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  1. #41
    well, the perma meta is kinda meh, its basically the same amount of dmg as in caster form, cataclysm is a bit meh too, the dmg seems decent and it will allow you to put up immolates for 100% of their dmg unlike FnB. the perma doomguard is going to be fun, hopefully the doomguard pet wont be cast capped at 18 shadow bolts like now lol.

  2. #42
    If they are gonna give us perma doomguard and inferno, at least give them back some of their abilitys. I like the idea of perma meta form for demonology but I feel like 30% is a considerable chunk of damage to be loosing. Id rather see demonology not balanced around this talent.

  3. #43
    Stood in the Fire Kagecamia's Avatar
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    Druids get perma eclipse state for no damage reduction. Demo gets perma demon meta form with a 30% damage reduc. greeaaaaat...

    It seems like a lot of other classes have a spell that deals 1000~more or less damage to each target/every target every X number of seconds. A nice buff to aoe but it seems kinda bullshit. They nerfed Manny's fury because of our aoe cleaving too much and being too powerful. Now they spread it out for other classes?

    The Hunter version of grimsac is what pisses me off and puzzles me the most. We had to fight tooth and nail to prevent the nerfs to grimsac that still went through. We had blizz pretty much tell us that you are a pet class and that you should have a pet with you 100% of the time. If not, then you get a damage loss to pay for less hassle of dealing with pets.

    Now hunters get a 30% increased amount of damage to their spells? 50 gold that it will be nerfed just like grimsac. Every hunter is drooling at the mouth over the new change. Meanwhile I am being ignored because I see the same shit happening with grimsac. Those who don't know their history are doomed to repeat it I guess.

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    Blizz is walking on some hot coals here.

    The inevitable nerfs to afflic and destro going into the next expac with these talents are pretty stupid. I might be the minority when I say this, but part of me feels like WoD will be like cata again for us.

  4. #44
    Inevitable nerfs to destro? So when a spec is performing well and is not OP in ANY way shape or form, it's gonna get nerfed? Nope.
    As for Aff, I hope that if they nerf something, they nerf multidotting, I cba losing to rogues in single target endgame...

  5. #45
    I'm not sure if any of you guys have read it among the immense overflow of information released but there seems to be this small paragraph somewhere that say that each level past 90 will empower a spell(s) for each class, a mage example was given that says it will give % dmg increase to said spell by a lot, this could somewhat offset whatever we have in mind of current rotations or importance of spells given that we do not know which spells will be empowered and how .
    Last edited by wholol; 2013-11-09 at 09:11 PM.

  6. #46
    this doesn't matter anyways, cause meta's dnt exist in Warlords of Draenor according to recent info. Less use of gems and enchants

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Lyrax View Post
    this doesn't matter anyways, cause meta's dnt exist in Warlords of Draenor according to recent info. Less use of gems and enchants
    You didn't even glance at the thread did you.

  8. #48
    The 100 talents will obviously be tuned to be good in some situations and bad in others, so we can't really comment much on how valuable they're going to be until we actually play with them. 100% meta uptime will just make demo a less complex spec to play and thus more boring - right now it's got the most interesting rotation of any spec in the game, so why give us the option to cut out half the spells?

    None of the talents sound particularly exciting. Unless Doomguards / Terrorguards / Infernals / Abyssals get really cool command demon abilities. Which has now gotten me really excited at the possibilities.
    Last edited by Olorout; 2013-11-09 at 10:26 PM.

  9. #49
    Dreadlord Cebel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spookyy View Post
    Perma Doomguard? That's like having an imp on steroids. And if you don't like that you can simply go with a buffed version of haunt or fun AoE talent. How is this not fun?
    Except doomguard does less dps than imp anyways, ill be taking the first talent for affi, and cataclysm for the other 2 specs as they stand now, but we'll prob have completely different talents come release, no big deal, not gonna even bother theorycrafting them now lol.

    Also LOL I've literally been brain fried the past 2 days with all this info, and i literally just realized chaotic resources makes demo and destro fuckin insane turret machines as far as pve is concerned.
    Last edited by Cebel; 2013-11-10 at 02:52 AM.

  10. #50
    Brewmaster Skayth's Avatar
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    as it stands, I am going to be going perma meta, as with it, i am as mobile as I can ever be, and do not have to worry about my doomguard bugging out (killing small add and dg doesnt do anything for the rest of the fight, even though I used him him on the boss.) or the crap dps the infernal does. Cataclysm is too long of a cast, and has no cc involved. If it had cc, i can understand the minute long cd, but as it is, the cd is too long for what it is. Honestly the end tier sucks.

    With due note, this is ranting without actually having balance changes, so alot of help that is going to be, but seeing the difference between the classes and ours, just pisses people off, like me.

    Perma Meta... oh hey boomkins get the same thing, but, they dont get any dps loss with there eclipse going back and forth. The HoG weaving would probably be technically be a dps loss, as it is, does a bit more, but without being in meta, permanently, after placing up the first corruption, you are going to lose 30% of your dmg delt while being in it. so that also means to HoG, right when that second one lands. Chaos wave does about the same of HoG without going meta at the correct time, but then hog will lose 30% of its damage when you weave in. Honestly, the damage reduction makes me pissed about it. I know there needs balance changes, but 30% seems drastic. Not to mention, I would have simply changed soul fire to cost as much as ToC in meta, rather than make meta permanent.

    Cataclysm, my god, how bad this spell is. The abysmal amount of damage it does on such a long cd and long cast. that all is really what needs to be said. The cd is far to long for what it is. Hell, for aoe, Perma meta is better, chaos wave for the win. better burst. But, oh, if you need dots rolling, roll a bunch of dooms out and get them imps. Cataclysm in it current iteration is shit, even for the other specs. No ifs ands or butts about it. Cataclysm needs buffs or just changed. Honestly, I would change it out for a Pit Lord Guardian, one on a 3-5 min cooldown.

