View Poll Results: How do you feel about the Lone Wolf talent?

Voters
584. You may not vote on this poll
  • I really hate it.

    22 3.77%
  • I would prefer a different approach.

    42 7.19%
  • Indifferent. (or "other". Discuss below)

    38 6.51%
  • It sounds cool, but I will stick with a pet, personally.

    83 14.21%
  • Amazing! Finally an archer/ranger spec!

    399 68.32%
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  1. #161
    Quote Originally Posted by Skayth View Post
    As a warlock, I am going to tell you, its going to be nerfed to do less damage than with a pet with the other talents. Its the same as grimore of sacrifice... and you are a "pet class" just like us.

    Contrary to belief no "spec" does more damage without the pet... sym wise. Destro, the one that everyone uses now with gosac, technically, you should do 1-2k more with a pet, but its so miniscule everyone just sacs the pet.
    Its not exactly because of "pet class." Blizzards intention is to make active talents a little better than passive ones so that people dont just play the easy way and use all passive talents. It probably will be slightly less than the others but I will still use it.

  2. #162
    The Patient Madwolf's Avatar
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    I'll never be able to give up my pets. It's just become to apart of the class for me. I'd feel lonely with out them. However, I understand this is how some people want to play the class. As long as they take care of us BM Hunters and we're not neglected to the ends of the world again I'm perfectly okay with it.

  3. #163
    Quote Originally Posted by Madwolf View Post
    I'll never be able to give up my pets. It's just become to apart of the class for me. I'd feel lonely with out them. However, I understand this is how some people want to play the class. As long as they take care of us BM Hunters and we're not neglected to the ends of the world again I'm perfectly okay with it.
    This is what worries me as someone who prefers SV and MM to BM, yet still enjoys the pet aspect of the class. With this talent, they are basically saying "BM is the pet spec and the other specs are fine without a pet." I don't like that message at all. There are other ranged classes that don't have pets; if I wanted range with no pet, I would have rolled one of those classes instead. I fully understand that there are other options to choose, but my concern is if it because the "best" talent to choose for SV/MM at 100 and I'm "stuck" using it for min/max purposes. I won't be happy with that situation at all.

  4. #164
    i hate pets so much

  5. #165
    Field Marshal Zanzili's Avatar
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    It is a good talent and it almost offers as much dps as a pet that is active. But you give up allot of utility that a pet offers. So my choice is 50/50 if i should take it or not. Also if you still use pet and that talent the pet gets its old role back of tanking allot more.
    Special thanks to Shyama for the Signature

  6. #166
    Warchief
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    i'd preffer they fix buggy pet ai, but its cool choice to have

  7. #167
    Brewmaster Zaxio's Avatar
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    I still cant believe that this talent will see the live realms
    30% damage buff for hunters w/o pet imagine the crying in PvP it will be HUGE
    That talent should be passive to MM and SVV spec and not active against other players if we want to see something like this, and on his place to put talent who not only gives all pet specials but also to can non BM to tame Exotic pets

  8. #168
    Quote Originally Posted by Nemesiz View Post
    To me, this seems halfarsed.

    Imo. make MM a petless spec, do it right the first time. Remove / rework the talent so it does not affect Survival to the extent that that spec becomes petless. Having a pet is the essence of being a hunter in my world. There is a reason the class is called "Hunter" and not "Ranger".

    I am absolutely mortified by the poll results...
    I have a feeling they will eventually do exactly what you said. At the moment however, I don't think they have enough dedicated resources to fully "do it right" as you said and therefor chose not to.

    The one thing that is kind of silly about it to me is giving it to SV. It should have a different affect for BM,SV,and MM. A survivalist in my mind would definitely want a wolf or bear pet to keep them company, keep warm at night, help hunt, and have for protection against other predators. If I lived in the woods and could tame a huge beast to look after me, I damn well would.

    MM on the other hand works perfectly with this. A marksman is a lone gunman that lies in wait to assassinate folks from a distance. He/She would not need or even want a pet as it would create more noise and attention for the shooter.

    /nerdbrainoff

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Zaxio View Post
    I still cant believe that this talent will see the live realms
    30% damage buff for hunters w/o pet imagine the crying in PvP it will be HUGE
    That talent should be passive to MM and SVV spec and not active against other players if we want to see something like this, and on his place to put talent who not only gives all pet specials but also to can non BM to tame Exotic pets
    My pets save my ass all the time in PvP. My spider's web, my gorilla's interrupt, hyena's slow. You're giving up not only another target to direct your enemy's attention too, but also all the utility the pet provides for a ranged class. I think it's a toss up. Your pet does quite a bit of DPS too.

    In PvE, hunters without pets on long fights like bosses will no doubt be slightly under those with pets.

    I find it to be quite balanced.

  9. #169
    Its gunna be so shit for MM and SV, With or Without You
    Interesting, for BM not much changes. Just a bit more pet dmg.

    No one seems to have mentioned the benefit a pet brings for MM and SV... we need to use RoS and master's call (and pet abilities) in PvP and arena, Trading a pet CC for increased damage seems like a fair trade off, trading it for RoS + Freedom + pet CC doesn't to me since these are such important abilities.

    With pet:
    Pet cc
    Roar of sac
    Masters call
    plus pet buff

    Without pet:
    30% more damage

    Really not happy about it tbh,a shit trade off a pet is like a must have in pvp.

    Hunters are getting fucking banged with these shit talents, every other class has good ones, dont even get me started on priests and rogues, shadow reflection jesus that better have reduced damage.
    Last edited by Headtop; 2013-11-14 at 07:39 PM.

