WoWs engine

[Deleted]

Srsly size of INT has nothing to do with it, you can store one number on few variables, or even arrays. If they wanted to use much bigger numbers it wouldn't be any problem.

[Raiju]

Srsly size of INT has nothing to do with it, you can store one number on few variables, or even arrays. If they wanted to use much bigger numbers it wouldn't be any problem.

Do you think they have spent so much time reducing redundant smart healing because they have nothing to do?

[TyrantWave]

Do you think they have spent so much time reducing redundant smart healing because they have nothing to do?

...what does that have to do with anything?

Smart heals are being reduced for gameplay reasons.

Heck, the only recent change I can think of is HPriest mastery -> It now ticks 1/3rd as often for 3x as much. Larger numbers shock horror! But less events, which causes Recount and such to lag (As well as network lag due to having 25 events/second per holy priest being sent alone from their mastery, let along everything else)

[Cyrops]

Srsly size of INT has nothing to do with it, you can store one number on few variables, or even arrays. If they wanted to use much bigger numbers it wouldn't be any problem.

Do you know how it would overcomplicate everything? I mean from programming side. You would have to rewrite a fuckload of code. Which would basicly mean that using a new engine would be more time efficient.

[Raiju]

...what does that have to do with anything?

Smart heals are being reduced for gameplay reasons.

Heck, the only recent change I can think of is HPriest mastery -> It now ticks 1/3rd as often for 3x as much. Larger numbers shock horror! But less events, which causes Recount and such to lag (As well as network lag due to having 25 events/second per holy priest being sent alone from their mastery, let along everything else)

And having to double up the amount of messages to a 32 bit client isn't going to lag?

Also you seem to be largely unaware, considering holy priests weren't even mentioned among the 2 main lag specs. (causing 10x what everyone else did)

[Cyrops]

Your freind simply has no clue of IT. And because of guys like your friend the internet guys seem so stupid.

As mentioned before, 32-Bit game. 2147483648 highest number that a 32-system can handle and do math with it. 2 Billion and a bit. Now guess why garrosh heals himself two times. His Health Pool in 25 man heroic would have been too big.

Please don't call others on their intelect then proceed on writing even lower quality posts.
32bit programs can only hold 32bits of information in a single variable. That is it.
WoW engine uses signed int's, so your largest single variable in WoW would be 2,147,483,647 divided by 2, which results in stuff like gold cap being 1mil gold.

[Baelroc]

Wow already increased its INT size awhile back as they were approaching their first breakpoint at the end of Wrath. The item squish is purely from a gameplay/longevity perspective. As numbers inflate upgrades and large crits SEEM less meaningful. (to the human brain going from 500 to 1000 at first sight (seeing the numbers popping up on the screen) seems much more noticeable than going from 500000 to 1000000).

[Cyrops]

Wow already increased its INT size awhile back as they were approaching their first breakpoint at the end of Wrath.

So Blizzard programmers broke the laws of physics? I would want to read such an article :O
Please provide source.

[Raiju]

Please don't call others on their intelect then proceed on writing even lower quality posts.
32bit programs can only hold 32bits of information in a single variable. That is it.
WoW engine uses signed int's, so your largest single variable in WoW would be 2,147,483,647 divided by 2, which results in stuff like gold cap being 1mil gold.

The health cap we have seen on 25hc this expansion disagrees with you on that. I remember reports of that titan boss (name is escaping me ¬¬) breaking if his health increased above 2.1B

[Cyrops]

The health cap we have seen on 25hc this expansion disagrees with you on that. I remember reports of that titan boss (name is escaping me ¬¬) breaking if his health increased above 2.1B

They might use unsigned ints for health. Garrosh resets HP as he would have over the 2.1B afaik.

[Raiju]

What? Garrosh is highest HP boss afaik, what titan boss?

Ra-den. Garrosh's health resets a lot to get around this issue.

[Synstir]

Your friend clearly has no knowledge of how computing works, so ignore him. The fact that you even slightly doubt Blizzard, and their vast experience of technology because your friend simply thinks otherwise is silly.

