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  1. #161
    Gameplay-wise, I'm fairly satisfied.
    But I would like more light'ish gear. Ornaments and such is good, but I think the color is a bit drab for a knight of the light.
    More silver and bright gold. I want to take a look at a piece and instantly recognize it as paladin gear, and it would suit previous expansion pieces better, making transmogrification better.
    Mother pus bucket!

  2. #162
    Would love a rework of Holy Power, make it more engaging and not just a finisher. Possibly the use of buffs like Inquisition style or basing if off the monk chi concept.

  3. #163
    Prot:

    Return of the spellpower plate tanking!
    Gosh, TBC was sooo much fun! Made us uniqie and just because we were considered "subpar" to other tanks made me work even harder to prove that we can do the job. And I succeeded!

    Also f*ck vengeance, really. Or just remove the multi-target diminishing returns, it's so boring...
    Dunno why, but I find the current Prot gameplay model very clumsy and boring. I remember my Prot warrior gameplay in WotlK - damn, that was some heavy button mashing and it felt so fun, mobile and rewarding. And at least in Karazhan Holy Wrath felt as an useful ability due to all the undead trash. Now it's boring, boring, boring... We just don't have any fun abilities in this expansion. This is one of the reasons I stick with Holy Prism, even if it is subpar on some fights - it is just SO MUCH FUN. But everything else is boring as hell:

    -Crusader Strike/Hammer of the Righteous -> Boring, just applying debuffs and that's all.
    -Holy Wrath - boring on bosses; on trash - not only it does pathetic damage, but there are no occasions where you can use its stun even...
    -Hammer of Wrath -> boring...At least make it to generate H.Power like it does for ret. Currently it's a boring version of execute...
    -Consecration -> Iconic ability, true, but still...
    -Aveng.Shield -> The only other fun spell and my personal favorite. But when they removed the GC procs from active abilities and tied them to dodge, they just removed any portion of interactivity and fun from those spells.... Still, an awesome spell - cool looks, cool damage, interesting effects, tied to a proc, etc.

    What the spec lacks is some interactivity and connection between the different skills, that's my opinion. And no, Bastion of Glory is NOT fun...

    P.S. BRING DIVINE INTERVENTION BACK!!!
    Seriously, I just don't get why Blizzard have to remove the fun spells from the game. Was it game-breaking? No. Was it doing any harm or imbalances? No. Dafuck then...!
    Last edited by Ruak; 2013-11-05 at 03:09 PM.

  4. #164
    Honestly some of the ideas on this are waaaaaaaaay out of control. Lol explains why blizz takes what we say with a grain of salt. I will say that ret absolutely and indefinitly need a gap closer. Obviously it has to be unique for blizz to agree, yet druids have disengage now and shadow step. I bet ret could have its own version of heroic leap and no one complain about it being a copy. But please any instant gap closer would be nice. I know that with freedom it would be op but what's the difference? Charge has a one sec stun at the end of it not to mention warriors can slow for 8 sec as well so no need for freedom on a warrior. I think we could still have clemancy and emancipation with one gap closer. Safeguard and bladstorm break roots and you can rocket boots with bladestorm too. C'mon blizz I say its time for ret to have more up time!

  5. #165
    Quote Originally Posted by Rennegadelawlz View Post
    Honestly some of the ideas on this are waaaaaaaaay out of control. Lol explains why blizz takes what we say with a grain of salt. I will say that ret absolutely and indefinitly need a gap closer. Obviously it has to be unique for blizz to agree, yet druids have disengage now and shadow step. I bet ret could have its own version of heroic leap and no one complain about it being a copy. But please any instant gap closer would be nice. I know that with freedom it would be op but what's the difference? Charge has a one sec stun at the end of it not to mention warriors can slow for 8 sec as well so no need for freedom on a warrior. I think we could still have clemancy and emancipation with one gap closer. Safeguard and bladstorm break roots and you can rocket boots with bladestorm too. C'mon blizz I say its time for ret to have more up time!
    Yeah, I really don't think they will give us a charge type of gap closer, but I agree that some sort of friendly or enemy displacement ability is sorely needed. They are already looking at giving us divine intervention back, as they have mentioned in some blue posts, and I can easily see that being turned into some sort of mobility option.

