Black boxes in cars

[Masark]

In what backwards world does a 'Libertarian' support something like this?

USA. Liberties are for corporations, not humans.

[Orlong]

It's not about a SHORTAGE, it's about fuel conservation just for the sake of conservation.

Well Im sorry but I dont do things just for the sake of doing things

[Reg]

Well Im sorry but I dont do things just for the sake of doing things

Then go faster than the speed limit and get pulled over. If you do the speed limit, you are doing it for fuel conservation, really all there is to it since that is why highway speed limits are set where they are.

[Molestron]

You live in a police state, why are you surprised by this ?!

[Reg]

You live in a police state, why are you surprised by this ?!

Perhaps because it's a figment of your imagination.

[Molestron]

Perhaps because it's a figment of your imagination.

Nope, the US government is the biggest control freak of all 1st world countries.

[Spl4sh3r]

Sounds like they are suggesting to people who drive more to pay more, isn't it easier to just add more tax to gas and use that to keep the roads up to date?

[Molestron]

Sounds like they are suggesting to people who drive more to pay more, isn't it easier to just add more tax to gas and use that to keep the roads up to date?

Nah, they'll know where you are, how long did you drive and where have you been. The tax part is just a cover up. Unless ofcourse you are allowed to open the box and see what's inside, which I'm guessing will be illegal.

They do this because of terrorists and pedophiles, naturally, the biggest threats to the nation, especially the latter.

[Kifimbo]

I am fully against this, As a truck driver, i drive anywhere from 2500-3500 miles a week, and i already have to keep up to date logs and a lot of paperwork. not to mention all the extra costs that go into owning your own truck. If they add this to my bills, i would have to quit driving OTR and try to find local jobs, which dont make shit for money unless you get into hazmat stuff.

[Flutterguy]

Funny thing is, people supporting this say they will stop taxing gasoline if they just tax by the mile. How gullible are people? They're not dropping the gasoline tax.

[pucGG]

I'm not against this provided the boxes only track total miles driven, not speeds or locations.

You already got that in your car.

Certain insurance companies are willing to lower the price of your car insurance if you have a black box in your car, and thereby can prove that you drive responsibly.

[Orlong]

Sounds like they are suggesting to people who drive more to pay more, isn't it easier to just add more tax to gas and use that to keep the roads up to date?

Exactly, they want them so they can track where you go. The people who drive more miles already pay more in taxes since they buy more gas than people who hardly drive. The gas tax is supposed to pay for the roads and those who drive more miles, buy more gas pay, and pay more for the road maintenance

[Reg]

Exactly, they want them so they can track where you go. The people who drive more miles already pay more in taxes since they buy more gas than people who hardly drive. The gas tax is supposed to pay for the roads and those who drive more miles, buy more gas pay, and pay more for the road maintenance

Paranoid much? If you have a cell phone or GPS, "they" can already find you, not that they actually give a shit where you are. They want them because of hybrid cars and other fuel economy vehicles not using as much gas, therefore decreasing the amount of money paid in taxes for the same distances driven.

[Daerio]

Paranoid much? If you have a cell phone or GPS, "they" can already find you, not that they actually give a shit where you are. They want them because of hybrid cars and other fuel economy vehicles not using as much gas, therefore decreasing the amount of money paid in taxes for the same distances driven.

This has been said before, but I guess I'll echo it again:

Your car already has this magical device installed. It's called an odometer. I don't want to pay for them to install an additional "box" that may or may not give them additional information that they don't need. And regardless of who "pays" for it, in reality we're all paying for it. If the government installs them, we're paying for it in taxes. If the car manufacturer installs it, we're paying for it in the form of higher car purchase cost. If insurance companies pay for it, we're paying for it in the form of higher premiums. All of the costs are passed along to we, the glorious consumer.

You can try to dismiss it as paranoid to say it's inevitable that they'll use this to track peoples location and speed (even though it isn't paranoid at all, it's quite realistic, even if they don't start out doing it) but you cannot argue that this stated goal of tracking distance driven cannot be accomplished at LESS COST with CURRENT TECHNOLOGY ALREADY IMPLEMENTED. Therefore at worst it's an infringement of privacy, and at best it's a complete waste of our money.

