1. #1441
    Seriously, dumbing down the game, more? WTF!?

  2. #1442
    Quote Originally Posted by Keldaryne View Post
    Seriously, dumbing down the game, more? WTF!?
    I think the button bloat conversation is about taking away or improving the skills that don't do much, but you feel like you need to have them bound to your keyboard.

    Now what I've been trying to say for a long time is that Mages are probably the class which needs removal of spells the least. Hell we need more spells to use in raids. Rotationally and situationally.

  3. #1443
    There's no guarantee that we are on the list for button bloat.
    People just keep, for god knows what reason, assuming Blizzard are going to remove a bunch of spells that don't need to be touched and which don't contribute to button bloat in the slightest.

  4. #1444
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by mrgreenthump View Post
    I think the button bloat conversation is about taking away or improving the skills that don't do much, but you feel like you need to have them bound to your keyboard.

    Now what I've been trying to say for a long time is that Mages are probably the class which needs removal of spells the least. Hell we need more spells to use in raids. Rotationally and situationally.
    It seems to be like it would primarily be useful for Hybrids who literally have tons of spells that they might incidentally want to use every 2 months. Pure DPS classes, especially Mage, simply don't have many abilities like that. Then again, every class has less-useful abilities. I'll just wait for the actual bloatbattle.

  5. #1445
    Deleted
    WoW, maybe consolidating all mage bombs into one talent!

    Means we can finally play Mages without dots again!

    Means, together with the removal of the current lvl 90 talents i might touch my mage again!

  6. #1446
    Quote Originally Posted by runey View Post
    WoW, maybe consolidating all mage bombs into one talent!

    Means we can finally play Mages without dots again!

    Means, together with the removal of the current lvl 90 talents i might touch my mage again!
    Not a true fan of damage talents though.. I mean that tier has to have some really beafy talents to be on par with dots. Just yeah, it's far more likely that it will either be 1 optimal damage talent or picking talents based on what kind of fight it is. Which means nothing will change and the "pick the talent you want" mantra still is not working for Mages.

  7. #1447
    Herald of the Titans Kuni Zyrekai's Avatar
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    Well given we lost multidotting, they're probably all single target restricted. They're also probably going to undo the 40% buff on them from 5.1(?), so the options won't have to be quite as beefy. Given snapshotting is also gone, I don't believe it'll be that hard to balance that line pretty closely. But you're right. There will always be an optimal talent. I'm just wondering that since we're dealing with the number squish, will that difference be in the sub-100 DPS range, and what the effect of human psychology will have on a number that small after what we've been calculating.

  8. #1448
    Warchief Akraen's Avatar
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    FB is only 98 dps lower than LB!

    But LB only does 100 dps!

    Who cares 98 is such a tiny number!

    ... Yeah it'll be an adjustment for the mind.

  9. #1449
    Frontpage "Developer Interviews"

    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    For example, the Mage Bomb talent row could have all three bomb spells consolidated into one talent, which gives the mage a bomb based on their spec. This would free up two spaces on that row for more talent choices.





    I mean, they just keep dropping these little hints about Mages CONSTANTLY. I think we can chalk up the above as "unofficially confirmed" because this isn't the first time we've heard this specific line. I've went ahead and updated the OP, but giving it a blue warning text.

    Though I am curious how you put DoTs on a talent tier and then put something else next to it. How would the next thing compete with a ROTATIONAL ability???
    Last edited by Polarthief; 2014-02-25 at 03:44 PM.
    Still wondering why I play this game.
    I'm a Rogue and I also made a spreadsheet for the Order Hall that is updated for BfA.

  10. #1450
    I can see what they'll do already, to consolidate the "button bloat" theory into the "squish T75 talents" theory.

    That tier will be:

    - Bomb
    - Orb
    - Some sort of more pvp focused ability

    Pick one.

    retired, another victim of warlords of draenor

  11. #1451
    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Polarthief View Post
    Frontpage "Developer Interviews"

    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    For example, the Mage Bomb talent row could have all three bomb spells consolidated into one talent, which gives the mage a bomb based on their spec. This would free up two spaces on that row for more talent choices.





    I mean, they just keep dropping these little hints about Mages CONSTANTLY. I think we can chalk up the above as "unofficially confirmed" because this isn't the first time we've heard this specific line. I've went ahead and updated the OP, but giving it a blue warning text.

    Though I am curious how you put DoTs on a talent tier and then put something else next to it. How would the next thing compete with a ROTATIONAL ability???
    Ok, some assumptions. If they consolidate the dot spells, then I figure they are basically going to do the same thing albeit with some little tweaks here and there.

    Factor in the removal of multi-dotting also, so these are powerful dots that are locked to one target.

    First obvious change would be that frost bomb is converted from it's delayed explosion talent to being a plain simple dot. If picking a dot is to be a choice, it should be a choice available to all regardless of spec.

    Secondly, when Frost Bomb hits 0, it explodes for x damage. When Living Bomb hits 0, it explodes for x damage. When Nether Tempest hits 0.., essentially nether tempest needs some sort of cleave mechanic. Either it just blows up when it hits 0 or maybe it could pulse an Arcane Explosion every tick which would add up to similar damage.

    Next, the other two slots.

