But giving the human models to the Horde is unnecessary. Forsaken humans are what undead are. Giving the human models to them would really not serve any purpose at all.
Last edited by Yonteh; 2013-10-29 at 11:21 PM.
there is a transition that is required going to a full MMORPG .. certain things that didn't matter or worked well for an RTS won't for an MMO.
why do you think Druids could not only be alliance and only be male? - the change was gameplay
or warlocks only horde?
They kept paladins allinace and shaman horde only for classic, and removed that in TBC
it worked no problem in an RTS, but not in an MMO that requires 2 -factions. They felt they wanted a game based on 2 factions, so although by the time of WC3 we had 4 factions, it was cut down to 2 again, that's why night elves join the alliance and forsaken humans the horde - yes they gave horde humans way back then. And not many people liked it, I didn't like it, and I still don't, I'm not moaning over it.
fast forward through decisions like blood elves on the horde or night elf mages or tauren paladins and priests etc etc, and you would fast reach the conclusion that a 2-faction MMO system cannot be balanced without humans on both sides or no sides. Living humans at least, although human, people do not identify with being zombies. the undead humans can be cool to play, but the main draw has always been human.
Blizzard may feel they can avoid making humans available on the horde to solve the balance issues, it's their decision, but they have an excellent way to include the living versions through the foraken or to a lesser extent as vampire forsaken or one of the other human groups. If this doesn't happen, you'd continue to have people rolling alliance, and you'll continue to have a very horde centric progression because the focus would be necessary to keep you picking horde, ensuring a rather bad tale.
fix the problem well, people saying oh you can't have humans on the horde, it won't work, it's absurd, it's crazy, absolutely not, it's stupid, it will ruin the orc v human. I say BS to all that, it doesn't have to, the reality is that the game needs it, as long as there is an mmo and you have a 2 faction system, both need to have LIVING playable humans available. The two humans don't have to be equally promientn, but they have to be a group a playing population would aspire to play. This rules out using traitors or gullible brainwashed cultists, no one wants to play those.
I would convert every single toon that i have to Human. That is the one thing i hate about horde is that there are no humans.
Honestly at this point I wouldn't even care if they let any race be apart of any faction.
I mean, not every orc believes in the horde. No every human believes in the alliance.
It would make logical sense.
it seems the bulk of the opposition is largely "humans can't be on the horde or i t will no longer be orcs v humans".. which is a perception issue rather than a genuine one.
Show these guys in a trailer or advert and they'd get it, these humans won't feel like they have anything to do with the alliance. Especially if they use the blood elf model rather than the alliance human model. That would be a very good idea, making the humans both attractive and very different from the alliance both in theme and appearance, it would also make rolling a horde human and alliance human not feel like your rolling the same thing.
Not seeing convincing reasons this won't work well. I can see people struggling to dissociate human from alliance.Very few got far enough of the Syndicate, Defias bros, cultists, and those who didn't like the forsaken being used only had a problem with undeath being curable.. their posts showed they didn't see or understand the presentation -
e.g. one guy it seemed clear felt that the condition been cured meant that this automatically meant you could "cure" every undead at any time, it felt like he thought the end of the undead was being proposed clearly what is not been said
Last edited by Mace; 2013-10-30 at 08:20 AM.
There are very few posters here who I'm convinced think this is genuinely a bad idea, because only one, possibly 2 have convinced me they've looked at this properly from all the angles and still don't like it.
maybe I'm being stubborn, but this seems a catastrophical change if you're looking at it the wrong way, there are very few ways this can actually work and work well, but you have to see it, tkae the time to read and consider what's been said first, I'm not convinced many opposers are actually doing that.
even though i'm convinced it's a necessary development, I might have agreed with you if it was given as 1 of 2 new races, but the context this could ever be presented as would be as one of quite a number of sub races. I would not find the story boring or unimaginative if it involved a forsaken cure of some sort or a vampire story.
Besides I think giving humans to the horde and in this way is quite imaginative, it's unthinkable, no one would have thought of that, but when you follow the logic through, it actually makes a lot of sense, it reminds me of the time blood elves were made horde, it seemed the unthinkable then too, but at the time it made a lot of sense once it was presented, not everyone liked the move (and this is actually less controversial than that was since Elves had never joined the horde and humans had done so twice, with Alterac and with the Forsaken), but it was a huge success and solved a serious problem.
Last edited by Mace; 2013-10-30 at 04:02 PM.
Why do people say there is no way a human would join the horde or an orc would join the alliance? There is no way a Klingon would join Starfleet but Worf did it. Why can't there be some quest, it could be a really hard quest, along the lines of a legendary or something, that a character can complete that would allow them to hop to the other faction, no matter what their race is. So maybe it would be rare to see an Orc welcomed in Stormwind. Hell it happened in EQ, it was hard as hell but you could be a dark elf and be welcomed in east freeport. Some people would still treat you like crap, but whatever.
Adds an interesting depth to the game I think, especially if you put it behind a quest like that. It could even line up with lore as you burning your allegiance with one faction to join the other, and you could never go back. As a whole, yes, Humans won't join the Horde, but one human betraying his kind to bend the knee to Vol'jin? Why not?
I don't expect blizzard to do this, but if they did, I'd be 100% for it. But hey, who cares what I think, how I thought about playable horde blood elves was irrelevant, what happened happened for their own reasons, their own choices
In fact he encourages you to read it again so you'll get it this time!
How else is such an approach to be described except as disgustingly condescending?
Friday week we have Blizzcon, the shocking (it won't be) NON implementation of your ideas and hopefully this can go back into the crackpot for another two years until you both decide to peddlie it again before expansion 6.
Last edited by Obelisk Kai; 2013-10-30 at 04:16 PM.
I mean, blizzard breaks all these imagined rules all the time. Fans make these things as taboo rules, it's fans that say humans can never join the horde, not blizzard - and this is despite many people pointing out in this topic that it has happened twice before, several times over, yet how many people do you see still return to the post and write "no, it can never happen, it would ruin the laws of warcraft, humans can never join the horde" - wanna bet they were paying attention? Score 1 for blanket statements.
Keep the smelly humans OUT of my horde.
I like my uglies as they are. We got the nice little Belf people if we want to look good.