Also, as other people have already said, this isn't somehow going to save us money. It isn't going to lower our taxes. Taxes are a black hole from which money does not return. If they get their hands on more money in this way, and they decide they've overtaxed us and they received more money than what it costs to maintain the roads, are we going to get that money back? HELL NO. They're going to decide to "save" it for future road maintainence in a special account, (hey, just like social security) and then spend that shit on whatever they want, and call it an "IOU". That's how our wonderful tax system works.

[Belize]

If you add 10% to a limit, it's no longer a limit.

You mean you don't drive 5 over >.>

If I don't drive faster than the speed limit, the people behind start raging and I'd rather not be rear ended by some moron. Plus police radar only go off when you go 7 miles over so it's pretty much accepted.

[Reg]

This has been said before, but I guess I'll echo it again:

Your car already has this magical device installed. It's called an odometer. I don't want to pay for them to install an additional "box" that may or may not give them additional information that they don't need. And regardless of who "pays" for it, in reality we're all paying for it. If the government installs them, we're paying for it in taxes. If the car manufacturer installs it, we're paying for it in the form of higher car purchase cost. If insurance companies pay for it, we're paying for it in the form of higher premiums. All of the costs are passed along to we, the glorious consumer.

You can try to dismiss it as paranoid to say it's inevitable that they'll use this to track peoples location and speed (even though it isn't paranoid at all, it's quite realistic, even if they don't start out doing it) but you cannot argue that this stated goal of tracking distance driven cannot be accomplished at LESS COST with CURRENT TECHNOLOGY ALREADY IMPLEMENTED. Therefore at worst it's an infringement of privacy, and at best it's a complete waste of our money.

Also, as other people have already said, this isn't somehow going to save us money. It isn't going to lower our taxes. Taxes are a black hole from which money does not return. If they get their hands on more money in this way, and they decide they've overtaxed us and they received more money than what it costs to maintain the roads, are we going to get that money back? HELL NO. They're going to decide to "save" it for future road maintainence in a special account, (hey, just like social security) and then spend that shit on whatever they want, and call it an "IOU". That's how our wonderful tax system works.

Cars burn gas differently depending on driving conditions. Odometers don't record that. Unless they decide to charge a per mile fee, I don't see how an odometer would help in their quest to change the way gas is taxed. I'm not saying I agree with it either, in fact the entire point is to raise the amount of taxes paid because people have been paying for less gas due to cars with better gas mileage. But to say tracking a person to be their main concern is a bit ridiculous to me, when taking more money is a simple enough explanation.

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You mean you don't drive 5 over >.>

If I don't drive faster than the speed limit, the people behind start raging and I'd rather not be rear ended by some moron. Plus police radar only go off when you go 7 miles over so it's pretty much accepted.

I drive a motorcycle. I don't even drive in lanes lol Just being technical with wording.

[Daerio]

Cars burn gas differently depending on driving conditions. Odometers don't record that. Unless they decide to charge a per mile fee, I don't see how an odometer would help in their quest to change the way gas is taxed. I'm not saying I agree with it either, in fact the entire point is to raise the amount of taxes paid because people have been paying for less gas due to cars with better gas mileage. But to say tracking a person to be their main concern is a bit ridiculous to me, when taking more money is a simple enough explanation.

So by your explanation here, you're saying that OBVIOUSLY they have to track your speed as well, while calling someone else paranoid for saying that's what they're going to do. Hey, why not also track peoples location, so they can determine which roads should be allocated that money?

Oh yeah, that's paranoid.

[Reg]

So by your explanation here, you're saying that OBVIOUSLY they have to track your speed as well, while calling someone else paranoid for saying that's what they're going to do. Hey, why not also track peoples location, so they can determine which roads should be allocated that money?

Oh yeah, that's paranoid.

Yes, paranoid. It doesn't have to track speed. It will take speed into account when making the calculations just as certain vehicles already do when they report to you your MPG. It doesn't mean it needs to be reported. But location, no. Gas tax as it is doesn't take location into account except the municipality you buy it in.

[Orlong]

Paranoid much? If you have a cell phone or GPS, "they" can already find you, not that they actually give a shit where you are. They want them because of hybrid cars and other fuel economy vehicles not using as much gas, therefore decreasing the amount of money paid in taxes for the same distances driven.

They also used to call people paranoid who thought the government was listening in on their phone calls, tracking their web activities, and reading their emails, but the NSA proved them wrong