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  1. #21
    Dreadlord vmagik's Avatar
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    Razer Naga... It's clicking without clicking!

    Honestly though, PvE-wise if you're good at clicking then you'll not really notice a hell of a lot of difference once you've transitioned to keybinds. Of course it IS an improvement but we're talking like 95% vs 100% (with 3% being improved spatial awareness and the 2% being mouseturning) - anyone who says otherwise is just being an elitist for the sake of it.

    I clicked since beta, finally moving to the Naga a couple of years ago simply because I felt I "should" and it's not a massive difference at all. 6+ years of clicking quickly builds you peripheral vision up to near-superhuman levels ;-)
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  2. #22
    I love how people say that clicking doesn't make a difference in PvE and only PvP...some of us want to do more than kill LFR efficiently. It does matter. Not saying you don't click well or do more than LFR since I saw you've killed normals, but you'll be a better player once you learn to bind. I use A(left strafe) S(straight) D(right strafe) and X(back) to move..then I binded everything around it. (I play a monk)..so all of my active mitigation and quick use moves are on QWERFVCZ, all around ASDX. And then all of my rotation moves are on 1-12(used on my mouse(RazerNaga). Then I use shift 1-12, and you can also use ctrl 1-12 and alt 1-12 if you want, all at your finger tips. thats a total of like 50+ binds without having to move your hand. which is an absurd amount. Start small though, don't just go in and bind a billion things, a few at a time, practice on dummies, practice in heroics, then eventually start practicing on easy normals..you'll notice the difference in your awareness and reaction time increase significantly in a pretty short period of time.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Puffler View Post
    Clicking makes almost no difference in PvE, only matters in PvP really
    This is what clickers say to help themselves deal with their own laziness. Go ahead and find one clicker who has ranked in the top 100 on any heroic fight while current content. Better yet, find one former clicker that actually took the time and effort required to reform themselves into a keybinder that DIDN'T see a huge increase in performance.

    I have to admit though, clickers have such a fanatical defensive reaction to their sub-standard techniques that it is almost like a religion to them.

    But for the OP, the best way to convert to the proper way would be to role a fresh character and level up with keybinding. That way you only have a couple of new keys to learn at a time and you won't be overwhelmed trying to learn ~30 at once. If you don't want to do that, start by binding all of your main "rotational" abilities to the Q,W,R,T,A,G,C,V keys. After that add in shift-modifiers for each of these keys. That should give you a solid start. Long CD abilities (~3-5min ones), or things you rarely hit can be kept as click keys for the mean time, until you have the rotational abilities learned and feel comfortable moving on to less vital abilities.
    Last edited by Skarssen; 2013-10-15 at 02:03 PM.

  4. #24
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    Being a clicker in the past, I have to say that the easiest way to learn play with keybinds is to reroll a caster for a while. That is what I ve done back then. I stopped playing my dk cause, I found myself, although I tried not to, to begin clicking when the fights got intense somehow. So, I rerolled and leveled a caster, a shadow priest particularly, and then I never looked back. Dunno, this might help a little.

  5. #25
    Honestly, just take it slowly - Bind a few abilities and try to remember where they are, you can still click if you want but occasionally remember to press the key bind instead - Everything like that always seems hard to begin with, just give it time and it'll be a piece of cake, kinda like touch typing.

    And oh yeah, plz stop the clicking v keyboard turning arguments, it's not even a debate, there's no contest at all.

  6. #26
    When I returned to the game in WotLK I thought to myself "now it's time for keybinds!". I was a clicker too.

    You need to start slowly.

    First thing to do is to change A and D to Strafe, so it leaves Q and E free to bind.
    Bind 1,2,3,4 for main abilities like Rune Strike, Heart Strike, Death Strike
    You should bind E for your main interrupt(Mind freeze) coz it's a easy key to press so makes you faster interrupting.


    First try this for a couple days:

    Unbound Q and E and change A and D to Strafe movement to get used to it.

    1- Rune Strike
    2- Heart Strike
    3- Death Strike
    4- Outbreak


    After couple days add this ones:

    Q- Death Grip
    E- Mind Freeze
    C- Blood Boil

    And then:

    X- Death and Decay

    You can also bind more keys like 5, 6, Z, \.

    Later on you can use modifiers like CTRL/Shift or Alt to get even more keybinds. Personally I like Alt with 1/2/3/4/Q/E, they are easy to press at least for me.

    Also you can unbind R and F, so 2 extra keys. R is bound to whisper by default, so you can change it to T. But you need time to get used to this. F is bound assist target, just change it to G...if you use it that is.


    This^^ works for me. Just play around with it and feel what works for you.

    Good luck

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Wrathnruin View Post
    If there is a thread for this I am sorry, I didn't see it.


    Here's the thing, since I started playing WoW I have been a mouse-clicker. In fact, every game I play I change the settings so I don't have to use the keyboard. Lazy? Yes, more than likely.

    I KNOW THIS IS BAD! So please, don't kick me in the teeth here.

