Blizzcon: Warlock chat (NEW TALENTS IN FIRST POST!)

[a C e]

He is different than wild imps in that he sometimes attacks whatever the hell he wants regardless of what you're telling him to attack with the initial cast or subsequent spells. Where with imps you can control where they're attacking with spell casts.

From the sounds of the talent I doubt it'd be a guardian so much as it would be a talent akin to supremacy. Who knows though we'll see, I'm just hoping they don't try to overhaul the class again.

GC Tweeted a few days ago that they wont =)

[sugarfree]

I just have a bad feeling with demonic servitude and demonology. I just think that talent will be nerfed to oblivion like GoSac. I mean, we have all been complaining about the fucking zoo hunters can bring in. How much more than a Demo lock who can bring 2 pets and 4 more easily in a shorter cooldown. I am not even mentioning GoServe.

Come on, as a lock, it's awesome, perfectly fits the theme, but let's be real here wih pvp scenarious. That's just wouldn't work. And our personal burst will be hugely affected by that as well. I'd imagine shadowbolts and soulfires that hit for instant level damage (weak) with cast times of forever. But then again, they are more likely to reduce their damage in exchange for being permanent.

Demonic servitude
Felguard
Summon 4 imps
Goserve felguard
Go Meta
GG.

[Jessicka]

Demonic servitude
Felguard
Summon 4 imps
Goserve felguard
Go Meta
GG.

This is why I love Demo

[Deleted]

Come on, as a lock, it's awesome, perfectly fits the theme, but let's be real here wih pvp scenarious. That's just wouldn't work. And our personal burst will be hugely affected by that as well. I'd imagine shadowbolts and soulfires that hit for instant level damage (weak) with cast times of forever. But then again, they are more likely to reduce their damage in exchange for being permanent.

Demonic servitude
Felguard
Summon 4 imps
Goserve felguard
Go Meta
GG.

well there is a flaw tho, as im sure that taking demonic servitude would simply add doomguard and infernal to your summon demon ability, allowing you to only have one of your demons out, so while you'll still have the option of summoning your felguard(unless ofc you meant doomguard and not fel guard), you have to choose between that and doomguard/infernal, on a positive note you would be able to summon a doomguard or infernal as your GoServ guardian and you should still be able to summon a doomguard normally from your 10 min cd which would actually allow you to have 3 doom guards out at once lol.

[Grizelda]

How can you be sure?

I don't even think that Blizz is sure yet.

Not that I'm saying you're wrong. Just that its still early to be sure.

[xskarma]

While getting worked up about the new talents, and hwo they are pretty much a forced change in our rotations and how combinations seem to be a bit weird and possibly lame I got the brilliant idea of "Hey, wait a minute, this is like alpha development stuff, who the hell knows what this will actually lead to and if it's even going to be remotely the same once we get beta, and later on release".

So I went and did a tiny experiment, and went back to the Blizzcon 2011 talent preview, and how much of it we actually got. Check it for yourself here: www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSVkPVwN6NQ#t=43m25s

By my count, we had 9 talents that made it intact to at least the first tier of Mists, and 4 more talents that got slightly changed but had the same basic ideas, BUT there's also 5 talents that were completely changed and didn't end up in the game out of the possible 18 talents that they spoke about. Looked at like that, there's about a 1 in 3 chance that a talent gets scrapped in favour of a better idea, and only half the talents ended up in the game untouched (and there are plenty of those that got changed after that, for example, Harvest Life and Soul Link).

TL;DR: I don't think we need to worry TOO much about the actual talents coming true as they are now. We can give the necessary feedback and use the beta to show them and tell them what works and what doesn't. And even then things might change during WoD if things don't work out. I got some much needed peace of mind after realising this.

[Grizelda]

That was a pretty cool bit of work Xskarma. Ty.

I keep thinking however, that we will not be able to compare this run up to beta to the run up before MoP.

We don't have Xelnath to complain to/thank/pray to/ask questions of anymore.

[Agoonga]

I've been kinda hoping they take a look at our pets and meta form as they're all severely dated models. Even the supremacy pets are just rehashed old models where hunters actually get to tame new pets every xpac that have brand new models n stuffs.

I want this too but I really hope they go with a similar route as the races and don't change the feel or style of any of the minions and just update their models/animations. I love the demons' designs, I just want them smoothed out a little.

[Deleted]

How can you be sure?

I don't even think that Blizz is sure yet.

Not that I'm saying you're wrong. Just that its still early to be sure.

well i know bcoz blizz would never give a class such an OP abilty to allow us to have 2 demons out at the same time. the only thing im not sure of is whether or not demonic servitude will simply "replace" our summon doomguard 10 min cd so that we cant use that cd anymore with demonic servitude.

in any case, your statement would also be fitting to the person i quoted as he wouldnt know if it would work the way he said either. just the idea of being able to have 2 permanent pets out at the same time is rather ludicrous in my book, sure it would be nice but it wont happen without significant nerfs but you never know with blizz, as xskarma said, we dont even know if said talent will be in game on release or how it will work and the talents are bound to change during beta.

personally, i dont think the destro version of chaotic resources will make in its current form. i can see its uses in single target fights where it more or less allows you to cast 4-5 times the current amount of chaos bolt which should more than make up the loss in dmg from the 75% reduced incin and conflag dmg as currently, atleast for me on single target, chaos bolt dmg is very close to, if not my highest source of dmg, so you will basically be using chaos bolt as a filler instead of incin but for aoe its just a waste. my incinerates on a fight like galakras does about an average of 200-240k dmg, with that dmg and that talent it would be closer to 50-60k and if i use FnB it would be reduced further.

