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  1. #61
    Dreadlord xytech's Avatar
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    It's just sad when so many people does less dps in the final patch of MoP than I did in the final patch of Cata =/

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by Trafalgarlaw View Post
    First off, I like the Timeless Isle.
    It gives people something to do, and allows returning players to catch up.

    I also love LFR and Flex raiding.

    However, the problem arises when the two of these are combined.
    What Blizzard has created is a true hell. Screw Satan, he aint got shit in LFR SoO.

    What happens now is that clueless players, new or not, can jump straight into the latest tier of LFR with 30 minutes of Isle farming.
    This results in the majority of your LFR consisting of dps that hover between 30-50k dps.
    Often said players are obnoxious and refuse to take advice, or follow simple instructions.

    I literally had a wing 3 of SoO where 8, count em, EIGHT dps were between that margin. This was with 2 stacks of determination.
    And this was not an isolated incident, earlier today I had the great displeasure of spending 2 hours on Galakras, again, because of players like this.

    Ofcourse, you had this in far lessser proportions in previous tiers, with people geared in pvp crap which they got by afking BG's.
    But it has never been as bad as it is now.

    Therefore, I feel that something needs to be done.

    Either:
    Lower the itemlevel of Timeless Isle gear, but keep the stats the same.
    Increase the required itemlevel for SoO, and make Timeless gear not count towards it, UNLESS you have Silver in the proving grounds.
    Nerf gear because bad players wear it, pretty much sums up your post. I got this gear, rocked it into lfr and we downed everything with no issue.

    Now read your arguement back to yourself..

    "Nerf gear because of bad players" and then "If you give shit better gear, it's still going to be shit"

  3. #63
    I am Murloc! Gandrake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trafalgarlaw View Post
    Then kindly explain why it has never been THIS bad up until the Clueless Isle came along.
    because lfr too stronk, ned nerfz

    increasing item level requirement to 520 would be sacrilege

    i have a wife and 3 kids and a job and play world of warcraft 10 hours a week, i dont have the time to get good gear or learn how to play my class. this is just something i do for fun! its almost as fun as my favorite sport, competitive breathing


  4. #64
    My biggest issue with the gear on the isle is the god awful stats on the gear. When I finally wiped the dust off my mage and decided to gear her up I got gear from the isle and, no matter how hard I tried, the poor thing couldn't push past 90k dps.
    It would be dark inside my head...if not for the fires...

  5. #65
    I attempted to do LFR once or twice this tier, but after 3hr wipefests on shamman while people are doing 60k dps in their 496 epics, I quickly backtracked. Not one person in my guild or on my friends list still does LFR. With oQueue its to easy to get a decent flex group without having to carry baddies and their welfare epics.
    "You take 4,994,468 boredom damage from daily quests.... You have died."

  6. #66
    Fluffy Kitten Gehco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trafalgarlaw View Post
    Then kindly explain why it has never been THIS bad up until the Clueless Isle came along.
    I have always found looking for raid in the worse end, but it is useful as a stepping stone.

    The Timeless gear is as it is to make more people try the raiding.
    Stuff can be fixed, just get enough glue or duct tape!
    Just because there isn't a cookie you like doesn't mean there is no cookies (Content discussion)

  7. #67
    The Insane peggleftw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trafalgarlaw View Post
    Then kindly explain why it has never been THIS bad up until the Clueless Isle came along.

    my LFr has been just as good. LFR is so easy as it is.
    Quote Originally Posted by endus View Post
    A thread about how hard it is being a white dude is not really a reasonable topic.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gabriel View Post
    You are assuming Cybran actually reads the articles he links.
    I suspect he is actually some Soviet algorithm gone rogue, transmitting from some forgotten bunker, responding to keywords by googling them and adding "+bad" to the search query, and then just copy/pasting anything it comes across.

  8. #68
    ever since Flex i haven't stepped foot into LFR, and when i do i normally leave after the second wipe because seeing the whole raid pulling 20-50k isn't even gonna get 1 boss down.

  9. #69
    OP your argument is invalid because people did more or less the same dps when Timeless Isle wasn't here in ToT
    “It is either easy or impossible.” - Salvador Dali

  10. #70
    Afraid I have to agree with others here. The issue is not Blizz or the ilvl's, it's the players. While I wouldn't mind raising LFR SoO's ilvl requirement, I'm fairly certain the same idiots would still plague it, once they get better gear from ToT LFR.

    There's always going to be worthless players, whether they choose to be (trolling) or are simply not that good (bad players are bad). I personally feel that the vote system needs redone so that these players can be removed quickly and easily. However then that runs the risk of abuse.

    My solution: Deal with it. If you dislike the mouth-breathing morons populating LFR then don't utilize it. Do flex, which, from what I've heard, is more rewarding, simpler, and a better experience overall in comparison.
    "If I didn't have bad luck I'd have no luck at all."

  11. #71
    Herald of the Titans
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    I dunno. Reading a LOT of hyperbole here.

    This weekend I did a lot of LFR. Here were the results:

    Hunter, ilevel 540: Wing 1: started on second boss. 1 shot everything.
    Wing 2: started on first boss. 1 wipe on Dark Shaman. One shot everything else.
    Wing 3: started on second boss. 1 wipe because a lot of people didn't realise to progress both sides equally. 1 Shot the last boss.

    Blood DK ilevel 530: Wing 1: started on 3rd boss, 1 shot both bosses
    Wing 2: started on 2nd boss, wiped twice on Shamans, 1 shot the others.

    In total, 14 bosses, 4 wipes. 3 of those wipes were on Dark Shaman.

    I honestly don't see an issue here.

    LFR has been balanced such that it can handle a few people doing 30-50K dps. It has also been balanced so that most of the raid still has to have some clue, or it'll result in wipes.

