Challenge mode tips in 5.4

[Deleted]

Better late than never, im in the process of getting a CM Gold group together. So far we have a paladin tank, a retri, resto druid and me (hunter). I know having 2 of the same class is not optimal but i guess it should still be doable.
If i've understood correctly sha-touched gems and tier set bonuses do not carry over to CM, but what about the legendary cape procs?
How important is having heroism? Do we need the fifth member to be a mage/shaman or do i have to go bm use hero pet at the expense of missing a buff?
Is there a absolutely awesome spec for hunters or is it dependant on group setup and the CM dungeon we are doing?
Hunters that have completed CM Gold please share any extra tips you might have!

[mediic]

Set bonuses don't work, Sha touched gems don't work, Prismatic Weapon socket does work, Legendary Cloak proc does not work, Legendary meta gem does not work, Engineering cogwheels do work and aren't downscaled (engi goggles BiS). A couple OP trinkets are Bottle of Infinite Stars and Relic of Xuen.

SV is stronger than BM at 463, and better suited to challenge modes imo, but with the new beast cleave maybe it would do okay.

As for whether heroism or a balanced comp are necessary? They're not necessary by any means, you could go in there with the worst imagineable comp and do fine, it all depends on your groups skill level. Obviously the more optimal the easier time you will have with it.
Heroism is pretty nice, but the only one that's a huge DPS check is Stormstout brewery. What I did (not for hero but for superior burst DPS) for the last boss was respec during the RP of him spawning in. Also the new leatherworking heroism drums probably work in CMs so just use them if so.

Tips:
watch videos
stock up on invis potions
figure out good times to use invis potions
for your last spot a ele shaman would be perfect for hero, earth ele, strong CDs, capacitor totem, symb solar beam, wind shear
search forums for cmode tips, there are some existing threads with lots of specific info

[Deleted]

additional what mediic sad pick up gear with most sockets- gems doesnt scale down, BM is viable after beast cleave changes, but surv still will perform better at 463. If you usualy play surv, just get away with letherworking drums. As third dps ideal would be mage or elemental shaman, but as mediic mentioned it's more about to skill than comb. Ofc certan classes benifit more but not like you can't do gold without them

[Perrito]

survival still far superior in CModes, most of the time you are running and shooting, if you stop to kill trash you will have a hard time making the times.

i ran sv with AMoC, Fervor, Barrage, not the 1st time i got my achievement, for some sell cmodes we doing now.

there are 2 things you need to understand on Cmodes, trash is what would take most of your time, you want to save AMoC for bosses along with stampede, you want to hit barrage on trash with rapid fire pretty much on any significant trash along the way. if you want to min max, change barrage before bosses and go back after bosses.

make sure your tank know how binding shot Works and call for it. everytime i put down binding shot i just say binding shot down on mumble and my tank move. counter shot is harder to use now so make sure you take into account its travel time.

you can do them as BM for sure but is far easier as sv. i would highly recomend you to get an ele shaman.

[Lazer]

Just a quick question for cms, you want crit>haste>mastery, for surv and for bis just lots of sockets

[mediic]

Just a quick question for cms, you want crit>haste>mastery, for surv and for bis just lots of sockets

Pretty much.

[Redpanda]

if im not mistaken the eng helm is really really good and terror in the mists and relic of xuen are areally good and get gear with a lot of sockets. terror and assurance so you get reduced cd effect. Barrage is only good on the first 2 pulls on ssb. I change after first boss to glaive toss. CC wise wyvern sting is what I went to. and I went with fervor or toth depending on how I felt at the time. If you need any hunter specific advice or w/e send me a pm

[jhelom]

If you can get it, the battle horn can help round rooms up quickly (example: the room after the 2nd boss in scholo, you can run to the middle md/battlehorn all of the adds to your tank who can los the mobs into the previous room).

[mizunokizu]

A few other things to note:

Agi is your bis gemming wise just as it is in unscaled gear.

As such you want as many sockets on gear as you can get. Sockets are in the budget of an item, but they are 80 agi and 160 secondary, so each socket allows the trade of 160 secondary for 80 agi which is a boost. Socket bonuses are not budgeted so scavenge through gear for agi socket bonuses.
Heroic boots are nice from gate of the setting sun,
lei shin pants,
wind lord shoulders,
engi helm is kinda iffy because its agi does take a hit compared to any other helm but you gain i believe 200-300 secondary so investigate that.
Relic of Xuen is amazing, alchemy trinket is over budget as well, Also Rentakis soul charm is amazing if not just for the expertise aswell as 1 rppm agi boost.
Primordius gloves
t16 chest
im split between capes, but i like the legendary, it has agi socket bonus so meh its probably bis, its stats do not take a hit from getting scaled down as some usually suggest, its same secondary stats, -80 agi and 160 primary for the socket though
belt i think lw or t16 is the way to go, very few have agi socket bonus

Honestly this is all minor tweaks, most of it is handling trash properly and you can find youtube videos on how to streamline trash, get a vibe for how much your tank can take, Battle horn is amazing for large pulls(it clears alementals in intro of brewstout the fire and water), save cds for big trash bosses will usually die in 70 seconds. Wowhead has nice tips, youll need invis potions for about half of the instances, but overall if you put the time in as a group you will get it in a few weeks. Additional note first few runs just clear it, go get bronze, then silver, then gold, but you dont want to be resetting on your first wipe in a new challenge mode as that wastes time.

