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  1. #1

    10m Heroic Dark Shamans - How hard is it?

    I'm looking at this fight and if you 3 tank it, it really doesn't seem like much of a challenge. Am I missing something? Why are people saving this for their 8th heroic?

  2. #2
    Don't know. Perhaps they have a suboptimal setup for this encounter and are lacking a 3rd tank or have too many melees.

    The fight is really easy if you 3 tank it. Also paladins really shine because of Hand of Purity and Hand of Protection. We 2 shot it last week.

  3. #3
    The other 7 first heroics seem like more of a challenge how?

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  4. #4
    Right but how easy compared to others. Is this easier than Fallen Protectors? Immerseus? Galakras? Where does it actually fall? Can we do this as the 2nd heroic or should it be 4th, 6th?

    I ask because the gear from it is really rather good compared to the other bosses. I'd like to get those heroic trinkets for our players.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Derpette View Post
    The other 7 first heroics seem like more of a challenge how?
    You're not helpful. Stop wasting everyone's time.

  5. #5
    You're asking why people are saving it for their 8th heroic. I counter by asking how the other 7 bosses are harder? They're not is the simple answer. Ergo people do the easier 7 first. Not rocket science.

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  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Derpette View Post
    The other 7 first heroics seem like more of a challenge how?
    We just got Garrosh last night. We have three tanks available in our 10. What order of bosses would you suggest? I mean, would you really suggest we try heroic dark shamans with the three tank strat on our first heroic night this tier?

    I'm not being sarcastic, this is a real question. An HDARKSHAMAN kill on our first week of heroic would be a HUGE morale boost.

  7. #7
    The other 7 are easier, not a lot, but a bit. I think most guilds pretty much do it in order. Even with 3 tanks it takes decent movement and good healing, especially the last 25%.

  8. #8
    IMO:
    Norushen < Nazgrim < Protectors < Immerseus < Galakras < Juggernaut < Shamans < Sha

    but there are no huge differences. First 8 bosses are pretty easy.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Verain View Post
    We just got Garrosh last night. We have three tanks available in our 10. What order of bosses would you suggest? I mean, would you really suggest we try heroic dark shamans with the three tank strat on our first heroic night this tier?

    I'm not being sarcastic, this is a real question. An HDARKSHAMAN kill on our first week of heroic would be a HUGE morale boost.
    Don't go for it imo. Would be really silly if you ask me. From a ranged dps perspective (but also accounting for # of wipes we had both on progress/farm) I'd go for Norushen > protectors > immerseus as first 3. Obviously it sucks that if you kill norushen hc quick you can't go back so just go in order they are in I'd say. With the gear you'll have I'd even put malorok hc easier than shamans hc; maybe even spoils as well. Dark shamans hc isn't hard on paper with 3 tanks but there's still quite a bit of oneshot things that can go wrong. Our 2nd pull we had them on 8% or something, and yet overall I don't have to check DBM to know that most of our wipes on first 8 are on dark shamans.

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  10. #10
    If you have 3 tanks, the difficulty goes way down. If you don't, it's a challenging fight.

    That about cover it?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Verain View Post
    We just got Garrosh last night. We have three tanks available in our 10. What order of bosses would you suggest? I mean, would you really suggest we try heroic dark shamans with the three tank strat on our first heroic night this tier?

    I'm not being sarcastic, this is a real question. An HDARKSHAMAN kill on our first week of heroic would be a HUGE morale boost.
    I'd suggest doing Immerseus and Norushen the first week, with some pulls on Protectors. Norushen is the easiest of the three, but skipping Immerseus is kind of silly if you have the time to finish the place off.

    Don't expect any of the heroics to be easy-mode. Immerseus WILL wipe you over and over again until players start handling the mechanics properly.

  11. #11
    Even with 3 tanks it's still the hardest fight before malkorok.

  12. #12
    Definitely Immerseus for 1st HC boss. Other than that you might just progress the bosses in order.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Verain View Post
    We just got Garrosh last night. We have three tanks available in our 10. What order of bosses would you suggest? I mean, would you really suggest we try heroic dark shamans with the three tank strat on our first heroic night this tier?

    I'm not being sarcastic, this is a real question. An HDARKSHAMAN kill on our first week of heroic would be a HUGE morale boost.
    Do them in order. Dark Shaman's will rip you a new one. You have to keep things in perspective, the people saying "lol its easy" are 10-14 bosses ahead of you, that should tell you something. Chances are it will take you most of a raid night or longer to kill immerseus HC. Be realistic.

