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  1. #1

    Why are we dying???

    I'm the warlock, just btw.

    Why are we struggling to kill norushen each week? We clear 13/14 one night, and put in attempts on garrosh, but we always snag at norushen.

    Last week we wiped once and barely got it the second time

    this week a lot were dead, and barely got it again.

    We're honestly just going through it with extra heals, but what's killing us? Someone in our group linked me the "logs" but i'm not too familiar with them


    thanks

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...he2b/rankinfo/

  2. #2
    Just took a quick glimpse at the logs and I can tell you a couple of things:
    1. If you are not struggling with the enrage timer consider 3 healing this as it tends to get quite rough near the end
    2. The windwalker is doing much less dps than the rest of you guys (didn't check him out so I can't really say if that's because of poor gear or what)
    3. Are the small adds buffing the boss? Check if he's not going too high on the buff
    4. Are you doing the healer "tests"? After our portion of wiping on him we've agreed that cleansing healers is a waste of time and orbs.
    5. What orb setup are you doing? My guild is currently going with: 2xdps > tank+dps > 2xdps > tank+dps

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by banadona View Post
    Just took a quick glimpse at the logs and I can tell you a couple of things:
    1. If you are not struggling with the enrage timer consider 3 healing this as it tends to get quite rough near the end
    2. The windwalker is doing much less dps than the rest of you guys (didn't check him out so I can't really say if that's because of poor gear or what)
    3. Are the small adds buffing the boss? Check if he's not going too high on the buff
    4. Are you doing the healer "tests"? After our portion of wiping on him we've agreed that cleansing healers is a waste of time and orbs.
    5. What orb setup are you doing? My guild is currently going with: 2xdps > tank+dps > 2xdps > tank+dps
    Windwalker is mainspec healer!
    No healer tests
    tank dps
    dps tank
    dps dps
    tank dps
    tank whenever


    i think #3 could be a thing, what do you mean buffing the boss

  4. #4
    looking at this:
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...?s=1496&e=1787

    we can see that you're letting a lot of the little guy's casts get off and hit the boss, I'm not sure what you're doing but are you sending everyone down at like 60% or somthing? whats your rotation for putting people in. This week you had one guy get melee'd by a manifestation a tank error, and the other took a lot of damage due to the little adds getting their casts off and not getting enough heals to counter it on him.

    last week you guys just didn't pick up the balls fast enough.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." -Friedrich Nietzsche

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Blood fox View Post
    looking at this:
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...?s=1496&e=1787

    we can see that you're letting a lot of the little guy's casts get off and hit the boss, I'm not sure what you're doing but are you sending everyone down at like 60% or somthing? whats your rotation for putting people in. This week you had one guy get melee'd by a manifestation a tank error, and the other took a lot of damage due to the little adds getting their casts off and not getting enough heals to counter it on him.

    last week you guys just didn't pick up the balls fast enough.

    We are probably letting a lot of the little guys get the cast off, is there anyway to counteract when they get the stack on the boss? like a purge, or just don't let it happen?

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Entarium View Post
    Windwalker is mainspec healer!
    No healer tests
    tank dps
    dps tank
    dps dps
    tank dps
    tank whenever


    i think #3 could be a thing, what do you mean buffing the boss
    I can't remember what the spell name is, which the little adds cast. What I can tell you is that each time their cast (the little grey cloud bolt thing) reaches the boss, it buffs his damage by 5% for 15 seconds. The small adds can be interrupted, and players can also position themselves to intercept the cast. Iirc, intercepting it does around 100k damage to that player, but it's still preferable to a buff on the boss.

  7. #7
    ok your last post, your healers should go in, 25% extra healing is no laughing matter.

    that and your dps are obviously not focusing on adds>boss
    for example your warlock did 13m ont he small ones
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...&s=1496&e=1787
    and your rogue did
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...&s=1496&e=1787
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." -Friedrich Nietzsche

  8. #8
    Stood in the Fire Winkle's Avatar
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    I just looked at your logs, two people appear to die, perhaps from mob aggro? The only damage you take is from the unavoidable aoe the the boss does and occassionally from the orbs that need soaking, but that's only momentary until they're picked up.

    You appear to solo tank it, which obviously means the solo tank takes a decent chunk of damage being at 75% or perhaps even 100% corruption the whole time. But it's not absurd amounts either. You could always two tank it if you want to reduce the healing requirments, or if you tank dies often.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Entarium View Post
    We are probably letting a lot of the little guys get the cast off, is there anyway to counteract when they get the stack on the boss? like a purge, or just don't let it happen?
    intercept the projectile, with your healers there are no ground effects so they should get too mad if you do that, still should kill them.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." -Friedrich Nietzsche

  10. #10
    Have your melee stand in front of the tiny floating adds and gg

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Blood fox View Post
    ok your last post, your healers should go in, 25% extra healing is no laughing matter.

    that and your dps are obviously not focusing on adds>boss
    for example your warlock did 13m ont he small ones
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...&s=1496&e=1787
    and your rogue did
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...&s=1496&e=1787
    i am the lock and also the raid lead, i do make it a point to kill adds but range has it easier i suppose.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Winkle View Post
    I just looked at your logs, two people appear to die, perhaps from mob aggro? The only damage you take is from the unavoidable aoe the the boss does and occassionally from the orbs that need soaking, but that's only momentary until they're picked up.

