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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    That doesn't change the point that they have yet to have instanced content where the most viable build comps don't revolve around glass cannons.
    I don't run glass cannon on my guard I run a support hammer/2h build and it works just fine hell there has been many times if I wasn't running that build we would die like on the spider boss in AC.

    There is many builds that work well its just sadly most go glass cannon and do it really bad.
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  2. #22
    bunch of mouth breathers in here

    anyway, good deal this sale

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Doozerjun View Post
    bunch of mouth breathers in here

    anyway, good deal this sale
    Couldn't agree more with both comments.

    It is a really good deal I have had GW2 since release and still say its worth the 60$ I payed for it. Right now I don't play as much I only log in to knock out my new content achievements and thats about it. Been playing Kingdom Hearts Birth By Sleep,The Last of Us and Maplestory mostly atm.
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  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Jtbrig7390 View Post
    I don't run glass cannon on my guard I run a support hammer/2h build and it works just fine hell there has been many times if I wasn't running that build we would die like on the spider boss in AC.

    There is many builds that work well its just sadly most go glass cannon and do it really bad.
    Any dungeon is able to be completed by any assortment of competent players running any half-playable build in rare or higher quality gear. The keyword in my post is "most viable". A 30/30/0/0/10 staff ele in celestial gear might be viable, but it's hardly the optimal build to run. In WoW, differences of 5% DPS will make or break a class, that is the kind of demographic that is being dealt with here. GW2 is not balanced around it, and its combat mechanics at the moment don't support it.

    Do you really even want a game where such slight differences will get you kicked from any non-casual instance group? Really, what are you trying to argue here? There's a reason why people play GW2, and all those people would leave if ArenaNet tried to pretend to be Blizzard.
    Last edited by Larynx; 2013-11-13 at 03:16 AM.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    Any dungeon is able to be completed by any assortment of competent players running any half-playable build in rare or higher quality gear. The keyword in my post is "most viable". A 30/30/0/0/10 staff ele in celestial gear might be viable, but it's hardly the optimal build to run. In WoW, differences of 5% DPS will make or break a class, that is the kind of demographic that is being dealt with here. GW2 is not balanced around it, and its combat mechanics at the moment don't support it.
    Most builds are viable in guild wars 2 and that is my point. Its not all glass cannon and like I said I don't even run glass cannon on my guard.

    Just because you or ur group mainly runs glass cannon dose not mean its the most viable build. Now if u don't do a build right it is junk but as I said its not just glass cannon there is many builds for each class that works really well.
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  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Jtbrig7390 View Post
    Most builds are viable in guild wars 2 and that is my point. Its not all glass cannon and like I said I don't even run glass cannon on my guard.

    Just because you or ur group mainly runs glass cannon dose not mean its the most viable build. Now if u don't do a build right it is junk but as I said its not just glass cannon there is many builds for each class that works really well.
    Again, what are you trying to argue here? Are you disagreeing for the sake of disagreement or what? Because from your post you seem the exact opposite of Mr. Optimal Theorycrafter, yet you're saying I'm wrong when I'm saying that GW2 is not Mr. Optimal Theorycrafter.

  7. #27
    Scarab Lord Karizee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    That doesn't change the point that they have yet to have instanced content where the most viable build comps don't revolve around glass cannons. Again, a 25m raider in WoW would not find content like that interesting if that 25m raider is specifically looking for content similar to 25m raids in WoW. Maybe I wasn't clear enough, or maybe you and everyone else didn't bother to read the message I was replying to.

    The point is that GW2 can not appeal, and has not shown any ability to ever appeal, to the core 25m raider demographic. There's no need to get your panties in a bunch because someone dares to say anything negative about the game. Which it is not wholly negative depending on one's position. I am just making a neutral observation.

    Calm down, Larynx. I don't think ArenaNet is too awfully terribly concerned about capturing that HUUUUUGE demographic ;-)

    http://www.wowprogress.com/rating.tier16_25
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  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Karizee View Post
    Calm down, Larynx. I don't think ArenaNet is too awfully terribly concerned about capturing that HUUUUUGE demographic ;-)

    http://www.wowprogress.com/rating.tier16_25
    I don't think so either. That's my entire point, so I don't understand why everyone is leaping at me with fangs and claws barred when no one actually disagrees with me about 25m raiding.

    I don't think GW2 should have 25m raiding, and I don't think it has the capability to ever support it either. Why is this perceived as bad?

  9. #29
    Great game I don't actively play right now but was a great buy this summer. Doesn't even need raiding. I would recommend anyone who has even thought about trying it to take advantage of the sale. It's a 1 time buy there really is little risk involved.

  10. #30
    Scarab Lord Karizee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    I don't think so either. That's my entire point, so I don't understand why everyone is leaping at me with fangs and claws barred when no one actually disagrees with me about 25m raiding.

