1. #1

    Raidleader needs help for her boomkin

    Hi everyone

    I while back we took in an undergeared Moonkin druid, that we decided to gear up for our SoO raid team. He was lacking behind on dps for a long time, as expected, being behind on gear and all. The problem is, now that he has gotten to a good state of ilvl (556 I believe), he is still lacking quite behind on the damage, and I am not able to figure out just why this is, looking at the logs. I lack the expertice in balance druid dps and stat weights to properly pinpoint the problem, which brought me here

    Hopefully there are some capable druids out there that can help him out, would be much appreciated!!!

    His armory: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...oosaq/advanced

    Most recent logs:
    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/gl9wra51zmd3gzf8/ - Protectors to Malkorok
    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/uodvqviq1p6a4dxo/ - Spoils to Garrosh

    as a note, on these 2 logs, he did not have the legendary meta(and ofc not the cloak either then)

    Hope some friendly and skilled soul can help him out! Thanks!
    Last edited by Claeshj; 2013-10-16 at 11:03 PM.

  2. #2
    "he did not have the legendary meta(and ofc not the cloak either than)"

    this is a big thing for his dps most likely before i even look at logs

    after looking he is about 600 off the haste breakpoint which would be a nice dps increase. he has no items but 1 upgraded either.

    also he is using a very bad trinket with that cleave one if he has a Heroic one from last tier i think those might actually be better for him.

    he is about 400 over hit cap

    other then that i couldnt tell if he doing anything wrong rotational his dot time uptime was good on the fights i looked at. maybe taking DoC on a few fights might help but not having meta and legendary def is hurting him.
    Last edited by primalfears; 2013-10-16 at 05:01 PM.

  3. #3
    http://www.askmrrobot.com/wow/gear/eu/al%27akir/droosaq

    edit weights > haste soft cap > change soft cap > 10289
    then hit optimize

    The actual numbers shown are irrelevant, it is a massive dps increase.

    DoT uptime isn't bad.. SS proc loss isn't bad (could use a little work but ~16% isn't too bad).. if anything he could focus on refreshing DoT's better with procs.. otherwise nothing terrible.

    Get him out of hit/spirit gear and a better trinket than the cleave trinket too..
    Last edited by boomkinhero; 2013-10-16 at 05:27 PM.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by boomkinhero View Post
    http://www.askmrrobot.com/wow/gear/eu/al%27akir/droosaq

    edit weights > haste soft cap > change soft cap > 10289 - 10296
    then hit optimize

    The actual numbers shown are irrelevant, it is a massive dps increase.

    DoT uptime isn't bad.. SS proc loss isn't bad.. if anything he could focus on refreshing DoT's better with procs Just. No... otherwise nothing terrible.

    Get him out of hit/spirit gear and a better trinket than the cleave trinket too..
    Read the moonkin guide.

  5. #5
    @Primalfears

    The meta and cloak really are that big of a deal? I realize he's low on upgrades, simply can't keep up with all the the items he keeps getting - and like I said, ilvl wise he's on par with the rest(for the most part), so upgrading really shouldn't be the issue. He does usually use mrrobot, so I'm inclined to think the 600 haste under cap is an oversight after getting some new piece yesterday, I'm fairly certain he generally hits the haste cap you mean, but I will make sure to point it out to him to make certain.

    @Boomkinhero

    Like I mentioned to primal, he does usually use mrrobot, but I do see the problem you're talking about. I did not realize his trinket was all that bad - the one he replaced was the shado pan valor trinket, so I do however still doubt it's worth going back to that? Also, what do you mean with Starsurge Proc loss? He gets procs he don't manage to use or?

    @Drayarr

    I'm a bit confused about your "just no" comment - it's not a good idea to re-apply dots with procs or?

    Thanks again all of you for the input
    I'm still hoping for something vigoriously wrong in his rotation, cos as you may notice on the logs, he's more behind than I think a trinket and a bit of too much hit would do(and meta and cloak), but I might be wrong here. If you can tell me cloak, meta and a trinket would sort things, of course I would also be very happy, but I am doubtful

  6. #6
    Particularly the meta, with it it allows treants to become GCD capped when you have meta proc + nature's grace + 10289 haste bp. It is a big deal to have that for DPS.

    Another note, I'm not certain that simcraft had the numbers perfect, but on a single target encounter, I was seeing about a 200dps loss of the cleave trinket versus a normal ToT trinket (Breath of the Hydra). Unless he needs it to do haste breakpoints, the cleave versus the Breath isn't too much of a dps loss. Plus, outside of probably Norushen, Iron juggernaut, and Malk, there's usually another target that can be hit, which will lessen the overall dps loss (though getting Immerseus trinket will help tons over it).

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Claeshj View Post
    @Drayarr

    I'm a bit confused about your "just no" comment - it's not a good idea to re-apply dots with procs or?
    Theres only some specific circumstances where you would reapply dots because of procs. You want to keep your cycles as short as possible.