    I would also love to see divine intervention be turned into a friendly push-back, basically, it would allow you to grab a healer or caster teammate, and fling them 20-30 yards away in the direction you are facing, thus putting them in a more strategic position. Some other options I have mentioned before are: void shift with bodies instead of health bars, or an altar of judgement that can summon enemy targets to itself to face prosecution...

  6. #166
    The Lightbringer nightfalls's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rennegadelawlz View Post
    Honestly some of the ideas on this are waaaaaaaaay out of control. Lol explains why blizz takes what we say with a grain of salt.
    Examples of this:

    1) "BRING DIVINE INTERVENTION BACK PLZZZZZZZZZ!"
    2) Make Prot 9-6-9 again
    3) Make Holy "tank only" healers again
    4) Buff Ret by 80% (some version of "make X ability a one-hit nuke")
    5) Change the Paladin class color (seriously?!)

  7. #167
    Scarab Lord anaxie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by voidspark View Post
    Examples of this:

    1) "BRING DIVINE INTERVENTION BACK PLZZZZZZZZZ!"
    2) Make Prot 9-6-9 again
    3) Make Holy "tank only" healers again
    4) Buff Ret by 80% (some version of "make X ability a one-hit nuke")
    5) Change the Paladin class color (seriously?!)
    Ya it's dumb. Honestly for dps the only thing ret really needs is the Holy proc TV's baseline so CS actually does something meaninful and TV feels like a powerful finisher. If we have to trade off Seal damage entirely and fold Censure into Judgement so be it.

    Seals need another overhaul anyhow.

    Besides that they shouldn't touch a fucking thing all stats ratings are finally viable and ret actually has decent scaling for once.

    DS should become spinning crane kick 2.0 though. Fuck our target required aoe / buildup
    Last edited by anaxie; 2013-11-05 at 11:21 PM.

  8. #168
    Epic! Freia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rennegadelawlz View Post
    Honestly some of the ideas on this are waaaaaaaaay out of control. Lol explains why blizz takes what we say with a grain of salt. I will say that ret absolutely and indefinitly need a gap closer. Obviously it has to be unique for blizz to agree, yet druids have disengage now and shadow step. I bet ret could have its own version of heroic leap and no one complain about it being a copy. But please any instant gap closer would be nice. I know that with freedom it would be op but what's the difference? Charge has a one sec stun at the end of it not to mention warriors can slow for 8 sec as well so no need for freedom on a warrior. I think we could still have clemancy and emancipation with one gap closer. Safeguard and bladstorm break roots and you can rocket boots with bladestorm too. C'mon blizz I say its time for ret to have more up time!

    Warriors are out of control right now in pvp and melee in general is starting to have way too many ways to stick on their targets. I think other classes need their up time nerfed over every melee having theirs buffed.

  9. #169
    Warriors aren't out of control because of their uptime, they're out of control because they have too much control, and can't be controlled. Paladins wouldn't be near the state Warriors are with a charge, but they might if they had a pseudo-trinket on Divine Protection and full CC immunity through wings. Oh, and if our only real defense didn't also effectively give the opposing team Shield Wall.

    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    Besides that they shouldn't touch a fucking thing all stats ratings are finally viable and ret actually has decent scaling for once.
    I respect your position, coming from Heroic raiding, but as a top raider you have to know that this is crap. We don't have flat scaling because every stat is good, we have flat scaling because every stat is shit. Every single "one stat wonder" spec has better throughput than Ret. I'd kill for the godlike crit scaling Warriors and Fire Mages have.
    Last edited by Lumineus; 2013-11-06 at 05:26 AM.
    OMG 13:37 - Then Jesus said to His disciples, "Cleave unto me, and I shall grant to thee the blessing of eternal salvation."

    And His disciples said unto Him, "Can we get Kings instead?"

  10. #170
    Bloodsail Admiral Anzaman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by voidspark View Post
    5) Change the Paladin class color (seriously?!)
    Never, it shall stay pink forever.