    I don't think GW2 should have 25m raiding, and I don't think it has the capability to ever support it either. Why is this perceived as bad?
    Oh, I don't think it can either. Not because of the often quoted "no trinity" aspect (that's really a non-issue) but because a raid is designed to progress through it by acquiring gear to make your character more powerful. Since the gear treadmill is so shallow (1/2 a tier in over a year) the standard raid concept simply won't work. Encounters have to be more skill based, but they can't be SO tough that only the top 1% or whatever could beat them because that's all that would ever complete them. ANet isn't making the mistake of trying to chase down that eensy teensy market.

    I mean, the closest we have to a raid is the Tequatl encounter which is more about coordinating 150 cats to execute the mechanics than it is about executing perfect rotations. That and of course WvW which can be very skill based on some servers.

    But they have been putting out a nice range of content difficulty lately, once a month or so we see tears on the forums - it's too harrrrd!
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  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by icedwarrior View Post
    Whether or not you feel that the game "lived up to the hype" is irrelevant in this discussion.
    Don't worry about the reptile, he is just a negative nancy.

    If you don't like sub fees, you are a cheapskate that doesn't deserve to play the games they do, or you are broke and therefore a failure at life.

    What a great attitude to have in life, especially towards others!



    Ty, op, been considering this game lately. Have played just about every other MMO on the market.


    Key point mentioned above; never buy into hype; it usually comes down to fanboys and haters bickering and one-ups-manship that doesn't usually reflect even what the product wishes to put forth. Read/watch unbiased reviews and ignore everything on fan sites like this, or at least understand that you have to sift through it and people speak from personal perpsective, while some people mindlessly hate/love no matter what it is truly like.


    There are quite a few good MMOs out there, so much hate would lead you to think otherwise.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by RAWRF View Post
    I'm sorry kiddo. But I think if GW2 offered real 25 man raid content WoW would be seriously hurting right now.
    I'm glad it doesn't. That was one of the reasons I left WoW, that the endgame was focused on such content, and that it relied on an endgame model at all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    GW2 can't really even get 5m content right, so I'm not sure. It's a great game, but most raiders expect more than DPS zerging down a boss.
    I'm glad it doesn't get it right, i.e. relying on trinity mechanics to create fun content, as you seem to infer 'right' as being. I quite like my zerging down bosses. Battlefield: Barrens was the most fun I'd had in WoW in a long time. GW 2 is like it all the time. Which is beyond awesome.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    That doesn't change the point that they have yet to have instanced content where the most viable build comps don't revolve around glass cannons. Again, a 25m raider in WoW would not find content like that interesting if that 25m raider is specifically looking for content similar to 25m raids in WoW. Maybe I wasn't clear enough, or maybe you and everyone else didn't bother to read the message I was replying to.

    The point is that GW2 can not appeal, and has not shown any ability to ever appeal, to the core 25m raider demographic. There's no need to get your panties in a bunch because someone dares to say anything negative about the game. Which it is not wholly negative depending on one's position. I am just making a neutral observation.
    Molten and Aetherblade dungeons didn't work great for all zerker groups.

    However, you're right in that it won't have 25m standard raid like content. I don't think they have an interest in doing that. If they do something large scale, it will be of their own style. Like Tequatl or this Nightmare Tower.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by zed zebes View Post
    Molten and Aetherblade dungeons didn't work great for all zerker groups.

    However, you're right in that it won't have 25m standard raid like content. I don't think they have an interest in doing that. If they do something large scale, it will be of their own style. Like Tequatl or this Nightmare Tower.
    Gotta say I'm impressed by Nightmare Tower. It's well put together and basically organically creates groups as people are forced to slow down fighting content.

  15. #35
    There was a 50% off sale for the game last week I believe, it was on the front page of MMO Champion (the advertisement).

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Karizee View Post
    Calm down, Larynx. I don't think ArenaNet is too awfully terribly concerned about capturing that HUUUUUGE demographic ;-)

    http://www.wowprogress.com/rating.tier16_25
    They don't break it out by number of players here, but I am sure the majority are from LFR (25 man). Close to 60% to 80% of WoW players raid. It isn't some small niche.

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/content/...Fan-Art-Update

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    That doesn't change the point that they have yet to have instanced content where the most viable build comps don't revolve around glass cannons. Again, a 25m raider in WoW would not find content like that interesting if that 25m raider is specifically looking for content similar to 25m raids in WoW. Maybe I wasn't clear enough, or maybe you and everyone else didn't bother to read the message I was replying to.

