On melee uptime. Please forgive me for asking this, but - have you PVP'd on melee, that is, did you do arenas other than for cap? That melee have reduced uptime in PVP compared to PVE isn't new, lol, they are compensated for that (granted, the balance is... not great). Generally, what matters is burst.
That the proc is frequent makes it better for sustained damage, decreasing RNG. If it procced less frequently, it would have been wasted more often, but on the other hand, the proc - taken alone - would be a last hit in more cases than now. These things largely equalize each other.
Last edited by rda; 2013-11-29 at 02:14 PM.
We have advantage in PvP instances. You have advantage in PvE instances. Both arguments nullified and irrelevant.
You have advantage in World vs ALL NPC's, monsters, etc.. We AGREE with that.
You have advantage VS REAL players in PvE gear. We DON'T agree with this.
We would like to be EQUAL to PvE gear outside of instances while you still have advantage VS NPCs, monsters, etc.
That is MORE than fair.
PVE content = PVE gear prevails
PVP content = PVP gear prevails
WPVP Zones (Wintergrasp, Tol Barad etc) = Scale the damn gear down to make it equally strong. Follow the example of CM..
Now it becomes tricky. The open world could be seen as a gigantic PVP zone, and that's not false. But, and that's not false either, it's also the largest PVE zone.
So we gotta dig deeper here.... The open world appears to be mandatory to leveling up the toons we play. Which indicates that it's more a PVE Zone than it is a PVP Zone, because even PVP toons have to level up.. So for the open world, the gear could stay untouched. Which gives PVE gear an edge over PVP gear, but not in every case. A good geared PVP toon is still superior to a shitty geared PVE toon.
That's my proposal.
"The pen is mightier than the sword.. and considerably easier to write with."
i didnt do any serious pvp in mop since, lets face it, its dogshit, but having top tier pvp gear being equal to previous, outdated pve tier is stupid. i mean c'mon 522 and you cant even upgrade it... while orange cloaks are 608 ilvl and 2/2 heroic warforged is 580 ilvl... its beyond stupid.
^This solution deserves its own thread on official forums imo.Better yet, have PVE Power on raiding gear which only works in raids, similarly to how PVP Power works for PVP encounters, and have raiding gear and PVP gear be the same ilvl. No gear scaling is necessary after that.
PVP Power - disabled in specific PVE ONLY zones (raids, dungeons)
PVE Power - disabled in PVP ONLY zones such as arenas and bgs
PVP Power + PVE Power enabled in WORLD zone (because its not purely pvp nor pve zone)
ILVLs difference would still be there - in *world zone* (where both has their appropriate powers enabled):
Heroic PVE > BG PVP
LFR PVE < Arena PVP
Heroic PVE = Arena PVP
LFR PVE = BG PVP
But thankfully Blizzard already knows that the current system is extremely flawed and costing them subscribers, so they will be fixing it in the next expansion.
I disagree, of course. Two guys fighting each other is PVP wherever this happens, and a guy in PVP gear should have an edge over a guy in PVE gear.
Here's one simple way to make this happen:
Suppose you cast a spell and that spell hits another player. You know that the damage you will deal to the player is going to be lower than if you were hitting a mob, right? Because the player has resilience. Good. Now, take that place in code that takes resilience into account and make it also scale the PVE pieces on you down, similarly to how it happens in arenas, even if you are not in an arena, but rather anywhere - in the world, in an instance, wherever.
Two problems: (a) it might be expensive to do the scaling for each spell computation-wise - solveable (guaranteed, the only thing a server has to do - if it doesn't already do it - is to store a temporary copy of your gear in memory scaled down to PVP levels, that's it), (b) might require an additional rule for heals - solveable as well, eg, via PVP flag (if you have PVP flag on or are healing a target with PVP flag on, they get a PVP-scaled heal, otherwise they get a PVE-scaled heal).
PS: I'd prefer having PVE Power (see earlier posts), but the above solution could work as well and doesn't introduce new stats.
Last edited by rda; 2013-11-29 at 02:49 PM.
And Skill and Coordination? You dont need that in an Arena or RBG? Please tell me again how hard it is to look at DBM and react when it tells you to.
Does no one else make this comparison?
https://twitter.com/holinka/status/405102576468635648 "Our goal is for PvP gear to be better than heroic gear for PvP in the outside world."
https://twitter.com/holinka/status/404445292184883201 "For Warlords, we want to do a much better job balancing PvE and PvP gear in the world"
The real problem at hand is that PvP is player vs. player. Any time you attack a player, you are engaging in PvP content, regardless of where it is. The fact that I am at a SIGNIFICANT disadvantage in player vs player combat because i dont raid is odd to me. In any PvP combat, a pvp geared player should have equal footing, or be at the advantage because their gear is designed to be appropriate for this type of situation.
Before the "learn to play better, or a good pvp player would have the skill to still win" comments come out, i'll go ahead and say maybe you are right. I'm not the best player. I previously was above 2200, i've played with good players, but i'm not the best. But when someone in PvE gear has 50+ ilvl's on me, 300k more hp than i do, and my healing gear doesn't do as much (i play a resto druid) because my pvp power is completely useless in that situation, something isn't right. I can get away most times if its 1v1. If i get gang raped while running around, whatever. That is just annoying but it happens, thats why i'm on a pvp server.
To everyone who likes PvE gear dominating the world PvP scene... from Blizzard on the topic!
"PvP gear will have more stats to choose from, and less worrying about hit caps! PvP Power will likely still exist to make sure PvP gear is powerful without being more powerful than PvE gear in PvE. Additional PvP changes are beyond the scope of this discussion, but we do want to make sure PvE gear doesn’t outstrip PvP gear for world PvP."
Your reign of dominating everyone despite piss-poor play will soon be over.
Manged to grind out fire-watcher and let me tell you most *pve* players tend to know more about pvp then there battleground counter parts...
I'm not saying this would hold true vs a glad but a lot pvpers kinda suck at pvp. Every class with the exception of locks and mages that had full pvp gear fought the exact same way. Every pvper opened the same way reacted the same way... it was like fighting a raid boss just more predictable...
Look honestly I think the days where you get to insta win in pvp gear is over. We might see it be closer next expansion but the whole kill a pver in a opener since you have magic gear is coming to its end accept it and move on.
Last edited by primalmatter; 2013-11-29 at 04:50 PM.