    The nett result is that most players seem to improve after a few LFR runs, and those that are beyond any form of help, well let's just say that they constitute a handicap which makes the LFR experience a little more challenging for those of us who know what we're doing, which, as long as it doesn't degenerate into a wipefest and hours lost to waiting for replacements, is fine by me.

    My attitude is simple: I don't care how well/bad the rest of the raid is doing. I focus on my job and try to top the dps meters when I dps, and try to do my job properly as a tank. I have an interest in the overall dps to get a feeling of what is needed in the raid, but for the most part it has been sufficient, even with the few bads that tend to occupy any given LFR.

    My genuine feeling is that most people in LFR are actually trying. And IMO you can't expect any more from them. I would far rather wipe a few times with low dps people trying their best than a bunch of conceited, arrogant pricks who do nothing but pollute raid chat with annoying whining the whole time. I reserve my kick quota for afk'ers, griefers and healers who decided to dps when clearly the raid didn't have enough healing.

    Most people who are actively trying will improve. I don't think there is much to be done with a bad attitude though.

  12. #72
    Only real difference I have noticed so far is that SoO have more unforgiving mechanics and needs better coordination, can't say I have noticed much else compared to older lfr raids. Previous lfr was more or less filled with the same high and low dps/healers.
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  13. #73
    The Insane det's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trafalgarlaw View Post
    Then kindly explain why it has never been THIS bad up until the Clueless Isle came along.
    It has - as threads on this forum ever since the introduction of LFD in WotLK prove. It is always the end of the world because SUDDENLY your world exists only with NEW players who NEVER set a foot into WoW catching up and ruining your game.

    So now suddenly thee is this HUGE influx of totally clueless people who levelled up from 1-90 since 5.4 and jump straight into SoO? Welly well...so..no chance for an awesome guy like you to do Flex? Not even suggesting normal raiding....
    Last edited by det; 2013-10-14 at 01:29 PM.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    ... there are lots of different types of players, with different amounts of time to play, and different tastes for the content and difficulty and time commitment they want to give to any of those pieces of content. The person that plays for an hour or so a few times a week is playing the same game as the person that plays five hours every night.....
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...261?page=8#154

  14. #74
    The Lightbringer zephid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trafalgarlaw View Post
    Then kindly explain why it has never been THIS bad up until the Clueless Isle came along.
    LFR has ALWAYS been this bad.

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by catbeef View Post
    install oqueue and do flex with pugs - lfr is dead to me.
    I'm with you on this. I haven't touched LFR until I geared up my alt on Timeless.
    People are right though. This is a three tier problem. First the ilvel allows people to walk right into the new tier. second most people who are raid aware aren't doing LFR because of reason 1. 3 is that a lot of the people in there are running with a green weapon and no enchants, gems etc. And why would they? They are going to replace that gear quickly with all these wings to choose from. Bot ToT and SoO.
    So yeah, I agree completely that the gear from Timeless should get you into ToT lfr, at best.

  16. #76
    The Insane det's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zephid View Post
    LFR has ALWAYS been this bad.
    I have had pretty much exclusively smooth LFR runs (Would say 10% failed or I quit, 90% were finished without any bad incident) and reading this thread, so have others.

    I cannot even understand how LFR can be bad, because certainly listening to the bragging in this thread - there are so MANY awesome guys on this forum, that any one of them could singlehandedly carry 24 slackers through LFR.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    ... there are lots of different types of players, with different amounts of time to play, and different tastes for the content and difficulty and time commitment they want to give to any of those pieces of content. The person that plays for an hour or so a few times a week is playing the same game as the person that plays five hours every night.....
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...261?page=8#154

  17. #77
    Would be better if the gear from TI actually wasn't so randomised, honestly as a protadin I get more gear suitable for ret or useless gear altogether (A helmet with a billion hit, wat).

  18. #78
    The Patient Wulfstan's Avatar
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    LFR is what it is. There is no sense in whining about it.
    The reason they call it the American Dream is because you have to be asleep to believe it.- George Carlin

  19. #79
    The quality of lfr players does seem bad atm but I don't think its just down to one reason. These are but some of the reasons imo.
    Timeless isle and ease of gearing
    This is great for people such as myself with lots of Alts. I also make sure I'm gemmed, enchanted and reforged before I even step into SoO (I usually do a full run of ToT first just to get a better "feel" for how the class plays in a raid setting).

    Flex taking many good players
    With separate lockouts, I doubt that people "only do Flex". They dabble in LFR as well. Granted, not as much as they did before, but they didn't just up and disappear.

    Simplification of leveling dungeons
    Not sure how this has anything to do with raiding as these dungeons have always been easy.

    The panda and pokemon factor
    Again, not sure how this affects raiding and pressing buttons in a pre-determined order and not standing in stuff.

    No reason for well geared players to do lfr now
    There wasn't a reason for well geared players to run LFR before (once their Legendary was done), other than boredom.

    No 'requirement' on joining lfr apart from gear - personally I would like to see silver in proving grounds on at least 1 char
    PG is different for every class. I know on my Monk it was pretty easy. All PG teaches you is how to fight a set of very scripted fights, in order without any real randomness (like other players dropping shit where they shouldn't).

    However having said that I don't think its necessarily a bad thing that lfr isn't face roll now (at least in terms of you aren't guaranteed to kill the boss), it was never designed to be a turn up = loot thing, more a taste of raiding for those who cant keep a raiding schedule
    This is basically what i use it for. I would absolutely LOVE to be in a normal or even hard mode raid guild but the scheduling restrictions are tough with my schedule.

  20. #80
    How about making Timeless gear better?
    There is no such thing as "ability bloat" just l2fp.

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