    And not really sure, I'm quite satisfied with Retribution and Holy at the moment, probably only thing bothering me is the insane haste scaling.
    Lovely sig & avatar made by Serryn

  11. #171
    Mechagnome ipoststuff's Avatar
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    -Change the way cooldowns work so its not "pop em all and nuke". Remove the damage and str% modifiers. Avenging wrath lets you use HoW. Holy avenger increase hopo gained. GoaK deals damage and explodes on expire.

    -Bake inquisition into wog. Doesnt change pve rotation but improve QoL in pvp.

    -Seals mattering. Like make SoJ into a real pvp seal.

    -Remove CS cooldown and half its damage.

    -For the love of GOD give us some anti fear tool. Running around 15 seconds is not fun.

  12. #172
    I really hope blizz takes some of these suggestions in consideration, i really hope that paladins will get something fresh and exciting.

  13. #173
    Quote Originally Posted by ipoststuff View Post
    -Remove CS cooldown and half its damage.
    Considering this would make VERY little difference to a character with sufficient haste, I'm not sure why the damage would have to be reduced so harshly, other than to artificially make The Art Of War seem like a good deal. It would be a huge nerf.
    OMG 13:37 - Then Jesus said to His disciples, "Cleave unto me, and I shall grant to thee the blessing of eternal salvation."

    And His disciples said unto Him, "Can we get Kings instead?"

  14. #174
    Mechagnome ipoststuff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lumineus View Post
    Considering this would make VERY little difference to a character with sufficient haste, I'm not sure why the damage would have to be reduced so harshly, other than to artificially make The Art Of War seem like a good deal. It would be a huge nerf.
    Haste has no effect on the number of empty GCDs it just makes them last shorter. It's like playing a video at x2.

  15. #175
    Quote Originally Posted by Freia View Post
    Warriors are out of control right now in pvp and melee in general is starting to have way too many ways to stick on their targets. I think other classes need their up time nerfed over every melee having theirs buffed.
    I disagree with you, warriors have the highest up time of any melee probably equal if not slightly better than rogues. Their mobility has always been the same the only difference is now arms has a root break. Anyways this isn't a warrior thread there is already a 40+ thread on that. Now giving ret some of those ideas above with the team knock back, kinda cool, a body swap displacement tool, unique, however our utility is great right now, i mean ya that that will help with peels like a mother. But at the same time rets biggest and brightest issue has always been a gap closer. Every melee has a way to instantly close the gap on a healer for an interrupt. Ret does not and that can help tons. Even so help put out damage. It doesn't need to be an 13sec cooldown, 30 sec 45sec tops. Because to counter a ret if you are gonna die is easy ofcourse HoW is ranged and so is exo and so is judge and holy prism. Exo is the only one that deals legit damage on a low cooldown. And holy prism is nice it can do heaps but doesn't crit enough. At 30sec or 45 it will make it the longest gap closer for melee in game. Counterable yes timed out yes. But all we need is one more tool to help with offensive and defensive pressure depending on how you use it. That can forever make the class competitive, even when warriors were weak they were still competitive. Because of their gap closers. Dks ferals rogues (excluding their shit damage in 5.3) and enhance doesn't seem to have any problems as well.

  16. #176
    Quote Originally Posted by ipoststuff View Post
    Haste has no effect on the number of empty GCDs it just makes them last shorter. It's like playing a video at x2.
    And you fill those GCDs with procs from auto-attack, which scales with haste. As I said, the only reason to nerf the damage is so that people still cast Exorcism. Which is a problem with Exorcism, not Crusader Strike.
    OMG 13:37 - Then Jesus said to His disciples, "Cleave unto me, and I shall grant to thee the blessing of eternal salvation."

    And His disciples said unto Him, "Can we get Kings instead?"

  17. #177
    I would like to see something a bit different with our tier sets, the majority seems to be bright, shining, crusader style, which is great and all but i wanna see some dark Gothic looking sets. Thinking along the lines of a Demon skull or Undead skull on the shoulders with a sword hilt jammed in it and some light shining from within the skull, or something like that.