    The point is that GW2 can not appeal, and has not shown any ability to ever appeal, to the core 25m raider demographic. There's no need to get your panties in a bunch because someone dares to say anything negative about the game. Which it is not wholly negative depending on one's position. I am just making a neutral observation.
    Hey, dude, I wasn't attacking you. I was correcting you.
    Some parts of the game does require coordination and have a high difficulty level (like fractals), that's what I said in the comment you quote. I never said it was appealing enough for the core 25man raider demographic, I even start my comment by saying "The game is not focused on raids". But again, my point was, the game can be difficult if you do the apropiate content.

    Gw2 has changed from their original release, increising it's difficulty. Also in this kind of difficulty, it gets skill based not gear based, so it won't appeal to the raider population. Eventhough I play 25h in WoW, but that's just me.

    And I'm glad they are different, I won't be playing the same game twice.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sharuko View Post
    GW2 has been on sales literally 10 times in the last two months. It had two 40% of sales in October '13 alone. It is also on sale at Amazon on the moment (30% off)

    My advice, wait till it goes F2P. You are wasting your money regardless of sale.
    It will always be like that. Do you own a Steam account? or an Origin account? if so you will understand that this kind of games they are constantly doing this, and it will never go completely free, since you can still buy GW1, and it doesn't have a suscription, so it's the way they make money.

    If you don't own one of these accounts, you are probably not a gamer. Then I will try to explain you this way, on steam you can buy portal2 for 3usd like 10-12 times a year. Portal2 was GOTY dude.
    Last edited by Trollhamaren; 2013-11-13 at 07:49 AM.
    OBEY THE PUG!

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Projections View Post
    They don't break it out by number of players here, but I am sure the majority are from LFR (25 man). Close to 60% to 80% of WoW players raid. It isn't some small niche.

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/content/...Fan-Art-Update
    Interesting graph, especially looking at the last SoO wing absent the LFR players. But I specifically wasn't referring to the LFR raider (I don't think Larynx was either), in fact I think that kind of player would enjoy GW2 more since there is so very much large scale content that you don't have to tweak a bunch of macros or min/max a bunch of gear for with a helluva lot less griefing, trolling, queues - a real jump in and play type experience. And for that LFR raider that pretty much burns through a LFR raid within a month or so and then spends the next 3-6 months waiting for the next patch to drop, the 2 week content cycle with no sub fee is infinitely more attractive.

    Now for the hardcore raider that's all about shooting for a spot on the WoLs, this is not the game they want. For the leet dungeon runner however there's a good amount of challenge. Again, it's not about a gear grind so it's what skill you bring to the encounters and how well you understand your class and since mechanics are pretty easy to figure out in any game (it's the treadmill that extends the content, not the mechanics) the content in GW2 will have a short life for those players - thus (again) Living Story.

    Now WvW is a whole different story, there's definitely a hardcore raider mentality and ethic there. I know there's a lot of shit thrown around about "zerg wars" or "lag wars" or "coverage wars" but the fact is a skilled player - one that min/maxes, one that knows the ins and outs of their class and one that's constantly adapting to the ever-evolving meta can grab a spot on the best teams that have the biggest success (while the typical LFR type person would be laughed off their forums if they put in an app)

    But this is all a bunch of yackity-yak from the back of backpack rap crap yep yep ex-hardcore raider. What do I know? ;-)


    (for the record I don't think GW2 is or could be a WoW killer any more than I think WoW is or could be a GW2 killer. I don't agree with RAWRF's assessment that if GW2 offered 25m raids that it would hurt WoW. They both have large loyal playerbases in the west, they both have measurable success, they both have earned spots in gaming history and both of them are the games that up and coming gamemakers are looking to for ideas)
    Last edited by Karizee; 2013-11-13 at 03:15 PM.
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  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Sharuko View Post
    GW2 has been on sales literally 10 times in the last two months. It had two 40% of sales in October '13 alone. It is also on sale at Amazon on the moment (30% off)

    My advice, wait till it goes F2P. You are wasting your money regardless of sale.
    Guild Wars 2 will never go f2p hell GW1 is still B2p and its just as old as WOW and I do believe its slightly older by a few months.
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  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Jtbrig7390 View Post
    Guild Wars 2 will never go f2p hell GW1 is still B2p and its just as old as WOW and I do believe its slightly older by a few months.
    Actually GW1 is 5 months younger than WoW, but close enough
    Last edited by rhandric; 2013-11-13 at 04:51 PM. Reason: GW1, not GW2

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryngo Blackratchet View Post
    Yeah, Rhandric is right, as usual.

  20. #40
    The game is not focused on raids, but there are world bosses, and let me tell you, the recent world bosses, dungeons and fractals, have a difficulty level and coordination needed that WoW has never had, since WoW have down its difficulty alot.


    Not going to get into good game/bad game stuff here, but honestly this is a ridiculous statement.

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