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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by tiffy33 View Post
    wouldnt the money be better spent on scholarships for college and training so people can actually learn to do something? Why not take all the money being wasted on welfare and start up schools those people can go to so they can learn how to do something. Or use the money to create more jobs. Just throwing it away seems like a waste.

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    Its not their money. They didnt earn it and they arent paying it back. Its stealing.
    This is kind of dumb, and you should feel bad for thinking this.

    First, education is great, but welfare is not about the long run. As was mentioned welfare puts food on the table now. Money for college could put food on the table in the future, but damn it I'm hungry tonight. A 16 week course on business administration doesn't feed my family.

    Also, no it's not stealing. It's given. If I GIVE you my laptop, you did nothing to earn it and you won't be paying for it. It was given freely. Is that also stealing?
    Get a grip man! It's CHEESE!

  2. #42
    In the case of fraud, yea.
    "If you want to control people, if you want to feed them a pack of lies and dominate them, keep them ignorant. For me, literacy means freedom." - LaVar Burton.

  3. #43
    Titan Kalis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tiffy33 View Post
    Its not their money. They didnt earn it and they arent paying it back. Its stealing.
    Who are they stealing it off exactly? There is no distinction between people who pay tax and those who legally don't, in any nation that I can think of.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Spectral View Post
    Cosigned heartily. There's plenty of menial work that needs doing. If we're going to pay people to not work, we may as well pay them to work instead.
    Most Welfare systems are set up in a way that make people do that.
    You think a lot of those people cleaning up shit on the sidewalks of cities are actual employees of the state/county? No. Companies who are tasked to clean that contract threw the welfare office and the people on welfare WHO CAN WORK, are made to, or they get nothing.

    Now isn't that a mind fuck? We can contract welfare people out to, "parks and rec" and make them work for under min wadge, but we cannot just higher them TO parks and rec. ^_^

    It's astounding how many people on here LOVE to talk about this, and it's the same people, week after week, month after month, year after year, and they still are totally not read up on all the varities of welfare and the requirements to be on it.


    Edit: to throw an even bigger wrinkle into this drama. The work requirement many times can be waved if the person is going to school but even then they must maintain the equilv of a B for their GPA and so on.
    Last edited by Tastyfish; 2013-10-16 at 09:30 PM.
    "If you want to control people, if you want to feed them a pack of lies and dominate them, keep them ignorant. For me, literacy means freedom." - LaVar Burton.

  5. #45
    Elemental Lord Dezerte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RICH8472 View Post
    If I had my way there would be compulsory work for the able bodied if they wanted to collect benefits, simple tasks such as grounds keeping, street cleaning or helping other members of society such as the elderly. Not full time work of course, they should have plenty of time off to look for proper employment.
    That's essentially how it works here in Sweden.
    To declare that a personal, inner experience gives certainty about the workings of the universe is to assign far too much value to one’s subjective sense of conviction.
    I’m not that arrogant.

    The brain, marvelous instrument though it is, isn’t infallible. It can misfire, seize or hallucinate, and it can do so in a way that’s utterly indistinguishable from reality to the person experiencing it.

  6. #46
    Legendary! Xanjori's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dezerte View Post
    That's essentially how it works here in Sweden.
    Which can also be bad. So many places abuse praktik and never actually hire a worker. Its frustrating as hell to basically "work" for free for 3 months at a place and then just get shuffled on.

  7. #47
    Elemental Lord Dezerte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xanjori View Post
    Which can also be bad. So many places abuse praktik and never actually hire a worker. Its frustrating as hell to basically "work" for free for 3 months at a place and then just get shuffled on.
    That is true, especially if it's a place of work which wasn't constructive to your own development; essentially it would feel like slave labor.
    To declare that a personal, inner experience gives certainty about the workings of the universe is to assign far too much value to one’s subjective sense of conviction.
    I’m not that arrogant.

    The brain, marvelous instrument though it is, isn’t infallible. It can misfire, seize or hallucinate, and it can do so in a way that’s utterly indistinguishable from reality to the person experiencing it.

  8. #48
    Brewmaster Zangeiti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RICH8472 View Post
    Welfare is not a loan, it is supposed to help people survive until they get a job (in theory), forcing people to pay it back will either encourage crime to pay for it or not to come off welfare at all to avoid paying it back.
    Yeah but do you see anyone hoping of the welfare train...
    Clancy's watching.

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Xanjori View Post
    Which can also be bad. So many places abuse praktik and never actually hire a worker. Its frustrating as hell to basically "work" for free for 3 months at a place and then just get shuffled on.
    At my work (Denmark) we have a "praktik" workplan with the region welfare program. They do a simple 3-4 hours work, 5 days a week (Mon-fri) and are then able to continue collecting welfare. At the same time, we cant use this people to fill out job openings while on Welfare and in the end we either give them a recommendation, Shared salary (50% by the government, 50% by our work) or full time work depending on the attitude.

    Some people don't like to come work at our place because it's a discount grocery store, but in the end, it's your own fault for sitting on your ass for almost 3-4 years without doing any kind of work whatsoever, and just collecting money. Don't like the choice made by your regional welfare department? Then get moving and do something (No, 1 application a week is not trying. Waiting on answers are just as silly, you won't get one from 90% of them)

    Volunteer work is a great way to gain new skills and talents and while it might sound silly to work some places for free, it's even dumber to try and get hired when there's a 4 year gap in your resume.

  10. #50
    Scarab Lord Satan's Avatar
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    Most hilarious thread I have read in a while.
    pro-gun liberal

  11. #51
    Despite what some politicians and newspapers like to pretend, welfare isn't paid for out of other people's pockets. At least not in the UK. Its why we have National Insurence taxed from us. Clue is in the name - we're essentially insuring ourselves against unemployment.

    So no. Its not a loan.

  12. #52
    Pandaren Monk gaymer77's Avatar
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    Welfare has higher requirements than just being unemployed or under-employed. You have to have dependents first of all and the amount of money you do get is small. The money you get does not have to be paid back.

  13. #53
    Only if you steal from it. Really people that use SNAP cards shouldt be tax exempt when they buy items with the card. The taxes taken out could go right back into the program and start to become self sufficient

  14. #54
    In most cases no, If you were to commit fraud with it or something then yeah.

  15. #55
    It's sad how much people demonize the poor. Really quite sad.
    Those people, I was one of them - was on welfare and workfare and other assistance, they don't want to be there. I have never used drugs, I knew lots of other people both family members and just friends in same circumstances, and to my knowledge none of them used drugs ever. I'm going off to the 'drug rant', because there have been other posts regarding the issue. I finished college since then, I pay my taxes, and have worked without a break since graduating, so have others that I know of.

    It's quite easy to never be in the position if your parents aren't in it. Because they give you assistance, instead of the government. There isn't much you can do as a kid, and bashing them doesn't help.

    Sure there are people that abuse the system, but there are people that abuse every system, there are people who are collecting government checks and don't work - congress. There are people who sleep with bosses and blackmail them, there are people who do all kinds of bad things, and take advantage of anything they can. The majority of these people are not on welfare - not if they are good at stealing and cheating.

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