Moreso to the point though. Item lvl doesn't reflect skill imo or in most peoples opinions I have talked to but blizzard doesn't really give anyone a way to decide how skilled someone is. You can say proving grounds but honestly I would rather look at someones Item lvl than base skill off of proving grounds. PR doesn't prove anything knowing how to reforge for itmlvl 463 gear (or some low level I don't remember off the top of my head). You can say show the achievement but how do you get in to it in the first place if you have to show the ach.
The truth of the matter is players choose item lvl most often because it shows they have at the very least put effort into their character. The 540 for a flex (depending on which wing) is a bit high imo but having a 540 shows you have at-least been able to get through lfr SoO or Heroic ToT at some point. Flex isn't LFR by any means and does require quite abit more skill (at-least on Garrosh) than LFR.
I feel bad for ya but at the same token players in flex don't want to fail but without a reliable system to work off of players are going to have some kind of system to use to try to make sure they succeed.
"Reasonably" is relative. Reasonable for me is at least 535. That way I know, that you most likely will be able to carry your own weight. You don't get to that ilvl, unless you have some Flex/Normal pieces and that you have some experience other than LFR. I get that it can be hard to find a group, if your ilvl is below 530 and at that point Flex is your real aim. But I've said this before, there's just no excuse for not finding a guild or a group via OQueue or Open Raid, that you can go with. I'd think it elitist, if I refused the socials in my guild to join our Flex runs, unless they were 540. But that's cause they're my guildies and that's sorta the whole point of a guild. You make friends and things become easier, cause you have other players who're willing to bring you.
I've even had people ask, if they could join as socials just so that they could be part of our Flex runs. Don't tell me, it's impossible to find a guild that does Flex and is willing to bring you.
But don't talk about this "elitist" attitude when the opposite would be this "leeching" mentality of lower geared players wanting to be boosted by players far more experienced and geared than them.
Mists of Pandaria is responsible.
"Achievement Unlocked: Ahead of the Curve"
Before this, you got around to clearing a raid when you got around to it. No big deal. Now it's all RUSHRUSHRUSH to clear the final boss before the next content patch, unless you're in one of those Cutting Edge guilds which... wait, no, they have to rush too.
This was bad enough, the last thing WoW needed was special snowflake points for accelerating the raid development cycle, espcially when we're getting told the artists "don't have time" to update models, fix BC zones and integrate them into Azeroth, or even to make new dungeons. But now there's a mount involved! Which you need, even if you don't like or won't use it, because otherwise you're looking at sinking another 100+k into meeting whatever the next mount count benchmark is. And that creates a negative environment where there is real anger at anyone found to be "holding back" progression, particularly among more casual players who aren't likely to even have 100k across all their alts.
The massive itemization gulf caused by the introduction of additional difficulty modes, a feature that - let's not kid ourselves - primarily served high end raiders by inducing substantial difficulty creep into Normal mode, doesn't help either, because the grind to stay in competitive gear becomes all-consuming. They need to go back to 13 ilvl tiers, overlapping ranges, and heroic only being a half-tier.
OMG 13:37 - Then Jesus said to His disciples, "Cleave unto me, and I shall grant to thee the blessing of eternal salvation."
And His disciples said unto Him, "Can we get Kings instead?"
Let's ponder this for a second. The point isn't, "We MUST get ilvl 540s w/ achievements, legendary capes, etc." it's "Who is the best possible I can get?" in other words, it's a broadening search, not a "You must be this tall to ride". Your argument however, is "It's elitist if you don't start from the bottom and go up.", what sense does that make when it comes to fulfilling the goal of the group?
Last edited by Monstercloud; 2013-10-28 at 04:51 AM.