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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Daear View Post
    I don't really understand this line of thinking. Healing is about keeping your raid alive, not getting on top of the meters. If an instant HT keeps a person alive where a rejuv wouldn't, didn't you just do a better job as a healer? Tons of bosses in SoO require healing on select targets rather than just spamming rejuvs on everyone. In predictable heavy raid aoe situations I understand that more powerful rejuvs are better, but that doesn't apply that often in SoO.
    I agree. Sage mender is underrated. Instant HT/RG lowers you HPS but you will cast it anyways.
    A 200K heal that prevent a player from being killed worths a lot more than 2000K heal to top people off.
    Last edited by insanedruid; 2013-10-24 at 09:15 AM.

  2. #22
    Pit Lord Alltat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jurik View Post
    How do you know they're not going to take more damage for 12 seconds?
    By knowing the fights. There aren't that many bosses who shoot randomly targeted single target effects without also doing some kind of AoE at the same time. On a lot of fights, people will take more damage. On other fights, you can be pretty sure that they won't and can let Efflorescence/Ysera/whatever top them off. Either way, if no one is actually taking damage then why are you worried about your healing output? At any time when your throughput actually matters (Norushen, phase two Galakras, Juggernaut siege mode, Garrosh final phase, etc.) overhealing is not going to be a serious issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by h4rr0d View Post
    Could someone explain to me how the sha trinket is the best in slot?
    Because it scales with your gear. The better your gear is, the better the trinket is. It won't be very impressive in flex gear, but if the rest of your gear is best in slot, PPP will be too.
    Diplomacy is just war by other means.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Alltat View Post
    By knowing the fights. There aren't that many bosses who shoot randomly targeted single target effects without also doing some kind of AoE at the same time. On a lot of fights, people will take more damage. On other fights, you can be pretty sure that they won't and can let Efflorescence/Ysera/whatever top them off. Either way, if no one is actually taking damage then why are you worried about your healing output? At any time when your throughput actually matters (Norushen, phase two Galakras, Juggernaut siege mode, Garrosh final phase, etc.) overhealing is not going to be a serious issue.


    Because it scales with your gear. The better your gear is, the better the trinket is. It won't be very impressive in flex gear, but if the rest of your gear is best in slot, PPP will be too.
    So basically for my gear levels (flex, crafted things and an odd 553 from an alt raid), I should stick with something else, probably the relic?

  4. #24
    Thought i'd just add a post here instead of making a new thread.
    I'm also trying to consider when i'm ready to move to t16. Right now my rejuvs are my top healing spell on like, every fight. They are really, really strong with t15-4set. And i also have hc pieces on all my t15 parts.

    Since i'm coming further into Hc's now in SoO we'll start getting t16 hc pieces. All dpsers in my tier has their 4set already, so i figured it would be a good time to start gathering it up. The stat increases may very well be worth the loss of improved rejuv heals.

    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...ramba/advanced

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/guilds/225648/

    Does any resto druid with t16-4piece have any logs where i can compare some fights to?
    Cheers!

  5. #25
    Pit Lord Alltat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by h4rr0d View Post
    So basically for my gear levels (flex, crafted things and an odd 553 from an alt raid), I should stick with something else, probably the relic?
    If you have something better then yes, probably. The PPP scales rather oddly, since it gives a percentage of your other stats and that percentage is higher for better versions of the trinket. That makes it disproportionately good if your gear is good and disproportionately bad if your gear is bad.
    Diplomacy is just war by other means.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanktas View Post
    Thought i'd just add a post here instead of making a new thread.
    I'm also trying to consider when i'm ready to move to t16. Right now my rejuvs are my top healing spell on like, every fight. They are really, really strong with t15-4set. And i also have hc pieces on all my t15 parts.

    Since i'm coming further into Hc's now in SoO we'll start getting t16 hc pieces. All dpsers in my tier has their 4set already, so i figured it would be a good time to start gathering it up. The stat increases may very well be worth the loss of improved rejuv heals.

