applies to trash mobs. There is always something you can do that is more beneficial than worrying about your icicles.

    Yes, but when does that happen? Maybe my mind is just on heroics.
    Immerseus is the only fight I can think of where adds die and you could be stuck holding icicles with nothing to do. You are going to have a lot of downtime on this fight, I don't think it will make a noticable difference to fire off your icicles.

  10. #150
    Warchief Akraen's Avatar
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    I don't generate icicles on transitions on heroic Immerseus.

    I run around putting NT on them and the phase ends. It is such a stupid fight.

  11. #151
    Noob here,
    However, I read this thread and others everyday now looking for new posts to study and hopefully learn from. My guilds casual 10 man raid composition does not include spell haste. "that's tight". I am trying to do a haste build as much as possible and ideally I will have a 2nd mastery gear set for single bosses or appropriate fights.

    My Question, with the haste stacking build..we want controlled burst haste as much as possible. The value of Lifeblood from herbing on haste build...in conjunction with TW/meta/ect...the stacked haste value. I know int is primary, but most of my gemming is pure haste or pure mastery gems anyways. Value to change profession back to herbing is my real question lol, as I dropped that for another awhile ago. This also might give me more flexibility for gemming.

    Tyvm for this guide Akraen, it is not only helping me but the rest of our guild raid team get better or at least pay more attention to maximizing results. Yeah, nobody knew about snapshotting and now I have other classes trying out some of this stuff. Casually.

  12. #152
    Quote Originally Posted by Keidene View Post
    Noob here,
    However, I read this thread and others everyday now looking for new posts to study and hopefully learn from. My guilds casual 10 man raid composition does not include spell haste. "that's tight". I am trying to do a haste build as much as possible and ideally I will have a 2nd mastery gear set for single bosses or appropriate fights.

    My Question, with the haste stacking build..we want controlled burst haste as much as possible. The value of Lifeblood from herbing on haste build...in conjunction with TW/meta/ect...the stacked haste value. I know int is primary, but most of my gemming is pure haste or pure mastery gems anyways. Value to change profession back to herbing is my real question lol, as I dropped that for another awhile ago. This also might give me more flexibility for gemming.

    Tyvm for this guide Akraen, it is not only helping me but the rest of our guild raid team get better or at least pay more attention to maximizing results. Yeah, nobody knew about snapshotting and now I have other classes trying out some of this stuff. Casually.
    The value of the haste is so "low" that it isn't even close to the int values of other respective profs. Now say you have mining or skinning than lifeblood could and probably is worth it over those two, but the 320int bonus's are worth their weight. Icy-Viens has a decent view on it, but the int gains are still tops.

    As to in terms of figuring your spell haste issues perhaps have a hunter, if you have one, get a sporebat? It's quite possible that buff is needed elsewhere but if it isn't it's quite possible it hasn't been noticed.

    Welcome to the mage forums btw!
    Daft Punk Forever!

  13. #153
    Quote Originally Posted by arizonapriest93 View Post
    As to in terms of figuring your spell haste issues perhaps have a hunter, if you have one, get a sporebat? It's quite possible that buff is needed elsewhere but if it isn't it's quite possible it hasn't been noticed.
    http://www.wowhead.com/guide=1100/#buffs-spell-haste -- Are you certain you can't get spell haste somewhere in your comp?

  14. #154
    The amount of errors and misguiding in this guide is astonishing

  15. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by Magemaer View Post
    The amount of errors and misguiding in this guide is astonishing
    I think you'll contribute a lot more by pointing them out rather than just bitching about it.

  16. #156
    Warchief Akraen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magemaer View Post
    The amount of errors and misguiding in this guide is astonishing
    You could point out an example and be collaborative. If I am wrong about something I would like to change it.

    That said this is a visualization of data that is entirely accurate. If your own interpretations of said data varies, great, but it doesn't detract from the post and there are examples galore of each build in the top 10 ranks of each fight.

  17. #157
    Quote Originally Posted by Magemaer View Post
    The amount of errors and misguiding in this guide is astonishing
    Looking through your previous posts you come across as a bitter twisted individual in need of trolling through forums, if you cannot state what is wrong with the well written guide gtfo.
    Quote Originally Posted by Equim View Post
    I really don't see anything wrong with playing what you enjoy. Be it Frost, Fire, Arcane or Hello Kitty Island Adventure.

  18. #158
    @ Fahrenheit451
    No Sir,
    None available in the current comp, not the raid lead, just a lowly grunt. Only avail when we have a sub come in.
    I have however made a macro of your link, to be used at appropriate times.
    Like after multiple wipes, lol.
    I currently try and keep my comments as subtle as possible
    " It sure would be nice to have some Spell Haste"
    or
    "Hunters are so OP"
    Incidentally, on Sha, I reallocated my existing haste even further gambling on the gift and it panned out.
    Probably the only fight I will do that on.

  19. #159
    Impressive guide. Thank you Akraen.

    I must admit I have just read the basiscs. For my skill level and time constraints the advanced sections is overkill.

    I have been playing Arcane since the start of 5.4. Going by the overall consensus of the community. However RoP and the movement constraints involved have slowly been eating at me. Up until last reset where my super casual raid group reached Thok. Midway through the raid night I finally had enough and switched to Frost. What a revalation. It felt like a whole new game. As Arcane any kind of movement was a frustration and it was like I was holding my breath during nuke/cooldown phases. As Frost I didnt care and it was a whole new level of freedom.

    On average my DPS was about 200k on Thok that night with an ilvl of 545 (4 set T15). With a family, house, garden and job my time is very limited and my only pratice is reading this excellent forum every day and live training on raids. This combined with Thok was my first time playing frost in an raid enviroment, I´m satisfied with my DPS. However I´m sure its no where near what others can perfrom with the same ilvl.

    Well long story short. I like the option to have 2 working specs (Arcane/Frost) and would like to stick with the Arcane stat priority of: Haste 9762 - Mastery - Haste - Crit.

    But I´m a little curious to know how much DPS I´m loosing in theory by not going Hybrid or full haste?
    Last edited by Silentbob78; 2013-10-24 at 10:17 AM.

  20. #160
    Warchief Akraen's Avatar
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    Depends on the fight. You'll notice a significant gain on multitarget fights the more haste you stack. Just think about it this way: the more gcds you spend on bombs, the better haste is compared to mastery.

    If you love the freedom and speed, go full haste.

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