[Redpanda]

get a feel for them first talk through the pulls and they will become second nature.

[Teucer]

BiS are generally the ones with the most sockets. However not all gear is created equal - last time I checked the calculation for stat downscaling was based on the ratio of gear stamina / 1349. More on that here: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...1#post21133661

[Perrito]

A few other things to note:

Agi is your bis gemming wise just as it is in unscaled gear.

As such you want as many sockets on gear as you can get. Sockets are in the budget of an item, but they are 80 agi and 160 secondary, so each socket allows the trade of 160 secondary for 80 agi which is a boost. Socket bonuses are not budgeted so scavenge through gear for agi socket bonuses.
Heroic boots are nice from gate of the setting sun,
lei shin pants,
wind lord shoulders,
engi helm is kinda iffy because its agi does take a hit compared to any other helm but you gain i believe 200-300 secondary so investigate that.
Relic of Xuen is amazing, alchemy trinket is over budget as well, Also Rentakis soul charm is amazing if not just for the expertise aswell as 1 rppm agi boost.
Primordius gloves
t16 chest
im split between capes, but i like the legendary, it has agi socket bonus so meh its probably bis, its stats do not take a hit from getting scaled down as some usually suggest, its same secondary stats, -80 agi and 160 primary for the socket though
belt i think lw or t16 is the way to go, very few have agi socket bonus

Honestly this is all minor tweaks, most of it is handling trash properly and you can find youtube videos on how to streamline trash, get a vibe for how much your tank can take, Battle horn is amazing for large pulls(it clears alementals in intro of brewstout the fire and water), save cds for big trash bosses will usually die in 70 seconds. Wowhead has nice tips, youll need invis potions for about half of the instances, but overall if you put the time in as a group you will get it in a few weeks. Additional note first few runs just clear it, go get bronze, then silver, then gold, but you dont want to be resetting on your first wipe in a new challenge mode as that wastes time.

you are wrong on a couple of things.

best trinkets are relic and bottle, by far, bottle have an uptime of 38%
best helm is engineer helm, if you dont have it anything else with good stats and good socket bonus would do, t16 will be the best.

like i said on my post, trash dps is as important as boss dps. matter of fact, boss dps time will be less than trash dps. most of your time will be doing trash. barrage is good for trash, not so good for boss, you can always switch to glaive toss before boss but isnt required.

poting when you know you wont be invis is also something most ppl dont do. i always can get 3-4 pots before my invis, we are doing safe runs instead of going for time tho because we are just selling cmodes gold not time runs.

[Redpanda]

I would argue that barrage is good on trash but it has the tendency to tag a mob you dont want to pull. beware

[eschatological]

Barrage constantly fucked me (and by constantly, I mean twice) on our Mogushan Gold runs, where you jump down for the 2nd boss and CC the hexer tot he right. Barrage always managed to clip that fucker somehow just standing perpendicular to that back wall. I'd go with GT for sure unless your AoE trash stuff is seriously lacking.

Also, shaman capacitator is awesome, and binding shot is back so yay! An ele shaman would round out your team nicely.

[habitsbreaker]

sose the cleave trinket from soo work?

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and is it that good?

[eschatological]

Cleave trinket can't beat the passive agi procs from Relic and Bottle, imo, though I obviously haven't crunched the numbers on it.

[Rocksteadee]

CM Tip to top all tips: Multi-shot.

[Glurp]

sose the cleave trinket from soo work?

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and is it that good?

The cleave trinket scales poorly since it only has a 1.3% proc chance at 463.

#1 tip for challenge modes is just to play your class as you usually would. There's nothing special you need to do to get gold and in 99% of cases getting gold is just down to using the correct tactic.

[Sarthed]

you are wrong on a couple of things.

best trinkets are relic and bottle, by far, bottle have an uptime of 38%
best helm is engineer helm, if you dont have it anything else with good stats and good socket bonus would do, t16 will be the best.

like i said on my post, trash dps is as important as boss dps. matter of fact, boss dps time will be less than trash dps. most of your time will be doing trash. barrage is good for trash, not so good for boss, you can always switch to glaive toss before boss but isnt required.

poting when you know you wont be invis is also something most ppl dont do. i always can get 3-4 pots before my invis, we are doing safe runs instead of going for time tho because we are just selling cmodes gold not time runs.

You're actually pretty wrong about trinkets, bottle being worse than the alchemist trinket and I also currently estimate AoC to be better. Secondly, barrage is not worth taking over GT for CMs at any point, considering it only does like 1.4x the damage of GT but also takes 3 globals and 30 focus to use.

My tips for cms: Just go fast, they're a joke in comparison to what they were in 5.0, and you can easily beat all gold times, regardless of gear.

[eschatological]

Alchemist trinket = only available to alchemists. Why would someone suggest a BiS trinket as a profession-only trinket?