    What does our bomb talent say for the theme of the level 75 talent tier? They still want it to factor into our rotation, and maybe do some cleave damage.

    Move Falling Stars from the level 100 talent row up to the level 75. The difference is, it's a cast time nuke you fit into the rotation rather than a dot and it has a big ass graphical effect. Not an AOE...a NUKE with a hefty cleave component.

    The third option, if they wanted it to be a choice, maybe it could be a cooldown or a passive. You know, the first two alter the rotation, dot vs nuke. The third doesn't alter the rotation but has a similar effect.

    Got it. Make Greater Invisibility baseline so that instead of having two survivability spells, awesome as they are, we get one on a much shorter cd with enhanced utility. Remove Mirror Images as baseline. Make Mirror Images a dps cooldown talent, you summon your dudes and they bring the pain. Maybe they deal cleave damage.

    And there's my guesses/suggestions.

    P.S. Just realised that is likely my last guessword on the pre 6.0 Mage. Feel a little emotional now. The next time I might have to use real hard facts!
    Last edited by Obelisk Kai; 2014-02-25 at 04:59 PM.

  12. #1452
    Quote Originally Posted by Draghonfourt View Post
    It seems to be like it would primarily be useful for Hybrids who literally have tons of spells that they might incidentally want to use every 2 months. Pure DPS classes, especially Mage, simply don't have many abilities like that. Then again, every class has less-useful abilities. I'll just wait for the actual bloatbattle.
    Exactly. My druid is overwhelmed with buttons. Im sure shamans and others are as well.

  13. #1453
    Celestalon ‏@Celestalon 19 s

    @talachit Mage talents have received significant revision. Currently: 12 brand new, 3 existing/old spells now talents, 4 w/ major changes.

    Ok then. Guess there is more than anyone expected.

    - - - Updated - - -

    That means 2 talens are the same as they are currently.. oh my

  14. #1454
    From Celestalon's Twitter:

    "Mage talents have received significant revision. Currently: 12 brand new, 3 existing/old spells now talents, 4 w/ major changes."

    VERY interesting!

  15. #1455
    I can imagine some type of Colossus Smash talent on tier 75 beside the Bomb(s) talent.

    "Deform. Debuffs the target for 6 seconds, increasing spell damage taken by 50 %. 20 second cooldown" (numbers not balanced at all... but you get it :P)

    Numbers can be adjusted to fit the same priority as our current bombs, damage wise, and gives us 'short cd' burst (something I personally prefer over huge long cd burst like shammies are imo plagued with). Also would work well with the new Readiness stat.

    edit:

    WOW! Nice to hear! I REALLY hope that the 90's are gone. :L

  16. #1456
    Quote Originally Posted by Maythael View Post
    WOW! Nice to hear! I REALLY hope that the 90's are gone. :L
    In before the 2 things that survived unchanged are IW and RoP

  17. #1457
    Quote Originally Posted by Icyflamez View Post
    From Celestalon's Twitter:

    "Mage talents have received significant revision. Currently: 12 brand new, 3 existing/old spells now talents, 4 w/ major changes."

    VERY interesting!
    Interesting but not that surprising, They are cutting down on instants casting while moving and cc. So tier 15 gone, t45 gone, they said the bomb tier was re done and hopefully the 90 tier is redone thats 12 new talents "3 existing/old spells now talents" probably making choose between baseline cc's.Some variation of that will probably be what we see.

  18. #1458
    Quote Originally Posted by Icyflamez View Post
    From Celestalon's Twitter:

    "Mage talents have received significant revision. Currently: 12 brand new, 3 existing/old spells now talents, 4 w/ major changes."

    VERY interesting!
    I can play a mage again! Wooooo!!
    I'M A DRAENEI THIS EXPAC APPARENTLY
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    You know what happened when i started playing in TBC in 2.1 and rolled ret as my first char? Lol ret , Lol ret , Lol ret , Lol ret You know what i was saying in a few months? Lol hows kara? Then I cleared BT/SW while they followed behind me sniffing my gloriously rosey turds.

  19. #1459
    The Lightbringer LocNess's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Icyflamez View Post
    From Celestalon's Twitter:

    "Mage talents have received significant revision. Currently: 12 brand new, 3 existing/old spells now talents, 4 w/ major changes."

    VERY interesting!
    YES! OH PRAISE BIRD JESUS, YES!

    Quote Originally Posted by mrgreenthump View Post
    In before the 2 things that survived unchanged are IW and RoP
    NO. NO. WE DON'T MAKE JOKES ABOUT THAT.

    /sorryaboutcaps

    - - - Updated - - -

    Hmmm, now in all seriousness "3 existing or old spells are now talents". Alter Time maybe? Mirror Image? I am only thinking of baseline spells really. And do old spells include things like Amplify/Dampen Magic? Or are they old spells because they were part of the 20% button cut. WTB Beta.

    inb4 T75 is Molten Armour, Mage Armour, or Frost Armour.

  20. #1460
    Quote Originally Posted by mrgreenthump View Post
    In before the 2 things that survived unchanged are IW and RoP
    Hopefully the 2 things that survived are ice flows and blazing speed. 4 changed things? Invis, cauterize, Ice barrier and temporal shield. The rest can burn. I doubt it actually breaks down like that though
    Last edited by Erolian; 2014-02-26 at 07:47 AM.

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