Thread: Mind Spike idea

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  1. #21
    Stood in the Fire espoire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dierdre View Post
    amber on paragons
    Who kills amber? Just kill the boss before it can hit and watch it overheal a full HP one.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    And also now we can design gear to show off the male human high res nipples/chest hair.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by espoire View Post
    Who kills amber?
    People not outgearing the encounter?

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Dierdre View Post
    People not outgearing the encounter?
    Even if you're undergeared it's still easier to not kill the amber, you just force it to cast onto some target you don't care about then hard swap & kill Korven.


    Druid / Demon Hunter SimulationCraft Maintainer

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by aggixx View Post
    Even if you're undergeared it's still easier to not kill the amber, you just force it to cast onto some target you don't care about then hard swap & kill Korven.
    That's one way to do it.

    We rather kill amber, switching feels like ~20s of lost damage to me.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Dierdre View Post
    That's one way to do it.

    We rather kill amber, switching feels like ~20s of lost damage to me.
    I tend to just make sure I have DPx2/x3 for ambers and MF:I them, don't think mind spike would beat that.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Angelicat View Post
    I tend to just make sure I have DPx2/x3 for ambers and MF:I them, don't think mind spike would beat that.
    That's what I said.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dierdre View Post
    Exactly. It's all about knowing how long the bugger's gonna live. If it's gonna last more than ~11 -12s, you're better off with DoTs + MF. Otherwise you should be spiking UNLESS you have 3 orbs (and you need that bugger to die NOW e.g. amber on paragons), then DP + MFI >>> spike.
    Still, if you're not at 3 orbs (because delaying DPs is pretty much always a bigger dps loss), spike x 2 + instant MB hence extra orb is a nice boost. Same goes for kunchong thingies.

    As I said, it's not like you have things awfully more important to glyph; I run paragons with Glyph of Mind Flay, Weakened Soul and Mind Spike.
    Last edited by Dierdre; 2013-10-19 at 08:46 AM.

  7. #27
    Right now it's a dumb spell, with its niche being level 85 mobs in Jade Forest or something, or trying to burst down something that's almost at execute but not quite, and Mind Blast is on cooldown, and it doesn't have enough overall health to justify dots. Since the changes with it in 5.2 it's just been a broken spell, in the same way Holy Fire was lolhardtojustify for the longest time until they eventually fixed it.

    Also, even though at one point it was viable if you used the talent and glyph, pre-nerf, you shouldn't have to burn a talent and a glyph just to make something viable.

    Here's how to fix it. Take away the garbage 'removes dots' effect and make it instant cast with charges, similar to a Warlock's Conflagrate. This is a two-bird-stone scenario, giving us something that we can briefly cast on the move.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Illyia View Post
    Right now it's a dumb spell, with its niche being level 85 mobs in Jade Forest or something, or trying to burst down something that's almost at execute but not quite, and Mind Blast is on cooldown, and it doesn't have enough overall health to justify dots. Since the changes with it in 5.2 it's just been a broken spell, in the same way Holy Fire was lolhardtojustify for the longest time until they eventually fixed it.

    Also, even though at one point it was viable if you used the talent and glyph, pre-nerf, you shouldn't have to burn a talent and a glyph just to make something viable.

    Here's how to fix it. Take away the garbage 'removes dots' effect and make it instant cast with charges, similar to a Warlock's Conflagrate. This is a two-bird-stone scenario, giving us something that we can briefly cast on the move.
    You haven't ready any of the rest of this thread have you?

  9. #29
    I've read the entirety of the thread, thank you very much. I can read something, respectfully disagree, and throw in my two cents on a useful way to redesign the spell - what the thread was initially about 'if you read it.' =)

    I'd rather SW:Pain a small add and have the heightened chance of Divine Insight proccing, finding that + Mind Flay on something that needs to die to be overall more useful. Even if it's a ToF fight, with numerous adds, I've yet, in my personal experience, to find Mind Spike superior to SW:Pain + Mind Flay or SW:Pain + Mind Sear.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Illyia View Post
    I can read something, respectfully disagree
    I respectfully disagree.

    The thread was initially about "It is pretty much useless in it's current state" (sic), which we've pointed out is a misinformed opinion.
    Last edited by Dierdre; 2013-10-20 at 04:23 AM.

  11. #31
    Mind Spike is a solution to a very small subset of problems. But its great for that because without it, we would be really screwed in those scenarios. Like Garrosh MCs, without Mind Spike we would be unable to contribute meaningfully to breaking the MC. I also used it on Siegecrafter when the Shredders would do Death from Above. If I didnt have 3 orbs ready to DP than MF:I on them, I would spike spam for those 5 seconds.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0H3-N9zoI5c Amazing video of 60+ devilsaurs raiding Undercity!