    You appear to solo tank it, which obviously means the solo tank takes a decent chunk of damage being at 75% or perhaps even 100% corruption the whole time. But it's not absurd amounts either. You could always two tank it if you want to reduce the healing requirments, or if you tank dies often.
    we two tank it, we just weren't intercepting projectiles, thanks tho

  12. #12
    You can actually stand between the little add and the boss. That way you take some minor dmg but the boss won't get the buff. My guild is easily 1 shoting him since we downed him for the first time and NEVER sent healers inside the orbs. We did so on our "attempt" pulls but our main healer said he is getting jack sh*t out of it as he was doingsame healing as before he entered the orb so we stopped doing that. I know the Dungeon Journal states otherwise but we've learnt it the hard way.

  13. #13
    One of the most important aspects of this fight is getting the adds down. DPS need to be aware that they do BETTER damage against them before they do their test than they do against the boss. Hell, before the 2nd group goes down they should make sure the adds are cleaned up some. Same with each subsequent group or you can easily get overrun.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by banadona View Post
    You can actually stand between the little add and the boss. That way you take some minor dmg but the boss won't get the buff. My guild is easily 1 shoting him since we downed him for the first time and NEVER sent healers inside the orbs. We did so on our "attempt" pulls but our main healer said he is getting jack sh*t out of it as he was doingsame healing as before he entered the orb so we stopped doing that. I know the Dungeon Journal states otherwise but we've learnt it the hard way.
    The main reason you send healers down is so they can soak orbs from the large adds. Has nothing to do with increasing their numbers since you don't gain a buff by going down you lose a debuff that affects dmg output against the boss.

  14. #14
    By the end of the fight it seems that you take a reasonable amount of damage from Residual corruption, that shouldn't happen.
    The person that have to soak it should know it and stand on the add when he dies, so that you don't take any tick of it.
    Warrior soloing spreadsheet.

    Ittle Dew (Any%): 12:13
    Super Meat Boy (Any%): 21:50

  15. #15
    Stood in the Fire Winkle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Entarium View Post
    we two tank it, we just weren't intercepting projectiles, thanks tho
    Your logs don't really show that, but i'll take your word for it. Your monk tank takes more damage from Noroshen normal than either of our tanks take on hc.

  16. #16
    I'd reccomend that if you have a trial time where you're doing double dps you have the dps go down first because the raid damage at that time is lowest and it'll increase your overall boss damage since you'll get purified dps out quicker.

    Consider sending the disc priest down at some point, maybe in place of one of the other tanks going down again? You can have dps preparing to go down soak orbs rather than having tanks/healers always do it and having a disc priest go down earlier adds not only healing, but dps as well. After you hit 50% you really shouldn't have to send anyone else down.


    Thanks Shyama for the awesome Signature

  17. #17
    Casual raid group here but we 2 tank 3 heal it. Never have a problem with it.
    We send everyone one to a trial as well. Order DPS + Healer, DPS + Tank, DPS + Healer, DPS + Tank and DPS + Healer. We have the next group going in grab the orb of the previous so we can clear it on the trial. Once the tanks get out we have them eat the orbs after all groups are done.

    My group make up is:

    Tanks
    P.War (Me)
    P.Pali

    Healers
    D.Priest
    R.Druid
    R.Shaman

    DPS
    Enh.Shaman
    Rogue
    Hunter
    B.Druid
    Warlock

    I drop raid markers by each one of the 2 spawn points and assing tanks and healers to Blue and DPS to the red Markers for entering the trial so none gets confused on where to go. Out order goes B.Druid and D.Priest. Once Druid gets out the focus on nothing but the boss. Meanwhile everyones priority is adds then boss. Next group in is Enh.Shaman and P.Pali. Once the Shaman gets out the Druid and Shaman switch. Shaman full time boss and druid now on adds. Next group in is Hunter and R.Druid. Once out same priority as before. Next group in is Rouge and P.Warrior. Once out the Rogue is full time on the boss. Next group in is Warlock and R.Shmana. Once out same prioirty as before. Since we started doing it this way we have had no problems at all. We also send the next person in as soon as the person they are replacing is out so we do not wait to get anyone in a orb.

  18. #18
    Can see from your logs that the boss had 8 stacks of the damage buff from the small adds at one point. You need to tell your DPS that if an add is up it is top priority. Damage done to the adds transfers to the boss anyway, and they take full damage from corrupted DPS. But have your melee stand in front of the small adds to kill them, tanks should always have their back to a small add, healers and ranged can try to stay in between the boss and where the small adds spawn anyway.

    But you're doing fine damage-wise and then dying to silly mistakes and raidwide AOE, why are you 2 healing this again? Just 3 heal it... Once you can meet the enrage the fight is easy enough. Either 3 heal it or purify one of your healers first.

  19. #19
    I'm not to good at reading the logs, but from what I can tell it seems you are suffering from what we (the guild I'm in) were suffering from a few weeks ago, mainly not stopping the adds effectively.

    We have a 100% caster oriented group, ye we super wizard like that, but once we started controlling and taking down the adds instantly when they spawn it just became a smooth sailing, as long as you don't feel that the enrage is a problem there is no excuse from being sloppy on the adds. Just get your people to control and kill adds faster and more effectively.

    That's the only part I can think of that would cause troubles on that fight, thought you were talking about heroics first (and when I saw the thread first I thought it was a philosophical topic ^_^)

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    One of the most important aspects of this fight is getting the adds down. DPS need to be aware that they do BETTER damage against them before they do their test than they do against the boss. Hell, before the 2nd group goes down they should make sure the adds are cleaned up some. Same with each subsequent group or you can easily get overrun.

    - - - Updated - - -



    The main reason you send healers down is so they can soak orbs from the large adds. Has nothing to do with increasing their numbers since you don't gain a buff by going down you lose a debuff that affects dmg output against the boss.
    We actually make the people that are to go to the orbs next soak the goo so that healers just have to focus on healing. Me and the other tank can soak pretty much everything else down from 40%

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