    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...ramba/advanced

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/guilds/225648/

    Does any resto druid with t16-4piece have any logs where i can compare some fights to?
    Cheers!
    First week with it:
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-cf11k7h7wp1buwea/

    Second week with it:
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-jhoguvn87ejpbwug/

    Prior:
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-6xd7qa9w89xhxz8g/

    I tend to use Iron Juggernaut as the benchmark because it has a mix of a lot of different damage profiles: raid-wide steady aoe damage, spike aoe damage, pure random target damage, tank and off-tank healing, and burst single target damage. In theory this fight should be significantly favorable to 4T15, but my performance has gone from 180 & 190k the 2 weeks prior to 208k and 222k (world 5th druid, 8th overall hps ranking for public logs) afterwards.

    I use 5x normal T16 now, ilvl is ~563.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Jurik View Post
    First week with it:
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-cf11k7h7wp1buwea/

    Second week with it:
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-jhoguvn87ejpbwug/

    Prior:
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-6xd7qa9w89xhxz8g/

    I tend to use Iron Juggernaut as the benchmark because it has a mix of a lot of different damage profiles: raid-wide steady aoe damage, spike aoe damage, pure random target damage, tank and off-tank healing, and burst single target damage. In theory this fight should be significantly favorable to 4T15, but my performance has gone from 180 & 190k the 2 weeks prior to 208k and 222k (world 5th druid, 8th overall hps ranking for public logs) afterwards.

    I use 5x normal T16 now, ilvl is ~563.
    Keep in mind that your monk healer jumps between 10 million effective healing through those three parses. Your DK's self-healing also fell by 6 million after your gear change (Blood Shield mostly) and your raid took an extra 2 million damage in the shortest parse you posted.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Trubo View Post
    Keep in mind that your monk healer jumps between 10 million effective healing through those three parses. Your DK's self-healing also fell by 6 million after your gear change (Blood Shield mostly) and your raid took an extra 2 million damage in the shortest parse you posted.
    Post-hoc justifications are just excuses. Plus, you'll need to work harder to explain how for a supposedly 'clearly inferior' gearing strategy, I can still sustain numbers that are world-topping.

    Some analysis:
    - average rejuv tick dropped by 10% (25.9k -> 23.6k) on the week where the change was made. This indicates a long-term loss of 3.5%, as rejuv was generally in the ballpark of 35% of my overall healing. Some of that is made up for by the fact that overheal did drop about 3%, but that may be negligible.
    - effloresence tick count dropped almost 25%; overheal stayed generally the same. So this is a loss of ~3.5%, as efflo is generally around 15% of my healing.
    - net loss is about 7%.
    - T16 bonuses (Spark of Life and any contribution from HT -- I don't cast it outside of significant Sage Mender stacks) accounted for 6-7% of my healing both weeks where I was using the set. Most fights where healing is relevant, it is between 5-7%.

    My conclusions after evaluating the set for 2 raids:
    - The raw drop in healing contribution from T15 bonuses is approximately 7% (~3.5% from a 10% decrease in rejuv strength, and ~3.5% decrease in efflo)
    - T16 bonuses are significant output (6-7%), which directly make up for most of this deficit.
    - The rest of the deficit should be and is recovered through higher base stats, including higher spirit allowing me to push harder for longer.
    - 2T16 bonus allows for more clutch healing, so has actually tremendous value beyond simply the numbers that it generates.

    Ask yourself: why are you so resistant to just trying it yourself and generating your own numbers?

    I did, and discovered that not only am I getting better numbers, but I now have a useful mini-cooldown in Sage Mender.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Jurik View Post
    Ask yourself: why are you so resistant to just trying it yourself and generating your own numbers?

    I did, and discovered that not only am I getting better numbers, but I now have a useful mini-cooldown in Sage Mender.
    I stated the t15 effective increase at around 8% on the first page and was shouted down immediately.

    Everything you've said matches my own experiences. I've had the 4p bonus for about a month now, and already I'm finding it hard to imagine healing 10m without it. Everyone who has it who has contributed to this thread has said the same thing - it is more important to have that heal when you need it than extra healing on something that you can't rely on.

    No doubt this will be shouted down again, but if you have the opportunity to upgrade, do it. Get a nice weakaura for your sagemender and you'll notice a difference. Perhaps my experiences are different because I heal with a disc priest who doesn't snipe heals for the sake of it, but I've had no problem smashing rankings since obtaining the set.

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