    My God, what a horrible creation. People seeing what they want? Thank God they tried to shy away from that. I know it pisses me off when I'm in an heroic raid, yet in the back of my head all I can think is 'some casual player is playing a heroic dungeon and not wiping.' -Vodkarn

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Nestar View Post
    No it does not.

    Flay is 3147 (+ 150% of Spell power) Over 3 seconds base
    Spike is 1304 to 1376 (+ 130.4% of Spell power) 1.5 second cast

    Plus if you're running Glyph of Mind Spike, You'll fit a Mind Blast after your second Spike which is instant cast 2693 to 2844 (+ 190.9% of Spell power) and also gives an orb. You'd likely get one of these in every 5-6 Mind Spike casts.

    - - - Updated - - -


    That kind of attitude is just being bad, plain and simple. If something needs to die, eg banners/totems on Galkras and Nazgrim and you aren't doing your part to kill it. Then you really do not deserve to be in that raid. The added benefit to be able to proc a talent like ToF is also valuable
    The raid loses DPS when a Spriest starts Mind Spiking adds, so you're the one not playing your class properly and costing your guild kills. I specified trash, but I'll go ahead and apply it to nonsense like Nazgrim too.

    I agree with the guy above. Using it is a possibility if you're clowning around and don't have a DP waiting to do many times the damage in a 10 second period.
    Last edited by tiporispit; 2013-10-20 at 05:59 PM.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by tiporispit View Post
    The raid loses DPS when a Spriest starts Mind Spiking adds, so you're the one not playing your class properly and costing your guild kills. I specified trash, but I'll go ahead and apply it to nonsense like Nazgrim too.
    Because this:

    Quote Originally Posted by tiporispit View Post
    If something is going to die in less than 10 seconds, I usually go grab a beer, take a piss and let the classes designed for that handle it.
    is surely a bigger DPS gain.

    Using mind spike isn't "clowning around", it's knowing your spec and the fight well enough as to determine which tool is better for a given situation. A mediocre damage dealer can top DPS meters. A good dps player maximizes damage while prioritizing things that need to die first, and for that you will occasionally need to use Mind Spike. Not doing so will indeed cost your guild more kills than not padding meters with zombie noxxic dps, as any player who wiped to Elegon or Garrosh's MC can tell you.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by tiporispit View Post
    The raid loses DPS when a Spriest starts Mind Spiking adds, so you're the one not playing your class properly and costing your guild kills. I specified trash, but I'll go ahead and apply it to nonsense like Nazgrim too.

    I agree with the guy above. Using it is a possibility if you're clowning around and don't have a DP waiting to do many times the damage in a 10 second period.
    Exactly the opposite actually, a DP will do more damage on a target with full dots rolling than it will on a target that will die 4 seconds into its duration. If overall damage is your goal, DP is wasted on adds. As we've tried to explain to you multiple times. Mind Spike IS (with numbers to back it up) the best option for something dying between 1-7 seconds. DP is stronger from 8-12 and dots are better at 13+

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by espoire View Post
    Who kills amber?
    No one, 'cause it's immune to damage on HC. And yes, Mind Spike is absolutely useless atm, because the "will die in less than 10 seconds, so it's not worth dotting it" situations don't actually exist, as there's always either something aside of that one thing worth dotting instead, or a Mage will just 1 shot it. If there really is such a thing (Ra-Den orbs literally being the only such thing in this expansion), then it's a high prio target and you'll just sit on 3 orbs until it spawns, 'cause Mind Spike simply doesn't cut it.
    When you cried I'd wipe away all of your tears
    When you'd scream I'd fight away all of your fears
    And I held your hand through all of these years

  16. #36
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by MisterSheep View Post
    I've hit 90 with my priest recently, and was thinking about the sad state of Mind Spike.
    It can be decent during leveling depending on how you play.

    It is pretty much useless in it's current state (at least in PvE) outside of FDCL procs (If you picked that talent)
    Talent is great in 5.4 due to setbonus.

    I understand Blizz doesn't want us to spam MS as part of our regular rotation, but i think it could use some other fix instead of giving it horrible damage.
    Maybe it needs more niches.

    What if MS had charges? 6-8 charges with a 5 second recharge rate, reduced by haste. It would still consume our DoT, but it could be used to rapidly burst an enemy down, and since it has charges, we wouldn't be able to spam it for long. It would give us about 10 seconds of burst when mobs are dying fast, or whenever we need it.
    Maybe something like the old 5.0 Insanity nobody used. Making it do more damage if dots are extinguished. Would need to be careful with FDCL. Yes PvP wise it may not seem cool, but getting a VT and SWP up means you spend time dotting it up.

    Or a reverse Arcane Blast mechanic. Make it deal heavy damage at first, dealing reduced damage with each subsequent casts on the same mob.
    Yeah I imagine that in PvP...

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