    As for game play, make Inq a passive for ret, allow Polearms to be morged with swords/axes/maces, and maybe some more minor glyphs like Guardian becoming a Knight of the silver hand or some such paladinish NPC depending on spec.
    The first rule of Starfall is, You don't talk about Starfall!

  18. #178
    Quote Originally Posted by Freia View Post
    Warriors are out of control right now in pvp and melee in general is starting to have way too many ways to stick on their targets. I think other classes need their up time nerfed over every melee having theirs buffed.
    Ive had too many situations where ranged dps can outrun me as Retribution. I have to get very creative with pillar humping and healing.

    Melee need the mobility, ranged don't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tangra View Post
    Yeah, I really don't think they will give us a charge type of gap closer, but I agree that some sort of friendly or enemy displacement ability is sorely needed. They are already looking at giving us divine intervention back, as they have mentioned in some blue posts, and I can easily see that being turned into some sort of mobility option.
    Way back in TBC, Paladins came up with the idea of pulling your enemies to them. You know, instead of giving Paladin Charge, and calling it Holy Charge.

    Maybe the ability to swap places with someone while redirecting damage to you? The new Divine Intervention.

  19. #179
    The Patient Ichorum's Avatar
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    Alright, a couple of you guys have touched on the gap closers and iconic abilities that Ret is missing, in both senses of the word.

    Long Arm of the Law: Change it to be a reverse death grip that increases your movement speed by ~20% for 2 seconds, on the off chance they blink, leap, disengage away.
    Light's Hammer: Keep it, but turn it into a heroic leap like mechanic where it does holy damage and healing for 5 seconds in the impact zone. It's fluff but I've likened to renaming the ability something along the lines of "The Gavel Falls." Gavel is one of those Judge-y, attention grabbing words that Paladins have yet to put a monopoly on, and I'm tired of seeing LIGHT this and HOLY that.
    Divine Intervention: This shit was the absolute jam back in the day, being able to save two people from repair bills and keep a raid going without much of a hitch was a god send. The aforementioned idea of it being like a Safeguard or that other charge Warriors had that I don't remember, is a much cooler way to implement it than I press a button and I fall over. It would get rid of the repair bill saving factor, but I think that's worth it.

    Now, the rest of these are the dream things that I would like to see, but don't expect to.

    Auras: I'd like them to come back, but in the way Devotion Aura is now. I loved how they were once upon a time, but as of now, the CD thing works pretty well, and makes me feel like I don't have to worry about never getting Conq gear cause we're stacked 4 paladins for all relevant buffs, Auras, and Judgements (God I miss those multi-color Judgements.)

    Devotion Aura is Concentration+Resistance Aura in one. I say rename it to Sanctuary Aura or take a name from Vanilla and call it Sanctity Aura

    Give a raid wide defensive Aura that mixes a non-mounted Crusader Aura (+20% Move speed.) and a 10% reduction in damage for 3 seconds. Mainly, I would just be happy with it being a "Oh shit, hectic situation, we're all about to eat it when these meteors fall on our heads." button that makes you move faster to get out of stuff, think like a minor Stampeding Roar.

    Then a Retribution Aura which I think should be a targeted spell that applies 'The Guilty Pay The Price \(T)/' or something to the target, causing them to return x% damage as holy and increase the haste/mastery/crit/SomeStatHere! of allies within (y) Yards for 10 seconds.

    Consecration would be nice to come back to Ret, or all specs. Maybe Holy would get the Ground-Targetable version for free since that fits them. I do agree that after this AoE tier bonus is gone, and next expansion comes around, that's going to hurt.

    That and Templar's Verdict either going up in damage, or dealing Holy Damage on proc, and I think that would give us a more iconic, noticeable class. Cause as of now, the only unique things we really have are a bland effect on some pretty golden wings, and a big bulky golden guy that assists us.

    Once again, aside from the first three, these are just dreams. I know they probably sound OP or have dumb names, but class design is a constant work in progress.
    Either way, thanks for reading. <3
    Last edited by Ichorum; 2013-11-06 at 10:09 PM.


  20. #180
    It won't happen, but I would love a shockadin spec

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