    Despite this, I do fairly well. But I know I can be doing better! So I am asking you, the DK tanking community, in all your wisdom, to offer me some assistance. I want to transition away from being a clicker!

    So I need to know, what keybindings are used, what macros, etc, etc.

    Any assistance would be greatly appreciated.

    I can't imagine you would need my gear, but just incase here is a link to wow-heroes.com

    http://www.wow-heroes.com/character/...rs/Wrathnruin/

    Thank you all in advance.
    I don't want to give any specifics, because it's going to depend on what's comfortable for you. However, I found that keeping things organized is a big part of it.

    For instance, my main abilities are ~-6,

    Oh shit abilities are Alt keys
    General survivability and/or raid survivability Ctrl keys
    Interrupts, speed boots, etc F keys

    This was not all my keybinds of course, but an idea on how i "group" things

    Just an example, but keeping them "grouped" always helped me out the most, especially when I had to change my buttons, they were always somewhat in the same area

  8. #28
    Tremendous help here. Thank you to everyone. I am going to try and few things and see how it rolls. I will take it slow at first as I don't want to become a hinderance for our raid team.

    I can not thank you all enough for your input.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Wrathnruin View Post
    Tremendous help here. Thank you to everyone. I am going to try and few things and see how it rolls. I will take it slow at first as I don't want to become a hinderance for our raid team.

    I can not thank you all enough for your input.
    Change a few keybinds, chain pull a few heroics, change a few more keybinds, chain pull a few more heroics, etc until you're comfortable.

    Don't wait for your dps, don't wait for your healer, just go in like you're on your own, pull all you can. Just make it a very hectic situation for yourself... Sounds silly, but it's an easy place to try and force yourself to use all your buttons and react quickly to any dps that might pull off of you or any lack of heals you can use your CD's for. The point is to make it as hectic as possible and force yourself to react quickly.

    Don't be stupid about it of course, but at least force yourself to use abilities you don't typically need in 5mans.

    It will at least get your muscle memory on the right track. You'll probably still press the wrong buttons a few times in a raid, but nothing it'll get you started.

    I suppose you could do LFR or something, too... But honestly, I don't think it'll really do a lot for you as far as practicing.

    Whatever you do, don't change your keybinds 5 mins before raid and expect it to work haha

    This is how I'd do it, at least. Best of luck to you
    Last edited by Louis CK; 2013-10-15 at 05:06 PM.

  10. #30
    Dreadlord vmagik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skarssen View Post
    This is what clickers say to help themselves deal with their own laziness. Go ahead and find one clicker who has ranked in the top 100 on any heroic fight while current content. Better yet, find one former clicker that actually took the time and effort required to reform themselves into a keybinder that DIDN'T see a huge increase in performance.

    I have to admit though, clickers have such a fanatical defensive reaction to their sub-standard techniques that it is almost like a religion to them.

    But for the OP, the best way to convert to the proper way would be to role a fresh character and level up with keybinding. That way you only have a couple of new keys to learn at a time and you won't be overwhelmed trying to learn ~30 at once. If you don't want to do that, start by binding all of your main "rotational" abilities to the Q,W,R,T,A,G,C,V keys. After that add in shift-modifiers for each of these keys. That should give you a solid start. Long CD abilities (~3-5min ones), or things you rarely hit can be kept as click keys for the mean time, until you have the rotational abilities learned and feel comfortable moving on to less vital abilities.
    Reformed clicker, don't see a hell of a lot of difference, faster reaction times mainly based on ui layout and mouse turning.

    Was ranking during ToT heroics while clicking from a friend's house (away from my naga)... Didn't bother me tbh.

    Reactions of people against clickers far outweighs the "meh, it's fine" defensive reactions from clickers themselves.

    OT: While you're transitioning just do a few binds at a time, defensives etc. Just get used go it before going balls-out.
    Last edited by vmagik; 2013-10-16 at 06:22 AM.
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  11. #31
    Clicking lessons your performance, if that leads of a wipe, rarely but...possibly.

    dk...esp blood dk...have too many abilities atm and overlap. I literally have a naga mouse and have had to slant my keyboard somewhat so I can comfortably reach the ctrl and shift modifiers plus the alt on all my key bindings. It's insane how many I need to not click anything.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by vmagik View Post
    Razer Naga... It's clicking without clicking!

    Honestly though, PvE-wise if you're good at clicking then you'll not really notice a hell of a lot of difference once you've transitioned to keybinds. Of course it IS an improvement but we're talking like 95% vs 100% (with 3% being improved spatial awareness and the 2% being mouseturning) - anyone who says otherwise is just being an elitist for the sake of it.

    I clicked since beta, finally moving to the Naga a couple of years ago simply because I felt I "should" and it's not a massive difference at all. 6+ years of clicking quickly builds you peripheral vision up to near-superhuman levels ;-)
    This is probably the best description I would say I have heard about clicking in a good bit. Also pretty much, just yeah if you wana get out of it get the Razer Naga.