  8. #8
    Cleave trinket is very likely better than the shado pan trinket. SS Proc loss is inherent and yes procs that don't get used (i.e. it refreshes)

    Can go to the expression editor and copy in
    Code:
    sourceName = "Droosaq" and fullType = SPELL_AURA_REFRESH and spell = "Shooting Stars"
    Drayarr probably thinks I'm suggesting to refresh dots as soon procs 'proc', which is false. DoT refreshing is about DPS difference between a few seconds. Whether the extra ~2 ticks is worth having a stronger DoT or not. Most of the time it's irrelevant, but during CD's and when multi dotting it can make a large difference. I bring this up because his protectors damage (multi dotting) does seem low.

    Edit: Exactly what Drayarr said applies to single target (which he doesn't appear to have weakness). Multi dotting with 4p can easily lead to spamming SS which makes NG uptime irrelevant.. i.e. applying DoT's with NG (a proc) and spamming that sexy SS to hit eclipse.

    @Ironbark, he's short of next breakpoint barely, so it would show the dps increase.
    Last edited by boomkinhero; 2013-10-16 at 06:10 PM.

  9. #9
    All things considered from all of these posts; reach haste cap, double check that he is not over the hit cap, needs to use his starsurge procs better/as soon as they are up(missing an extra cast of an instant spell that can hit for 1 mill can hurt your dps if you miss 4-5 over a fight), be sure to refresh multi dots on multi dot AOE fights while you still have buffs/trinket/BL etc up.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by boomkinhero View Post
    Can go to the expression editor and copy in
    Code:
    sourceName = "Droosaq" and fullType = SPELL_AURA_REFRESH and spell = "Shooting Stars"
    I'm using this to try and evaluate my own parses, what do you do after seeing all of them in WoL? How do you compare?

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Zene View Post
    I'm using this to try and evaluate my own parses, what do you do after seeing all of them in WoL? How do you compare?
    number of refreshes / (number of refreshes + number of casts) * 100 = % loss