  14. #14
    Personally, Shamans caused us most problems of the first 8 bosses in there and we 3 tanked and 3 healed it. It does require some top notch play and you can't afford to lose anyone - which is very easy to do on this fight if people aren't focused.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Xaru View Post
    You're not helpful. Stop wasting everyone's time.
    While not the most constructive comment, he was completely right though.

    While Dark Shamans is not extremely hard, the other 7 of the first 8 heroic bosses are complete faceroll loot pinatas that just roll over. Malkorok and Spoils is what I would consider entry level heroic modes, the first 8 just feels like they are there to gear you up for the rest of the instance.

    I dont know why you would ever skip any of the first 6 heroic bosses to do dark shamans, regardless of raid setup. Shamans is not hard, but the first 6 is definately easier. If you do dark shamans before Nazgrim for linearity, that is fine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JustStampi View Post
    Definitely Immerseus for 1st HC boss. Other than that you might just progress the bosses in order.
    Norushen and Galakras is far easier than Immerseus. If you are a raid guild with limited time on your hands, getting those two down the first week could be an idea.
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  16. #16
    We killed it last night for the first time and I (resto shaman) found it to be easier than everything prior excluding Norushen, I was healing the two tanks on Earthbreaker. Our average item level is around 563 but our balance druid who went tank spec for tanking Earthbreaker was forced to wear some int gear because he didn't have a tanking set. Setup was:

    On Earthbreaker
    Resto shaman
    Prot pally
    Guardian Druid

    On Wavebinder
    Disc priest
    Prot warrior
    Enh shaman
    Ele shaman
    Shadow priest
    Warlock
    Mage

    Three tanking really trivializes pretty much everything about it, the spike damage can be pretty high at times but if the healers pay attention to timers this fight is a joke. I imagine not having a disc priest could substantially up the difficulty however.

  17. #17
    I don't know what it was about Dark Shamans, but it was almost the easiest boss for us. Took us roughly 10 wipes to kill it in about an hour and a half time span. 3 tanking just makes the fight SO trivial. Took us more wipes on Nazgrim, sadly, then it did Shamans. If you have 3 tanks, tank separately and collect loot. Like firefly said, it doesn't really seem like *Heroics* until you get to malkorok. Currently working on Thok atm, which is leap and bounds ahead of the first 8.

  18. #18
    Warchief Radio's Avatar
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    3 tanking does make the fight a lot easier but it is still more challenging than the other heroic bosses in the first 8.

    Your experience on the fight will also change heavily depending on your class makeup:
    - melee heavy sucks, we killed it with two melee
    - absorb healers are OP for saving lives on this fight in both camps, we had a disc for kardris but no absorbs for haromm, iron prison is heavily trivialised by PWS
    - paladins are great for handling toxicity with hand of purity
    - etcetc

    The main challenge of dark shamans is gibbing. Ability combos regularly line up at once and can quite easily claim someone, and while this is mitigated somewhat by the 3 tank strat, it's still the biggest killer, and Falling Ash still hits everyone in the raid. Tank damage is also quite bursty and frequently mixes moderate physical hits with huge magic nukes. Your raid will also have to fine tune their understanding on the positioning requirements of both camps. Haromm camp has to be able to place tombs well and line up the walls properly, while also having a plan for foul strem. Kardris camp still has to do the toxic storm roundabout with foul geyser kiting where it is very easy for someone not paying attention to block people off.

    TL;DR: Dark shamans is not something you can pick off in your first week if you're only just getting to heroics now, you'll have much more luck aiming for immerseus>protectors>norushen>galakras>nazgrim for the easiest kills, jugg/sha/shamans still require a bit of a step up from there.

  19. #19
    Mechagnome Razecog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radio View Post
    TL;DR: Dark shamans is not something you can pick off in your first week if you're only just getting to heroics now, you'll have much more luck aiming for immerseus>protectors>norushen>galakras>nazgrim for the easiest kills, jugg/sha/shamans still require a bit of a step up from there.
    You what. Juggernaut is pure faceroll. 3 heal and GG.
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  20. #20
    Brewmaster Cherrypowdah's Avatar
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    go through the heroics in order, if you'we taken 6 weeks to clear normal mode, I'm assuming you're mostly normal geared, and there is no real gearcheck for you left to see, first 8 bosses in order are also all equally easy, as in 8 hours of progress > be done with it easy, also assuming you'we studied strategies and dont have to develop a new strategy for a really odd raidsetup from scratch.

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