[Mazda]

personally, i dont think the destro version of chaotic resources will make in its current form. i can see its uses in single target fights where it more or less allows you to cast 4-5 times the current amount of chaos bolt which should more than make up the loss in dmg from the 75% reduced incin and conflag dmg as currently, atleast for me on single target, chaos bolt dmg is very close to, if not my highest source of dmg, so you will basically be using chaos bolt as a filler instead of incin but for aoe its just a waste. my incinerates on a fight like galakras does about an average of 200-240k dmg, with that dmg and that talent it would be closer to 50-60k and if i use FnB it would be reduced further.

Although that is definitely true, you also have to realize that it could have a place in 2-3 target sustained cleave. Currently, 2-3 target sustained cleave is a bit of a hybrid between single target and aoe. With that talent, you'll get enough embers back from FnB Incinerate in order to continue spamming it under the 2-3 target condition. The actual damage might not be optimal, but we won't know it until we see it.

[Deleted]

I think DS will simply give you the option to summon Infernal or Doomguard as your pet. And also give them some utility with a stun or silence and few other abilities. And it's going to do like 10-15% more dps than any other demon. And increase your bad-assery by 666% percent.

[Xorn]

Disregard this post. I made a stupid error.

[Jessicka]

Although that is definitely true, you also have to realize that it could have a place in 2-3 target sustained cleave. Currently, 2-3 target sustained cleave is a bit of a hybrid between single target and aoe. With that talent, you'll get enough embers back from FnB Incinerate in order to continue spamming it under the 2-3 target condition. The actual damage might not be optimal, but we won't know it until we see it.

For cleave you'll still be limited by how much you can Havoc.

[a C e]

To be honest, I think all of these talents were last minute. Have you guys seen the rogue every time they crit they get a combo point talent, that seems to be one of the most OP talents in the game.

[wholol]

Many talents seem broken imo,have a look at the monk's talent that is similar to dota's omnislash , it's like rogue's killing spree but makes him immune to all damage/ CC while he's jumping through targets.

several other talents for other classes seem to light a bulb in my head , but this is the first view of the talent as an idea , they will obviously change a lot till release ( hopefully).

[Jessicka]

Let's hope so.

Going back to the idea where Cataclysm and Mannoroth's Fury are alongside each other in an 'AoE' tier, the point above gave me the idea that a third talent on that row could improve cleave rather than pure AE, by reducing Havoc's cooldown or increasing its charges for Destruction and offering an Ignite effect or limited Volley effect for the other two specs.

Also wonder about the future for KJC, as GC has been so vocal in the past about cutting down on cast-while-move abilities.

[Baconeggcheese]

I wouldn't be entirely surprised if KJC just vanished and became something else.

I can't imagine a world with cataclysm and mannoroths on the same tier simply because you would pretty much never take mannoroths over cataclysm. The only niche part of that that mannoroths would have is the 500% range but the dmg wouldn't even scratch the surface on cataclysm's damage and I just can't imagine where you'd care enough about spread aoe once or twice a minute in a fight enough to sacrifice THAT much dmg.

I get what you guys are getting at though, would be intelligent design. I would love if that 3rd talent was something like *seed of corruption pops instantly upon application* for affliction and iono what I would give demo because it doesn't really need any aoe love. Though jeez, it's just hard to imagine not taking a spell that is essentially casting a free chaosbolt at everything once a minute in an aoeish tier.

[a C e]

I wouldn't be entirely surprised if KJC just vanished and became something else.

I can't imagine a world with cataclysm and mannoroths on the same tier simply because you would pretty much never take mannoroths over cataclysm. The only niche part of that that mannoroths would have is the 500% range but the dmg wouldn't even scratch the surface on cataclysm's damage and I just can't imagine where you'd care enough about spread aoe once or twice a minute in a fight enough to sacrifice THAT much dmg.

I get what you guys are getting at though, would be intelligent design. I would love if that 3rd talent was something like *seed of corruption pops instantly upon application* for affliction and iono what I would give demo because it doesn't really need any aoe love. Though jeez, it's just hard to imagine not taking a spell that is essentially casting a free chaosbolt at everything once a minute in an aoeish tier.

I rarely use KJC and when I use it I forget about it sometimes =/. but i hope they just baseline it like they did to shamans and maybe give us a POM(mage) or NS(shamans/druids). Instant Chaos bolt FTW every 2 mins, it also gives us lots of utility like instant Combat Rez.

[Deleted]

To be honest, I think all of these talents were last minute. Have you guys seen the rogue every time they crit they get a combo point talent, that seems to be one of the most OP talents in the game.

well that is exactly what the chaotic resources does for destro, think about it, incinerate will generate 5(depending on how you interpret the talent) emberbit and it has a 15% chance to generate an extra which should give it a chance to generate 5 ember bits, so on a crit you could in theory generate 1,5 burning embers with 1 incinerate, basically giving you the chance of filling your embers with just 3 incinerate.

- - - Updated - - -

Also wonder about the future for KJC, as GC has been so vocal in the past about cutting down on cast-while-move abilities.

i also fear that KJC will be removed, atleast i wouldnt be surprised if it does, however if it does get removed they would need to significantly reduce the mana cost of fel flame for destro, as we can currently only cast 4 fel flames b4 we go oom.

i wouldnt mind seeing a talent that reduces the cd of havoc, should make chaotic resources a bit more attractive for aoe/cleave fights as destro.

[Mazda]

For cleave you'll still be limited by how much you can Havoc.

I think you misinterpreted the point I was making, but in general yes you are right.