    I've been clicking since well.. forever. Once I did a kill video and my guild found out they were surprised, because I do well and more then hold my own on the meters. They offered to help me switch to keybinds, and I accepted (or will) their help as it was nice to have people all offering tips. That was during Lei Shen heroic progression though, now we are in Siege heroic, and it's just not the time to be learning a new way to play. I will do that when it's on farm. The raid leader even said when I told him that, that I do great and i'm a good dps as it is, so switching to binds won't improve my deeps much as much as it would just give small QOL improvements.

    I'm all well and fine with making the switch once we are on farm. Though in no way shape or form does clicking hold me back from being in a heroic progressed guild or getting good rankings. Though it's fun until I do switch that we have my clicking to make fun of and poke fun at, as i'm the but of jokes whenever clicking gets involved haha.


    More on topic though, def do it as a gradual thing. Don't just toss yourself in to full keybinds, just work out of the habit of each part of what you do being a click, and slowly make more and more binds until you can do anything and everything with binds.

  13. #33
    Pandaren Monk Forgettable's Avatar
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    I can also recommend the Razer Naga. I got one for myself almost 2 years ago, and have been so much better off since. As for how to actually go about the change... I would recommend taking it slow. You're way ahead of of most people by recognizing that you should be keybinding, so props to you for that. Start by keybinding your main abilities. I main a DK, so using my own keybinds as an example:

    (Frost DK)
    1 - Howling Blast
    2 - Plague Strike
    3 - Frost Strike
    4 - Obliterate
    5 - Death Strike
    6 - Mind Freeze

    Blood DK
    1 - Icy Touch
    2 - Plague Strike
    3 - Heart Strike
    4 - Death Strike
    5 - Rune Strike
    6 - Mind Freeze

    Now that I think of it, maybe I should synchronize my Death Strikes to the same button...

    Anyway, play for a day or two with keybinds such as those. Once you are familiar with them, add keybinds for other stuff! More examples!

    Caps - Outbreak
    Tab - Blood Tap
    Ctrl + Tab - Horn of Winter
    ` - Remorseless Winter
    Q - Chains of Ice
    E - Blood Boil
    R - Soul Reaper
    T - Unholy Blight
    F - Bone Shield
    Ctrl + F - Icebound Fortitude
    C - Gloves / Pillar / Blood Fury / Trinket + Summon Ghoul
    V - Death Pact

    Add the Razer Naga and you have oodles more keybinds available!

    But the main point is take it slow. Don't keybind everything, or you'll be overwhelmed. Do a few at a time, and eventually you'll get it all keybound. Also! Don't give up! It will take you a few minutes/hours to become on par with your clicking proficiency, and then the next few days will see actual improvement beyond clicking.
    Quote Originally Posted by Delti View Post
    If Forgettable knew what he was doing with his keyboard, I would totally kick his ass in dps!
    ^ My guild leader while drunk.

  14. #34
    A really good and detailed (maybe overly so?) overview of keyding; http://www.sacredduty.net/2012/11/09...-key-bindings/

    Not very DK specific but it will give an overview and give you ideas for what will be comfy for you.

  15. #35
    note that z and y are switched on my keyboard but doesnt matter since i use both anyway

    ^,1,2,3,4,5,6,alt,r,t,z,f,g,h,x,y,c,<,v,b,F1,f2,f3,Mouse 1-14 (naga)
    yup thats 37 keybinds including anything that i use atleast all 5 minutes (yes i click army, thats the only thing though)
    open for suggestions for army key
    Last edited by Raegwyn; 2013-10-17 at 11:03 PM.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by plantation View Post
    Nothing wrong with clicking abilities. Especially in PvE. I've been clicking for years and my raiding guild clears normal modes/starts on heroics. My clicking doesn't impact their performance.
    Bad players will claim their clicking is okay, and they will defend it until they are blue in the face. Clicking is fucking terrible. Do yourself a favor and learn to keybind. There is absolutely ZERO advantage to clicking when compared to keybinding. You are only slowing your own reaction time.


    Quote Originally Posted by Puffler View Post
    Clicking makes almost no difference in PvE, only matters in PvP really
    I can pretty much guarantee you that no top world pve guilds have clickers.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Puffler View Post
    Clicking makes almost no difference in PvE, only matters in PvP really
    You are so wrong, I cannot stop laughing.
    Clicking, + having shit tons of mechanic from boss does make HUGE impact and dps loss and other shit.

    Try playing affliction warlock as clicker, tell me how that goes. Clicking = fucking terrible. No excuse to not use binds.

    OT:
    Start small as suggested. Personally I started with 1,2,3,4,¸,Q,E,F,R
    Last edited by Shaqur; 2013-10-18 at 07:35 AM.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Shaqur View Post
    Try playing affliction warlock as clicker, tell me how that goes. Clicking = fucking terrible. No excuse to not use binds.
    Well then it's good we are in the dk forums in a thread about Blood tanking while clicking.
    There are certain classes where obv it would be much harder, or easier, to click then other specs.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    problem with naga is in the buttons you are allowed to assign. it cannot be used with bartender and limits the flexibility in assigning your keybinds.
    Mine works fine with BT. If you are keybinding numpad as a right handed person you are doing it all wrong -.-

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