    Permanent Dg/infernal. Dg is buggy as hell, and isnt that great of damage, unlike his cataclysm counterpart. And the Infernal.. LOL that guy needs buffs galore. Dg has no control, so if you place it on a target, it just casts at that one target. typically 17 doombolts? over a minute duration.Does not scale with haste, even though they said he did, and is just a bad damage over all. There is no utility with either of them, so the two are just aweful pets, unless they get some serious buffs, and we can get actual control over them. While I wish this talent was better, I like this talent the best out of them, but, probably not as good as perma meta. For this, I would simply make them a permanent pet, like the felguard, with there own unique things, like they used to have, when they were enslavable, but also have out one of your minor demons, and give you two pet action bars. Yes, I know more to keep up with, but lots more utility.

  11. #51
    Very hard too make a proper comment before we see the mechanical changes on all the three specs.

    The eonly one that looks solid from the start is Cataclysm on Destros: that's some serious meter padding on a fight like Garrosh.

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Skayth View Post
    Cataclysm, my god, how bad this spell is. The abysmal amount of damage it does on such a long cd and long cast. that all is really what needs to be said. The cd is far to long for what it is. Hell, for aoe, Perma meta is better, chaos wave for the win. better burst. But, oh, if you need dots rolling, roll a bunch of dooms out and get them imps. Cataclysm in it current iteration is shit, even for the other specs. No ifs ands or butts about it. Cataclysm needs buffs or just changed. Honestly, I would change it out for a Pit Lord Guardian, one on a 3-5 min cooldown.
    Do you know that this is only the value without scaling: also the numbers are already squished; also at 90 you have after squish 35k life, so 10k is not low. And the numbers that are shown are all for level 90; not for level 100 when the talent hits. Numbers can be balanced and scaling will not be there until the first PTR hit (and even then not). Also like it is already said this is an alpha-version; cds can be reduced, damage can be adjusted.

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Cebel View Post
    Except doomguard does less dps than imp anyways, ill be taking the first talent for affi, and cataclysm for the other 2 specs as they stand now, but we'll prob have completely different talents come release, no big deal, not gonna even bother theorycrafting them now lol.

    Also LOL I've literally been brain fried the past 2 days with all this info, and i literally just realized chaotic resources makes demo and destro fuckin insane turret machines as far as pve is concerned.
    Yes, I know. I presumed that Blizz would change the pet dps mechanics and make doomguard a little/lot stronger than the imp, because otherwise the talent would be pretty useless.

    Also, I second your thoughts on demo/destro with chaotic ressources. Sounds insane haha.

  14. #54
    They will obviously change the way inferno/DG works similarly to a shaman's last tier talent that makes their elementals permanent ( currently) , as the elementals also gain abilities, I figured that's what we'll get, technically speaking it'll be as if we have 2 new pets that just look like our DG/inferno .

  15. #55
    Brewmaster Naztrak's Avatar
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    Now, if just Manoroths fury could increase the dmg of Cataclysm..
    PvE is a minigame // Rerolled from affly to spriest after 8 years, thx pandaland changes

  16. #56
    Moderator Nicola's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spookyy View Post
    Yes, I know. I presumed that Blizz would change the pet dps mechanics and make doomguard a little/lot stronger than the imp, because otherwise the talent would be pretty useless.
    It will probably work like ghoul for Death Knights. As Blood/Frost you get a shitty version and as unholy you get a permanent one with abilities and better scaling with your own stats.

    Quote Originally Posted by Naztrak View Post
    Now, if just Manoroths fury could increase the dmg of Cataclysm..
    I wouldn't count on it, with the statsquish in mind, the damage of Cataclysm already seems to be rather high.

  17. #57
    I am going to enjoy being a god with Demo;D

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    Btw cataclysm is dog shit compared to the feral version of it. LOL aoe rakes.. wtf was blizzard thinking ;-;

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  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Aminally View Post
    I guess it's too early to speculate on numbers. They'll be changed before beta, they'll be changed during beta, and then they'll change them again when WoD hits live. Right now it seems that you'll get CB-spamming machine from Destro, nearly-infinite Meta for demo and just a tad stronger affli with this talent. Demo and destro versions of this talent oversimplify both specs (yep, and we wondered how Blizzes could make destro more mind-numbing), but numbers will be fixed.

    In fact, even third talent looks quite ambiguous right now. It's passive, yet it has CD and cast-time (probably for demon-resummoning, but still curious about it). And it's not stated whether this pet replaces normal pet or not.
    Over simplify destroy with the talent?? It's the same just more chaos bolts to cast. If anything it makes you cast differently.

  19. #59
    The Patient nulir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by roflwaffle View Post
    you lose a major source of burst at the cost of (probably) breaking even on damage overall, it'll be interesting to see with numbers finalized
    Nah just spec into servitude and then you get a second doomguard on a 3min CD for the burst.

  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Cebel View Post
    Except doomguard does less dps than imp anyways, ill be taking the first talent for affi, and cataclysm for the other 2 specs as they stand now, but we'll prob have completely different talents come release, no big deal, not gonna even bother theorycrafting them now lol.

    Also LOL I've literally been brain fried the past 2 days with all this info, and i literally just realized chaotic resources makes demo and destro fuckin insane turret machines as far as pve is concerned.
    the demo version is basically just caster form dps but it will ynergize well with immolation aura etc. the destro version i can only see its uses on single target dps, allowing you to spam a lot more chaos bolts and shadowburns giving them an extremely powerful execute but their aoe dps will suck tho but ofc it will depend how the 75% dmg reduction will be calculated.

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