Page 2 of 23 FirstFirst
1
2
3
4
12
... LastLast
  1. #21
    Warchief Rizendragon's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Raleigh, North Carolina
    Posts
    2,011
    Quote Originally Posted by Anarchor View Post
    How can people call themselves raiders when they haven't managed to kill him on normal mode or flex mode by now yet?

    I guess even that alone shows how much more casual everything has become since when I raided. :P
    Ok now this looks like a bait post. Please stop trying to turn this into a hardcore vs. casual debate.
    Originally Posted by Bashiok
    The dishonest are want to identify dishonesty, even where it doesn't exist.

  2. #22
    Edit: I don't care if I get infracted for saying this, but I just remembered that Anarchor is creating troll threads over and over again. Stop switching avatar/sigs damn it!

    Note to self; remember his name this time so you don't post in his threads.

    I'm guessing the only reason he isn't banned yet is because the people getting infracted are the ones calling him out. MMO rules are perfect for dedicated trolls though.
    Last edited by Megamisama; 2013-10-21 at 06:30 AM.
    EU first PG wave 30, come at me bros.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Rizendragon View Post
    Ok now this looks like a bait post. Please stop trying to turn this into a hardcore vs. casual debate.
    Not having killed Garrosh yet on normal mode after 6 weeks, I can somewhat understand... although barely since they moved all the challenging encounters to heroic mode nowadays.

    But not even on flex? How? That sounds to me that only 2% still takes raiding seriously.
    ♦ Scepticist ♦ Critic ♦ INTJ

  4. #24
    That's the reason why WOW is an elitism game now. So much exclusive content and so unfriendly raid modes for the majority of players. We will continue to see the subscribers diminishing in the future.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Anarchor View Post
    Not having killed Garrosh yet on normal mode after 6 weeks, I can somewhat understand... although barely since they moved all the challenging encounters to heroic mode nowadays.

    But not even on flex? How? That sounds to me that only 2% still takes raiding seriously.
    because Garrosh wasn't out on flex for 6 weeks.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by billielecter View Post
    So much exclusive content and so unfriendly raid modes for the majority of players.
    Flex largely seems appropriately tuned for your 'beer league' content, as it were. It's still clearly treated as a second-class mode to the normal/heroic raids, but it seems tuned right around where it was intended to be, overall.

    You can also argue that the things it lacks, such as the War Wolf mount, the title, and the Tusks of Mannoroth shoulders, are intended to be the carrot on a stick for people to do normal mode. I don't think I'd be horribly surprised if normal mode ends up being phased out at some point down the line, though.

  7. #27
    Legendary!
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Behind You
    Posts
    6,567
    Quote Originally Posted by billielecter View Post
    So much exclusive content
    If clearing normal or even flex mode is 'exclusive' content then just finding the power button to turn on the computer must be 'exclusive' too
    We have faced trials and danger, threats to our world and our way of life. And yet, we persevere. We are the Horde. We will not let anything break our spirits!"

  8. #28
    Immortal Destil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Kanda's House
    Posts
    7,709
    The 2% translates to people who have actually finished the instance. The LFR portion of SoO isn't even out yet. Not that many people have cleared Normal mode tbh. That's all.
    Quote Originally Posted by Slowpoke is a Gamer View Post
    Transorcers, Warlords in disguise.
    Writer and journalist for Adventures In Poor Taste (http://www.adventuresinpoortaste.com/)

  9. #29
    I am Murloc! Airwaves's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Australia! G-day Mate!... (We don't really speak like that)
    Posts
    5,669
    It has always been that low. If they didn't add LFR we would be lucky to get 6 bosses in each teir because it wasn't worth the investment time when so few used them.
    Angels and Airwaves
    Aldmeri Dominion - Imperial - Templar - Laethys - High Elf - Assassin - Frostmourne - Orc - Rogue - Sea of Sorrows - Norn - Thief
    Borderlands 2 - Mechromancer - Battlefield 4 - Engineer - Diablo 3 - Wizard

  10. #30
    Mechagnome Steampunk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Outside of Chicago, Il.
    Posts
    738
    Folks raid because that's all there is, in a loose standpoint. Groups of people who don't know each other trying to raid is an unsocial and often un-enjoyable experience. That's part of why you see that 2% finishing something that's been out for coming soon on two months. People can't work together when they don't see those familiar cues to "play along with the rest of the group".

    But with Warcraft's current direction, that is what they're forced into, if they don't wish to PvP and can't get into a Raid guild.

    With so many games providing PvE alternatives to raiding and grinding faction (you know... to freaking raid); I'm surprised WoW hasn't caught on with providing something yet. Heroics are nice, but have grown to feel like a forced treadmill.
    Quote Originally Posted by Basmothel
    Lacking ammo, the forum troll darts into the realm of personal insults and doomsaying; the most primitive means of gaining attention from its peers.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vyadore View Post
    You know something, none of us ruined the game. We make it better. And so do most of you.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Anarchor View Post
    How can people call themselves raiders when they haven't managed to kill him on normal mode or flex mode by now yet?

    I guess even that alone shows how much more casual everything has become since when I raided. :P
    Far more casuals raid normal modes than a segment of "casuals" would like to admit. Even in ICC only a few percent cleared it on normal a couple months after LK was available despite the extra time to gear up on earlier wings. Most normal mode guilds will take likely a couple more months or so to beat normal as it is intended while the more skilled groups will move onto heroics. Nothing has really changed and it supports Blizzards decision to delay LFR which will still release faster than the majority of normal mode raiders clear content.

