Census Bureau Shock - Welfare recipients now outnumber full time workers.

[mvaliz]

lol, that's a pretty pretzel logic Godwin there. I suppose if you ignore the racial, religious, and every other thing the Hitler believed in you'd be right. Then again, I'm betting you're breathing air right now, and I'm pretty sure Hitler breathed air as well. Using your logic you must be a Nazi, no?

What religious/any other thing were you referring to on Hitler's platform?

No - he referred to the Jews as "thieves"... he referred to them as people who stole money and power from the citizens, and told the citizens to rebel against them.

Hitler did not publicly demonstrate against Jewish people at all based on any religious beliefs. He instilled fear that they were secretly taking control of Germany and their citizens to steal their money and power. No damn different than the Libertarian/Tea Party platform, just casting out a wider net.

[Cthulhu 2020]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_propaganda

The Jews were blamed for things such as robbing the German people of their hard work while themselves avoiding physical labour.

Soon after the takeover of power in 1933, concentration camps were established for political opponents. The first people that were sent to the camps were Communists. They were sent because of their ties with the Soviet Union and because Nazism greatly opposed Communism.

Half of the propaganda machine that was spear headed by the Nazi party was economic, and as shown above, frighteningly similar to what we hear parroted today. The other half was racial purity and the cleansing of non Germans or others of close European descent from Germany.

[Wildtree]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_propaganda

I think this is a bit inaccurate, judging by the tons of first hand feedbacks I've had over the years.
You know, I don't trust anyone more on that matter, than the people who actually lived the times, and not what the books wrote down about it.

The feedback I've had from all kinds of directions boils literally down to money. Not one person has ever expressed any negative comment towards Jews. Fact of the matter is, how Jews live and did so already back then, in our societies fully integrated. For the time and situation, these people have been Germans. They were part of their communities. They've spoken the same language, their kids went to the same schools, and they were fully integrated, just like every other neighbor and friend.
There was no hate against the average Jew. Fuck, most people didn't even have an idea how their neighbor was jewish, until the Gestapo came and abducted them.

Where Jews come into the picture is, when it comes to money. Trade, Business and Finances have traditionally always been a strong trait for many Jews. And it happened, that the country's entire remaining wealth was concentrated with very few. Coincidentally (??) many of those have been Jews. Many of the money lenders who charged interest rates that were nothing more then highway robbery (up to several hundred percent), have been Jews.
THOSE were the Jews that the population itself developed anger and hatred against. Imo completely understandable even.
And since the NSDAP ran on the inequality of the country's and it's peoples financial situation, the population bought into that part easily.
Just wanted to bring that into the equation


Anyhow..... OT: the " anti-social clown factor" is strong in this thread, it seems.
I love those kind of people who advocate how welfare is something negative. Big mouthing and slandering those who have a need for it..
I claim.... Whoever advocates that, is only a rather undereducated individual or an outright hypocrite.
There is not a single person or business, that does not benefit from "government handouts".
Where's the difference in receiving a few hundred dollars every month from a welfare check, and someone making very good money, but writing off at least the same amount from the taxes. Possibly even collecting a hefty tax return check?
Everyone benefits. Be it mortgage write offs, be it leasing contract write offs, be it investment write offs, hell - even donation write offs. And the list goes on.
Every single individual receives money from the government. Not having to pay it is essentially the same thing, since that's income the government apparently doesn't have. So it is a passive handout.

Somehow I sometimes wish for everyone in that anti-social camp to have shit poured onto them one way or another, that they themselves suddenly find them in a situation where they will have to rely on the government and it's social net. It's but a small step from prosperity to poor. For all it needs is having a little bit of very bad luck. A medical condition that puts you out of work for good, and by the time your disability claim passed, you are so deep in debt, that you lost your shiny ride, your house is at foreclosure, your credit score is ruined. And at the end of the day, you come to realize how the disability check doesn't cover your lifestyle. You are unable to pay your bills anymore. In fact, you become reliant on Welfare and/or other handouts by the government.

That I wanted to add to the equation too...

[mvaliz]

I think this is a bit inaccurate, judging by the tons of first hand feedbacks I've had over the years.
You know, I don't trust anyone more on that matter, than the people who actually lived the times, and not what the books wrote down about it.

The feedback I've had from all kinds of directions boils literally down to money. Not one person has ever expressed any negative comment towards Jews. Fact of the matter is, how Jews live and did so already back then, in our societies fully integrated. For the time and situation, these people have been Germans. They were part of their communities. They've spoken the same language, their kids went to the same schools, and they were fully integrated, just like every other neighbor and friend.
There was no hate against the average Jew. Fuck, most people didn't even have an idea how their neighbor was jewish, until the Gestapo came and abducted them.
-snip-

Oh HOLY SHIT!!!!! Are you actually frigging serious!?!

OK son, you want a 1st hand account?

I'll take my mother's over yours, as she grew up in Nazi Germany and eventually moved here when she was 18.

No hate for the average Jew? /cracks knuckles

My mother's parents owned a store in Essen, Germany. A small average little grocery shop.

EVERYBODY shunned Jews from their store and they couldn't get food - even posting signs out in there windows with "No Jews allowed", so my grandparents actually secretly opened their shops at night and sold their goods to Jews in the back alley of the store - just to feed them, risking public ostraziation as being labeled a "Jew Lover". My Grandmother did this while her husband (who adored Hitler) was away... as she was one of the few who saw them as human beings and not the problem.

