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  1. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by Xjev View Post
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    I think it makes a lot of sense, and was a brave move from Blizzard.
    I completely agree with you. I think it's a fantastic move forward, and I'm so happy to see Blizzard taking some brave/risky moves that appeal more to the original crowd. Excited!
    “You will hear thunder and remember me,
    And think: she wanted storms.” ϟ

  2. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by Xjev View Post
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    I think it makes a lot of sense, and was a brave move from Blizzard.
    This is another reason that class additions need to be very careful. We're already at 11 classes, we can't even currently take two of each class to a Mythic raid, one more class and we will be at the limit where we can take two of each class to a 25-man raid (which I believe they should have made mythic raids, but WTF do I know...). I don't think I see anything in here that justifies/explains going to 20-man instead of 25-man for heroic/mythic raids, just going for 20 instead of 10.
    "It is a demonstration of incomprehensible hubris to quote one's self, especially in one's own forum signature."
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  3. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by fierydemise View Post
    It never went away in heroic level content.
    I agree, you're never going to get away from that aspect.

    Bringing the class that a player can play right, is another way of putting it.

  4. #84
    They should have given Horsemen as an example too

  5. #85
    So much god damn whining it's unreal, glad to see a lot of you are fine with this change. I can't wait for the dust to settle and these forums can slightly get more positive.

    I also think you guys are forgetting that even though it's not that compelling to say just spell steal or bop, it depends how it's used, mage tanking like he said is pretty compelling for the mage and changes up traditional dps tank, as well boping can be crazy as hell if the tank has to use it on himself quickly take it off and pick stuff back up.

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by Melkandor View Post
    Honestly, it's Blizzard guys what more do you expect? They can and have repeatedly gone back on their word. Remember no Faction Transfers, no transferring from a PvE to a PvP realm, and everything else that they've done it too?
    OH my gosh...things change! The inhumanity! But Blizzard usually terms things in a way that even if they do a 180 they didn't lie.
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  7. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by BetrayedOf52 View Post
    , as well boping can be crazy as hell if the tank has to use it on himself quickly take it off and pick stuff back up.
    /cast taunt (w/e its called)
    /cast hand of protection
    /cancelaura hand of protection

    Yeah, crazy as hell.

  8. #88
    If you think that isn't a difference between 10 and 25 man heroic raiding you are wrong. They spend a lot of time having to tune both modes so that they are "far" and "balanced" for the 10 or 25 people. It makes sense to streamline that for 1 level of raiding. Making it so that all guilds are on the same level. It doesn't mean because they say you will need to spell-steal that they mean you will need one of each class. What it means is by spending more time on making one level of heroic difficulty they are making an overall better instance for those that want to raid hard-mode content. I raid in a ten man guild and instead of being a doomsayer we are just taking it one step at a time.

  9. #89
    Stood in the Fire Thete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eschatological View Post
    And again, the "compelling" mechanics statement is just BS. Do you think any serious 10 man lacked a priest, or a mage? .
    Who said anything about serious 10 mans? The vast majority of heroic raiders raid in the 10-man mode, yet the majority of high achieving guilds are 25-man; we don't manage that by carrying 10-man rejects.

    But if you insist, why do you think they settled on 20-man then?
    Retribution Paladin

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  10. #90
    I understand why people will be upset with this change but I do think overall this will be a good change for the game.

    Theres a lot of 10 man heroic guilds that have a good group of friends that they enjoy playing with and have good chemistry with and they enjoy the smaller group to raid with. So I do understand how this has a negative impact for those guilds.

    But if this allows for blizzard to spend more time on encounter design, quicker patches and new game features then I think it will be great for the game not only in mystic raiding but for non mystic raids as well.

    As for class specific mechanics I think they could do some really awesome things.

    I think they could do some pretty decent mechanics for spell reflect for warriors.
    Would love to spellsteal a buff as a mage that turns you into a core hound like they did in shadowlabs
    Priest could mind control adds that gave the raid temp buffs like 20% haste for 15 seconds or 20% damage reduction for 15 seconds

    I'm sure with more time they could come up with many more things to make dps, tanking and healing even more fun and interesting.

    I think they settled on 20 man because it would make it somewhat easier so that 2 10 man heroic guilds could merge for mystic raiding or 2 10 man guilds that have cleared heroic could attempt mystic together.

  11. #91
    Stood in the Fire
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xjev View Post
    Not on frontpage yet, so here we go:

    (Source, check blue tracker!)


    I think it makes a lot of sense, and was a brave move from Blizzard.
    RIght, great idea to cut out real raids in order to better focus on retard modes like flex and LFR

  12. #92
    Mechagnome Akarui's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vereesà View Post
    Bolded part is what matters here. I doubt people will even remember this going into T18 next expansion.
    Yup cause they'll announce another feature that everyone will get pissed off with.
    “4chan once took on the FBI and won,” a Brony told the New York Observer, “so you might say that My Little Pony is more powerful than the FBI.” Sethisto

  13. #93
    Quote Originally Posted by tangers58 View Post
    RIght, great idea to cut out real raids in order to better focus on retard modes like flex and LFR

    Nothing is by definition retard. Currently they tune LFR and FLEX to be like that, from what i discovered last night, doing flex for the first time.
    The question is: Can they tune em differently?
    Arguably they cant, if realistic (the uproar), for current flex and LFR. I suspect that it WILL be a bit harder to do Flex Heroic. What it won't be possible at all, is to TUNE that difficulty not to be absurd on a given setup and amount of people and piss easy in another!
    So, overall to counter that, i suspect that we wont see challenging normal (heroic next xpac) modes like the HoF ones or Elegon at launch or Horridon for 10 at start. I would prefer to take normal (future heroic) modes OUT of the flex system, but it is NECESSARY for the first tier, in order to help 10 mans that wanna do mythic to recruit for the last missing spots and test their recruits in combat.
    Unfortunately, once something is in, stays! So i am afraid that our normal(heroic in WOD) mode experience will be watered down from now on, at the exchange of easier access to mythic, and easier catching up for new recruits through WoD heroic mode runs one day per week!
    Giving it more thought though, I dont see this as a problem!
    -People that are wiping at current normal modes for 2 or more months, they will need half that time to gain access to mythic.
    -People that were storming through normals first week to access heroics, will do just the same
    -People that were not trying something tougher than LFR due to skill, time restrictions, will be able to do so now with much less trouble
    -Recruitment and their preparation, will be easier (and involving!)!

    Although it leaves a bitter taste in the mouth (remembering glorious normal modes like LK, Rag, Elegon that where FUN to wipe on), thinking more about it i see only a win/win situation!
    More people will be raiding.
    Challenge is there for all seeking for it, just a bit further at the progression curve than it used to be.
    Recruitment for more serious guilds (not the hard core, talking about top 1000-5000) and catching up for the recruits will be easier!
    Finally at the top of the tree, raiding will be balanced for all, the same for all, with one race that once again, for the first time after LK, will be able to determine the better team, without doupts about the fight being easier for the one or the other mode!

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