  10. #170
    Stood in the Fire Les Grossman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra6 View Post
    The one thing that is kind of silly about it to me is giving it to SV. It should have a different affect for BM,SV,and MM. A survivalist in my mind would definitely want a wolf or bear pet to keep them company, keep warm at night, help hunt, and have for protection against other predators. If I lived in the woods and could tame a huge beast to look after me, I damn well would.

    /nerdbrainoff
    If my main focus was survival, I think I would eat the beast and use its fur and bones to make warm clothing and tools.

  11. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by jaimelannister View Post
    This is what worries me as someone who prefers SV and MM to BM, yet still enjoys the pet aspect of the class. With this talent, they are basically saying "BM is the pet spec and the other specs are fine without a pet." I don't like that message at all. There are other ranged classes that don't have pets; if I wanted range with no pet, I would have rolled one of those classes instead. I fully understand that there are other options to choose, but my concern is if it because the "best" talent to choose for SV/MM at 100 and I'm "stuck" using it for min/max purposes. I won't be happy with that situation at all.
    As is: even with the talent you will still do more single-target damage with the pet. At new max level the pet will do 25% of your damage (which is 33% of the damage you are capable of doing yourself--it's designed that way. This does exclude item procs, and lucky critical streaks). A 30% damage increase without the pet means that you're doing 97.5% of the damage that you would do with a pet. This is merely almost complete compensation (although they'll need to balance multi-target abilities). Pets are not an endangered species. Players looking to maximize damage across all 3 specs will still use them. They'll tweak the talent every new tier to keep it that way. Aoe still needs some adjusting.

    I've been sending requests for this talent (at half its current strength) twice a week since my return to the game for MoP (the in game suggestions weren't in game when I left, or I'd have started sooner). The only thing that's actually unique to hunters is Archery, and archers are all over the place in fiction. Hank, Hawkeye, Green Arrow, Robin Hood, Legolas, that girl from the Hunger Games. Lots. There are even petless archer npcs in wow, but no petless players (except me, outside of raids). I hate pets. I just want to play an archer. If I wanted to play a caster with no pet I'd play a shadow priest or a mage (maybe even a druid, or shaman)--not a warlock. But given that there is only 1 archery class . . .

    I can't quantify my excitement over this talent.

  12. #172
    I love my class.. I REALLY do.. I have had this Hunter since Vanilla.. But pets have always bugged my the hell out, often buggs out of me when soloing, running away with adds, getting stuck and so on..

    I welcome this, also because you STILL have the option to run with pet, and most probably will! But I LOVE being (HOPEFULLY) viable without a pet.

  13. #173
    Since I hate BM spec and always was playing surv or mm, I highly praise this talent. We have no more dead zone, pets have no management tied to them, so why should we even bother with pets? Archer/ranger is a thing to go.

  14. #174
    Pandaren Monk vep's Avatar
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    But, but... Hunters without a pet are just... Archers :/
    And even though it's reached new heights, I rather like the restless nights. It makes me wonder, makes me think there's more to this, I'm on the brink. It's not the fear of what's beyond, it's just that I might not respond! I have an interest, almost craving, would I like to get to far in?!

  15. #175
    Herald of the Titans Lovestar's Avatar
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    Right idea (and heinously overdue). Wrong implementation.

    This isn't something that should be balanced around as a massive end-level power boost. This has the potential to force Rangers into being babysitters, and Beastmasters into being loners — because no matter what the actual numbers are, WoW players tend to lemming based on popular pressure, DPS charts, or very legitimate utility requirements.

    This is a choice every Hunter should be allowed to make for themselves, from early on, without having to feel guilty about it. I'm glad they finally are respecting archers that don't want to be babysitters, but they need to find a more user-friendly way to give you that choice.

    As it stands right now, Lone Wolf is going to be a huge, huge mess that will be tweaked and patched nonstop in general trainwreck fashion. Thankfully, the preview at BlizzCon was obviously a rough draft, at best.

    Then again, we've seen huge messes escape Beta many, many times, so it's never too early to speak up.
    Last edited by Lovestar; 2013-11-15 at 09:28 AM.

  16. #176
    Quote Originally Posted by veltheranger View Post
    As is: even with the talent you will still do more single-target damage with the pet. At new max level the pet will do 25% of your damage (which is 33% of the damage you are capable of doing yourself--it's designed that way. This does exclude item procs, and lucky critical streaks). A 30% damage increase without the pet means that you're doing 97.5% of the damage that you would do with a pet. This is merely almost complete compensation (although they'll need to balance multi-target abilities). Pets are not an endangered species. Players looking to maximize damage across all 3 specs will still use them. They'll tweak the talent every new tier to keep it that way. Aoe still needs some adjusting.
    Except that that's not true. Pets (in SV and MM) aren't and wouldn't do 25% of total damage. They do ~10-12% of total. Stampede is another 5%. And btw interesting thing, in current realisation WoWY talent gives more bonus to SV/MM (without pet) than BM (with pet): 13% vs 5%. Simple math:
    BM: 0.6 + 0.4 * 1.7/1.5 = 1.0533, 5% dps bonus (~40% BM pet's damage percent of total, 50% - current Combat Experience value)
    SV: (1 - 0.12 - 0.05) * 1.3 + 0.05 = 1.129, 13% dps bonus {~12% SV pet's damage percent of total, 5% stampede's damage percent}

  17. #177
    Pit Lord Alltat's Avatar
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    I like it, but I really dislike that it's a level 100 talent. It should be a level 15 talent or a glyph, but I guess it's easier to introduce it this way and see how people react.
    Diplomacy is just war by other means.

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