Later in life, my Mother actually met and befrended one of the daughters who was Jewish who came to her store - and they remained friends until she died.

Would you like me to share the story of how my Grandfather, who adored Hitler, reacted when he went to a hill on the hospital and found a mass grave?

So, don't give me this BS that "There was no hate for the average Jew in Nazi Germany". The only diff is that the average citizen didn't warrant or want anything like a concentration camp for them (most were shocked to find out those existed). However - being Ostracized, criticized, publicly derided, degraded and insulted were the norm when Hitler came into power.

No different than what the Tea Party is doing with "takers"... creating an enemy for people to fear to unite them.

Go read a damn history book, or broaden your "1st hand accounts" as they're SERIOUSLY questionable if you're coming up with that kind of blathering...

[Anodur]

The Koch Brothers?

Where were you railing against them with their $50,000 a person fundraiser ticket for Mitt Romney's campaign in 2012?

But a fundraiser @ $40,000 per plate for the Obama campaign wasn't a lot? These are arbitrary lines here.

[Mayhem]

But a fundraiser @ $40,000 per plate for the Obama campaign wasn't a lot? These are arbitrary lines here.

obviously it is alot and you have to find out who sponsored obama to see what interests are on the agenda

that was the point, you can´t be against big tax evading companies and be pro tea party at the same time, that doesn´t make much sense if you know where the money for the tea party came from

[Anodur]

obviously it is alot and you have to find out who sponsored obama to see what interests are on the agenda

that was the point, you can´t be against big tax evading companies and be pro tea party at the same time, that doesn´t make much sense if you know where the money for the tea party came from

Is the "tax evasion" you're talking about legal? What some people call "tax evasion" doesn't break any laws.

[Mayhem]

Is the "tax evasion" you're talking about legal? What some people call "tax evasion" doesn't break any laws.

evasion isn´t a synonym for illegality, it doesn´t even matter much, it probably is legal, though i´ve seen a youtube video of a government hearing in the UK where the comapnies that help with tax evasion guarantee no more than 50% legality, you can be against legal tax evasion and you probably should be when you take into account how much taxes are lost due to tax evasion and loopholes

[Kathandira]

Just add prospective Living Wages for a person living alone. Not married, and has no children. In NJ it costs roughly 30k a year to live alone. That is about $14.50 an hour 40 hours a week, 52 weeks a year.

If you like I can list out the costs of each thing you need to survive as a typical person. Rent/Car insurance/Food/Phone/Electricity/Water/Gas and so on.

[Masark]

There's this remarkable concept called undertaxing, and guess what, we're doing it.

Impossible! The slope of the laffer curve is always negative!

Don't know much about the 19th century do you.

A glorious era when the working man was kept in his place to work for the enrichment of his betters.

Solyndra was obviously a case of capitalism gone wrong. The market decided to let the government pick winners and losers. The market failed.

-Mental gymnastics as performed by an MMO-C socialist.

You might do a little research on why Solyndra went down. You might also investigate the other companies funding under that program and the success rate.

[ringpriest]

You might do a little research on why Solyndra went down. You might also investigate the other companies funding under that program and the success rate.

That would require doing research AND questioning beliefs. Swine will fly to ski resorts in hell first.

[Nightspear]

Many socialist/communist countries have delivered far greater growth than we have seen in the west. I really like history, and it seems for most case, people are forgetting that a lot of economist in the 1960's actually thought Russia would win the race to become the economic world leader. Not that they ever got as rich as the west, but the anual growth of BNP was that much higher (up untill about 1980)

[Rendia]

Another HUGE factor to consider is that there is a LOT of land out there that is DIRT cheap.

For example, in Los Angeles, rent can be quite expensive. But you COULD move to Lancaster, about 45 minutes out of town, and rent is cheap. Homes cost $100k. A married couple working at about the minimum wage, each bringing in $10/hr, earns $28k per year. A mortgage payment is just $650/month, which is HALF what you would pay to RENT in Los Angeles itself.

But, people don't want to do that. They want to live where rent is crazy high, and work for minimal pay, and complain its not fair.

If it is 1980, there is NO way two people making minimum wage could have a home mortgage and own their own home like that. It would have been a total pipe dream. But NOW, it IS possible, and people complain "well its too far away from the big city!"

Your parents, or grandparents, would have likely JUMPED at the idea to move to Lancaster, CA, own their own home, save money, and live well. But for some reason, young adults today have different expectations. Young adults want to blow their money on huge cable bills or massive overpriced housing so they can feel good that they live in the big city. And then they wonder why they cannot get ahead.

Life IS truly better, but some people don't want to take advantage of it.

I'm gonna have to wave the bullshit flag on this one. I live in the Palmdale/Lancaster area, and have for more than half of my life. First off, there is no way, today, you can get a mortgage payment as low as $650/mo. w/o getting a VA loan or having an almost perfect credit score. Shit, rent on a 1 bedroom apartment out here is more than that. Now I know you are blowing smoke out of your ass, because I actually live here!

Also, Lancaster is about 60-75 minutes out of LA, without traffic. And since when the 14 Freeway was built they didn't count on huge expansion, it is only two lanes wide so it nearly always has traffic.