    I made an in game WA to track this. Refresh MotW (cast it twice) to print out % loss since last refresh.
    Code:
    dCK8oaGisLlbKsgfrXPisTkOkQxrKWSGQ6waPAxaXVqQsnmK0XqQSmQIEgfQPbOCnkOTrQQ(gsvzCivvNJuLwhsv09aQdsuTqQqEivHMivOUiqYgPc(iPkmsKQKtsK0kr1mjvLBcKIDcv8tIenuKQWsbu9uctfQ0vPq2kqk1xPkTxk9xIsdwDyuwmufEmv1KPOldAZiLpteJgqonP8AQOzdWTPs7gIFJWWrILdPNdLPtY1r02HQ03jvrJNQGZtbwpufP5dvrSFzlDwCTcxRW0kmT4Af0iqucn8uOfhdn2k8GusJgguzDa0bg9PFQuney0pv6xV6xVEsN(T0aDGzSvyQHrbaZaCHEqzfwHpjMIWfxOhuwr84wHbsjnAyqL1b97PHatV0VEnK(Psh9zSX0rNLgOdmdTcuOenceCnGc0kuqpOScFsmfHlUqpOmIIjtbTciEHikRGerHQjrce1IRv4tIPiCTI4XTkRqHQjrce1IRvGrqI6djr0uwbfamdGOwHpjMIWvwG0mHwHsZfAAfmsugUgqbAfoYihCWkugqbAf(KykcxRWNetr4kRYakqRatXuKywbjceVqeLvO0CHMwbeVqeLv4rcx8GPA9riXk8jXueUcfZ3jMvepUvGrIhq8crucsA008GviRCJaUCzboOCa4GsqVScFsmfHlomxOvepUvaXlerHzfEukbnosoUYQpPupKfuG2GchCL1iCCqQ6dxqbCq5yRGedklgbjQpKertzDKv4de03PvaXlerzf(KykcxRGgjIVsJargiEHik8BLMletXCPGF7cXWysG43aPzc9idtbrXVXiir9H6Hrs1X43yeKO(qCyUq8BmcsuFOdaysWWVXiir9HaNPz6aaMem8BtiMspmsQog)2eIPWH5cXVnHykhaWKGHFBcXuaNPz6aaMem8BqabeP7oE3DhV7U1O1UqmmMeydgCRtqpaL(0NSYnc4YLf4GYbGdkb9sxRacIeV7U7UBae(mangfiaas1e)gJceaaCyUq8Bmkqaae(arqaOb3GaciX7U7U7wJwJrqI6dXH5cBWGBJq0u4WCHYOJcaMbquDs3meZgJceaaPA2Gb30rNN6VziMTjetHdZf2Gb3gHOPWH5cLrhfamdGO6KUvabrI3D3D3D3DRrRncrtjNgnOVsdrIhjCXdMsgDuaWmaIQt6gm4grdqRacIeV7U7U7U7U7U1O1ieQ2lK5uojkti8jirunbAJqOAVqMt5KOmHWK5YKaBfqqK4D3D3D3D3D3D3D7fYCkNeLje(eKiQgCtnE3D3D3D3D3D3D3EHmNYjrzcHjZLjb2GBQX7U7U7U7U7U7U7gLP0iAWn14D3D3D3D3D3neXmE3D3D3D3D3DtbvdrjJo8eFA0OrJkvQufIg4qkeOk6PoPJ3D3D3D3D3D3uq1quY4fYCkNeLje(eKikqaP11crtbLWhRrH0qHyabn1jD8U7U7U7U7U7gLP0iAWTxiZPCsuMq4tqIOO3Y4fYCkNeLjeMmxMeylfTxiZPCsuMq4tqIOKoE3D3D3D3D3DJYuAen4gLP0iA8CthvQX7U7U7U7U7UBuMsJOb3UmfqGqdabbQmOmLgbE2LPaceke6Pm0rfFpLwkOcIHs3072LPaceke6Pm0rfFpLoE3D3D3D3D3DRrR9czoLtIYecFcsevdgCtTjqBecv7fYCkNeLje(eKiQwbeejE3D3D3D3D3D3D3OmLgrdUPgV7U7U7U7U7UHiMX7U7U7U7U7UBkOAikz8czoLtIYectMltceeqADTpdtHPt64D3D3D3D3D3nfuneLm6eIgabgg9S1bcinktPraciToqlDshV7U7U7U7U7UPGQHOKrNq0EKGer1OqmOsN0X7U7U7U7U7UBVqMt5KOmHWNGer1GBQX7U7U7U7U7UBVqMt5KOmHWK5YKaBWn14D3D3D3D3qeZ4D3D3DdrmJ3D3D3TgT2ienLCA0G(knejEKWfpykz0rbaZaiQoPBWGB6AfqqK4D3D3D3D3A0AmcsuFiomxydgCBeIMchMlugDuaWmaIQt6MHy2yuGaaivZgm4wVgdmQuBfqqK4D3D3D3D3D3TgTgHq1EHmNYjrzcHpbjIQvabrI3D3D3D3D3D3D3TxiZPCsuMq4tqIOAWn14D3D3D3D3D3D3D7fYCkNeLjeMmxMeydUPgV7U7U7U7U7U7UBuMsJOb3uJ3D3D3D3D3D3qeZ4D3D3D3D3D3TxiZPCsuMq4tqIOAWTxiZPCsuMq4tqIOAPOPRJ3D3D3D3DdrmJ3D3D3neXmE3DdrmJ3D3A0AxiggtcSbdU1jOhGsF6twhlh0ixpaLUwbeejE3D3D3ai8zaAmkqaaKQj(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(ayyywhzfOeaGwCTcxsaknlUwLvzfKyqzrG4fIAXdRGedklgfOV1rwHpaggMfxRatdrcaOv4yGBKuDSvzfyuG(wCTcmnejaGwCOZQSkRGzAQP0iqyaKvHQjrcefZIRvzvwbMv4jiuTc8AXHoGrhvRYAb
    Starsurge isn't necessarily going to be the best thing to cast at a given moment in time. There are times when it will refresh naturally and result in an increase in loss. There are times when other spells can take priority which results in an increase in loss. This is why his ~16% is acceptable (I think I looked at IJ for that one).

    His rotation isn't vigorously wrong though.

    Also I didn't notice this before but Drayarr, the breakpoint is 10289. GCD cap is 10296. Technically crit is still better than haste for that 7 rating.

  12. #12
    Having dots just up and rolling and not wasting globals to refresh too early is better than stronger dots but wasted globals. Our dots don't hit that hard to require that.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Juvencus View Post
    Having dots just up and rolling and not wasting globals to refresh too early is better than stronger dots but wasted globals. Our dots don't hit that hard to require that.
    It's better if you delay refreshing dots (without letting them fall off) until you get a nice juicy proc rather right as you enter eclipse or right as your dots finish.
    Check out my youtube channel of fail: http://www.youtube.com/EliteRocketbear

    8/8Hc DS

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Zene View Post
    I'm using this to try and evaluate my own parses, what do you do after seeing all of them in WoL? How do you compare?
    I honestly don't see why people are obsessed with checking this. Starsurge has it's place on the priority list and you press it as soon as you can, that's the most you can do. If you just get bent up about a theoretical number that is impossible to reach you're going to have a bad time.

  15. #15
    I'm just getting back into the swing of things, I catch myself re-dotting rather than SSing at times, so having a specific metric can be useful to see myself improving. I know its not a "big deal"... but still.

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