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Heroic = Organised raiding
Normal/Flex = Casual raiding, can be cleared with 1-2 hours per night of raiding
LFR = Login anytime and afk through the content
If you are not doing heroics then there is NO reason to be 580ilvl geared as you will never need it. You should only be as powerful as the raid content you are attempting to do, being able to kill mobs faster in the wild is no sense of "progression" either.
I remember when I was full time at college and I was very casual in TBC, the only raid I could EVER think about doing was Karazhan - but I didn't whine, didn't need to post stuff on the forums, didn't feel entitled to be inside SWP with no effort, I had to take the time out to fight for my place in a SWP guild in the end and it was rewarding to do so.
You also make your everyday life sound like some jack bauer 24 bullshit when in reality you just go to work, come home and figure out what the best way to spend your time would be and then you do it. Thread after thread, post after post you make it clear you genuinely aren't interested in the game and spend more time showering than playing the game yet for some reason you think its appropriate to come here and ramble on about your casual crusade and how content should be made for you.
Give me a break.. If I'm totally honest, I hope this expansion caters and milks the casual playerbase for as much money as possible just to be able to safely create everything they have ever wanted making it as insanely hard as possible for the last expansion. This game is a ticking time bomb because the difference between a good and bad player is so insanely huge and the only good alternative is to go out with a bang and come out with an entirely new formula where everyone starts from zero and take into consideration what the last game failed at.
Last edited by Strafir; 2013-11-04 at 12:03 PM.
The Fel Reaver in Hellfire Peninsula is always the example I think of when talking about real dangers in the open world. You avoided him by hook or by crook back in the day, but taking out enemies such as that could be made into meaningful gameplay. The rares in Pandaria are also a step in this direction, if you think about it, and dungeon progression (if it comes in) would also require ever more powerful gear.
This whole "only raiders need to gear up" argument needs to die in a fire. It's strangling more meaningful innovation and debate.
Why they care abou gear at all when they have already downed face roll Garrosh is beyond me, but they do.
You really think casuals want some challenging content to be solo play? Did they no whine enough when Timeless Isle can out an they had to DODGE stuff?
This is what raiding is, when it is not scheduled + DKP + whatever.
It is understandable that Blizzard want everyone to raid, because raiding ties people to the game like no tomorrow. But a lot of people are quite tired of it, and in many cases just do not enjoy it. You can say: then leave, and that's fine, just remember that you are saying "then leave" to, quite possibly, the majority of the playerbase.
Do we need more content for "casuals" or more content for people who don't put any effort into the game?
I know plenty of people who raid normal modes on a 1-2 schedule for only a couple of hours.
There are people that clear the entire tier on HM that raid on a schedule like that as well.
Can't commit to a schedule? Openraid. Pugs.
Some guilds offer "bench" spots so people can fill in and the like. GDKP's are also still around on many realms.
There is PLENTY to do in this game already that isn't raiding.
I haven't raided since ToT but I'm still around dabbling in multiple aspects of the game.
Hell; I'm about to make my first 2200 push after Blizzcon hopefully in PvP. I poke my nose into Flex raids when I'm comfortable enough to pug. Also seriously considering working on buffering my achievement points as much as I can on nights I'm not busy IRL.
People need to stop asking for so much content for a group that literally will not go out of their way to do things.
Open your eyes. More content is good but you're asking to cater to a group that doesn't care unless it's given to them on the dot.
-- Signature by /the/ Crazytaco --
That's very easy to explain. To really raid normal/heroic you need to be in a guild or raiding group. With this comes the need to play on every week on the same days at the same time. And thats the problem. My friends/family/job don't align to my raiding schedule. They just say: "Well if you can't come on tuesday we go alone." "When you want to watch the new film in the cinema, come with us or watch it alone." Sure once or twice they will change their plans. But not every week for months/years. And I didn't even mention my workshifts......go tell my boss that I can't work the late shift on tuesday and thursday.....good luck by surviving this.Why cant casuals raid normal, or even heroic? Really tell me. Play the game for 3 hours, 2 or 3 times a week? jesus
And then my kids. My wife meets her friends and I meet mine. So when one of us is out, the other watchs the kids. If I tell her you can't go on tuesday but hey on saturday I'm out....well.....I think you understand why normal/heroic is not such a "small" problem. It is not the few hours a week. It is the set in stone schedule you have to go.
Yes, I really think casuals want some challenging content to be solo play. No, pointing to threads with whines regarding this or that does not disqualify that point of view. A poll would be better.
Bring in more 5man dungeons. bring in Dungeon tier sets and upgrade quests for said tier sets. Have Valor vendor open and requires 2.5k per item or something so players can grind the items from there or do LFR for similar items via RNG.
Use the current JP/VP system inbetween patches so the old dungeon gear can become better same for LFR/other raid gear.
On raid patches release a few dungeons with higher quality gear disable upgrade system. New dungeon tier set released.
non raid patch enable upgrades and put the new dungeons and old dungeons on the same queue and upgrade all old dungeon loot to its 2/2 level by default.
Also make it so professions get random recipe drops from dungeons AND have a special anvil/forge/lab etc that professions can use to make. Have these after the last boss so people who queue LFD for it get to the end boss and then use the place to do their crafting.
Keep LFR the entire time too as its another tool for players to use for gearing their character.
Can also look at timeless isle which tried to tackle this problem by allowing anyone on their own schedule to kill random rares for chance at tokens to get better gear and upgrade it. I reckon people just got burned out on that one or once they got 535 that it wasn't good enough anymore because it served it's purpose?
I guess Blizzard can spend more time trying to figure out how to appease a large diverse group of players that have different wants and needs. I guess now to keep these type of players they gotta give more and bigger rewards to keep them around to pay the bills? They can continue these experiments while alienating even more players that are already satisfied with the game and what it has to offer. I guess in the end turning wow into what is isn't to satisfy people that haven't moved on yet is what needs to be done now? Maybe nike will figure out how to make one shoe that fits everyone's foot and can change to look how anyone wants it to. They would sure make a lot more money.
Last edited by Barnabas; 2013-11-04 at 12:58 PM.
If, after they provide a non-raid progression path, they find that noone uses LFR, so be it. That would just show that people didn't enjoy it and were running it for gear / because there was nothing else to do.
Last edited by rda; 2013-11-04 at 01:13 PM.
"Look around you. We're all liars here, and every one of us is better than you" - PB
Last edited by rda; 2013-11-04 at 01:30 PM.
TBC had it by accident because there was such a wide variety in dungeon difficulty. IE Shattered Halls or Shadow Labyrinth were like a whole tier of difficulty above Heroic Mechanar or Slave Pens. Then Magister's Terrace to cap it off.
Wrath had the release 5 mans, then ToTC, then the ICC 5 mans.
Cata had the release 5 mans, ZA/ZG, then the sadly undertuned End Time dungeons.
They have the advantage of being easier to organise with friends and not taking as long to complete as an LFR wing. The only downside is heroic raiders don't get much mileage out of them. But having said that, I'd done over 100 5 man heroics in Wrath, while also killing ever heroic raid boss in 25 man. And I had fun in both.