The Engine is a 32 bit piece of software, and as with all 32 bit software there is a maximum capacity that it can operate at, before it suffers serious issues. A 64 bit engine would most likely not ever run into those issues, but re-writing the engine from 32 to 64 isn't as simple as; int setEngineSpec == 64.

To give you can example of the scale, you can read this article http://www.zdnet.com/blog/hardware/c...confusion/3124, but the general point it stresses is the capacity that the two different versions would have.

32 bit = 4,294,967,296 bytes 4,294,967,296 / (1,024 x 1,024) = 4,096 MB = 4GB "capacity"

64 bit = 18,446,744,073,709,551,616 18,446,744,073,709,551,616 / (1,024 x 1,024) = 16EB "capabity"

To let you know how much 16EB is, that is 17,179,869,184 gigabytes.

Did you answer the question you quoted?

[Hyve]

Did you answer the question you quoted?

I wasn't answering a question, but addressing the logical issues of a 32 bit system. It can only make use of 4GB of RAM and also has various other limitations in the size of their variables. We've already seen in Mists of Pandaria several bosses reach that critical point ...

[Deleted]

The max 32-bit number is 2147483647. Which is also the maximum amount of cash in GTAV. That's all I know about "engine" vs "max number". I don't know if this applies to numbers in WoW.

I think the number squish is to simplify everything. I think it's good.

that number used to be WoW gold cap (counting it all in copper) was 214k gold times by 100 silver times by 100 copper

EDIT: equaling a little over 2.1billion, not sure how it was addressed, think the numbers now reset once you get 1g

[TyrantWave]

And having to double up the amount of messages to a 32 bit client isn't going to lag?

Also you seem to be largely unaware, considering holy priests weren't even mentioned among the 2 main lag specs. (causing 10x what everyone else did)

Holy priests were mentioned actually, as well as hunters. Hence the change to HPriests mastery.

And again, I've seen no doubling up of message sizes due to number parity to my knowledge.

[Raiju]

Holy priests were mentioned actually, as well as hunters. Hence the change to HPriests mastery.

And again, I've seen no doubling up of message sizes due to number parity to my knowledge.

Not yet, but without a squish it's very likely next expansion. Currently they've avoided the breakpoint with innovative mechanics

Hunters were brought down on the first wave, when asked they said holy paladins do 3-8x the number of events, and resto shamans (well. shamans) up to 25 times.

[TyrantWave]

They might use unsigned ints for health. Garrosh resets HP as he would have over the 2.1B afaik.

Signed cap is 2.14B. Unsigned cap is 4.29B.

Not yet, but without a squish it's very likely next expansion. Currently they've avoided the breakpoint with innovative mechanics

Hunters were brought down on the first wave, when asked they said holy paladins do 3-8x the number of events, and resto shamans (well. shamans) up to 25 times.

Again, I'd need to check the message format through wireshark, but to keep it short: The odds of a message needing to be resized like that is very low. Let's say we'd go up to chaos bolts of 15M next xpac.
That's still less than 1% of Ra-Den's health, which is also being updated on most packets.

It's the amount of events, not the size of them, that causes issues. HoTs on 25 people, per healer, for example are a large cause.

[Deleted]

I like how you call someone out and then prove you have no clue either.

In [1]: 2147483647 + 12345
Out[1]: 2147495992L

32 bit python shell, oh look I can break a 32 bit signed int.

However, the WoW engine has issues with the cap for its own reasons. This signed int is currently the type used (Realistically, it's more likely they use a float due to calculations, but treat it as a signed int, however that's not related here). It's not due to a 32 bit system, it's due to how the WoW engine handles data types.

Now, they could update the engine to either work with floats if they don't already (A cap of 3.402823466 E + 38), or they could change the Signed Int to a Long Long type (9,223,372,036,854,775,807 cap).
This would be a large amount of work, to say the least - changing a data type in an old engine could quite easily cause issues in other parts of it.
So instead of doing that, Blizz right now is doing a stat squish. I'd prefer an engine update, but I'm not Blizzard.

Also, WoW's servers are most likely 64-bit, just to throw that in there.

Gosh....of course...you got how the 32Bit games work. And you do not have a clue what I meant. I'll give up