    If there is any data that could be used from the graph it is the 20% drop in players going from T14-T15 which is close to placing raiding interests back into the minority.
    Last edited by nekobaka; 2013-10-21 at 06:58 AM.

  12. #32
    Immortal Destil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Kanda's House
    Posts
    7,709
    Quote Originally Posted by nekobaka View Post
    Far more casuals raid normal modes than a segment of "casuals" would like to admit.

    If there is any data that could be used from the graph it is the 20% drop in players going from T14-T15 which is close to placing raiding interests back into the minority.
    It's also the fact that a huge majority of raiders, from what I've observed at least, have switched over the Flex Raiding. Flex is really rad (I'm in a Heroic Guild) and I'm glad they added it in, but I'm not surprised if in the process it's significantly dropped the amount of Normal Mode runs of SoO (at least until people are geared through Flex and wanna run Normal).
    Quote Originally Posted by Slowpoke is a Gamer View Post
    Transorcers, Warlords in disguise.
    Writer and journalist for Adventures In Poor Taste (http://www.adventuresinpoortaste.com/)

  13. #33
    Dreadlord Voolawl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Blood Gulch
    Posts
    832
    I do believe this graph shows that only 2% are good enough raiders to complete the content that can't be completed by brain dead monkeys.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kissme View Post
    The problem comes when bad players expect to clear hardmode content as quickly as average or upper echelon players.
    Accept your limitations.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rennadrel View Post
    Admittedly, I enjoy beer more as a beverage that I can appreciate rather then getting drunk.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Destil View Post
    It's also the fact that a huge majority of raiders, from what I've observed at least, have switched over the Flex Raiding. Flex is really rad (I'm in a Heroic Guild) and I'm glad they added it in, but I'm not surprised if in the process it's significantly dropped the amount of Normal Mode runs of SoO (at least until people are geared through Flex and wanna run Normal).
    I wouldnt be surprised if it did. Flex helped bridge that gap between LFR and normal particularly after the developers tried to kill the more casual normal mode guilds and PuGs and shove them into LFR as carries. Flex offers far more flexibility by design and encourages a guild to float a few extra players as buffer and even bring in a new player with out having to sit out a core.

    Even in flex the bulk of the players are taking their time and not trying to rush to the end.
    Last edited by nekobaka; 2013-10-21 at 07:04 AM.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Rizendragon View Post
    Ok now this looks like a bait post. Please stop trying to turn this into a hardcore vs. casual debate.
    That started with the OP and that is the intent of this thread. I'm not gonna join in but have fun if you do.

  16. #36
    People saying OP is wrong - show us YOUR DATA of people that raided last tiers before they got nerfed to hell. Hint: 2% is generous. I haven't looked at the data in months, but months into the last few tiers, less than 30K characters were killing middle bosses deep into the patch. and over a quarter of those were alts.

    It is and HAS BEEN a tiny fraction for years. That fraction obviously goes up once it becomes faceroll free loot 30% nerfs etc.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Destil View Post
    It's also the fact that a huge majority of raiders, from what I've observed at least, have switched over the Flex Raiding. Flex is really rad (I'm in a Heroic Guild) and I'm glad they added it in, but I'm not surprised if in the process it's significantly dropped the amount of Normal Mode runs of SoO (at least until people are geared through Flex and wanna run Normal).
    Im actually ok with this as long as it drives people away from LFR. Flex makes Normal transition so much easier, thus making Normals easier.
    Last edited by Trakanonn; 2013-10-21 at 07:12 AM.
    Free-To-Play is the future.

  17. #37
    Mechagnome Steampunk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Outside of Chicago, Il.
    Posts
    738
    Trakanonn nailed it.

    Well said.
    Quote Originally Posted by Basmothel
    Lacking ammo, the forum troll darts into the realm of personal insults and doomsaying; the most primitive means of gaining attention from its peers.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vyadore View Post
    You know something, none of us ruined the game. We make it better. And so do most of you.

  18. #38
    Herald of the Titans
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    The Frozen Wasteland
    Posts
    2,573
    Quote Originally Posted by Lumineus View Post
    Nope, that's accounted for (6m chars on 2.5m accts), and it's by account, not character. They can tell which accounts have multiple active 90s. Each account has a unique identifier in the armory database (snooping this value allows you to tell if people are trolling their own threads on the official forums).
    As far as I know, character to account matching is done via comparing achievements now.

    The process is fairly simple.

    Load all characters from armory.

    Scan the characters and index a few common account-wide achievements for each one.

    For every character, find all the other characters that have those achievements with the same timestamps. Those characters all belong to the same player.

  19. #39
    You are comparing a year's worth of MSV/HoF/ToES completion rates and 7 months' worth of ToT completion rates with ~2 months of SoO completion rates, or even just a week of Flex completion rate.......yep, a clear apples to apples comparison there and one from which Blizzard should clearly take deep lessons and completely re-design how they deliver content.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by billielecter View Post
    That's the reason why WOW is an elitism game now. So much exclusive content and so unfriendly raid modes for the majority of players. We will continue to see the subscribers diminishing in the future.
    WoW subscriber base grew the most when it had way more exclusive content then it does now. Just sayin.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •