Return Group Quests Please in WoD...

[Itisamuh]

Silliest thing i've ever heard, there is way, WAY more quest gating today than there was before. Cataclysm especially was completely linear and required the previous quest done before you could even get the next one. Even the zone would be in a different phase until you did your quest. MoP gets somewhat less of that linearity but still, way, WAY too much. TBC and WOTLK and even vanilla allowed free roaming, do whatever quest you want style of lvling.

That was a much better way of doing things, and group quests were part of what made lvling more fun. In that you actually had to talk to other players. Oh my god! right? Using chat before hitting lvl 90?.

Having to do anything you don't want to isn't often a better way of doing things. If people want to talk, they don't need group quests to do it.

[Deleted]

hell no, keep them out.

Because spamming /1 General "LFM Ring of Blood" was soooo much fun!

Fact is people are selfish and eventually nobody who has past these quests will want to help anyone else do these quests when they hit level cap and have better things to do.

[Vasti]

Not sure if I want group quests, but I definitely think they should finally use scenarios for what they initially said they would. They were supposed to replace group quests, but.. then they put them at the level cap, not while levelling.

Would love more groupquests, but they won't work on some servers or after a while, so I'll go with Drathos. Scenario's during leveling. Not sure how they will work, when most ppl are already lvl 100, but then again I am not paid to solve these issues

[ComputerNerd]

Dont get it how or where ppl play, but you can, and not you specific, but everyone who says the same, a) ask in guild "Hey need help with grp quest", if ppl are ignoring you or refuse to help, should consider another guild b) ask a friend from friend list to help you or port you to another server so you check if anyone there i doing it.

Tbh think most of these, no because my server is empty, come from ppl getting used to being lazy and just press lfr/lfd button, then actually a lack of ppl to do something. Asking around in guild/general chat, doing /who "zone" and trowing a few whispers etc. can do wonders.

I tried that in twilight highlands on a "medium" population realm.
2 hours later and still nothing.

It is all very well people endlessly repeating that, but unless there is the population actively levelling then it doesn't work.

[KrazyK923]

No, instances, scenarios, raids, pvp, ect should be the required group quests.

If anything, open world raid bosses should be the extent of it in the "world."

By the way, its not like group quests ever added anything to the game. I know leveling my characters in Vanilla Redridge, it most certainly wasn't a super pain in the ass to do the elite group quest to kill that Gnoll. It definitely wasn't an exercise in just sitting in town, spamming /1 for groups.

Nope. It was super fun and engaging!

/sarcasm

[hablix]

The big problem with group quests in the past were inadequate (read: non-existent) group finding tools in the game. The only option for finding groups was to spam Trade (or LookingForGroup, when that was a thing) for hours, usually unsuccessfully, or begging guildies for help. A crossrealm group finding tool such as the one planned for WoD, if it is done right, could be the magic bullet for making group quests viable.

There is a case study to examine here: oQueue and Open Raid make a world of difference for A Change of Command, the group portion of the Legendary quest. The first time I did this quest, before I got into oQ/OR, it took actually a couple weeks before I finally got a group together, and that involved a lot of spamming trade, begging guildies, planning for Day X Time Y and cancelling because of no-shows, and on and on. Doing it with alts, after having discovered oQueue, getting a group took 10 minutes tops with no special effort.

- - - Updated - - -

No, instances, scenarios, raids, pvp, ect should be the required group quests.

If anything, open world raid bosses should be the extent of it in the "world."

By the way, its not like group quests ever added anything to the game. I know leveling my characters in Vanilla Redridge, it most certainly wasn't a super pain in the ass to do the elite group quest to kill that Gnoll. It definitely wasn't an exercise in just sitting in town, spamming /1 for groups.

Nope. It was super fun and engaging!

/sarcasm

Those Redridge Elite quests are where I learned that rolling "Need" on cloth as a warrior because I didn't want to be "Greedy" is doing it wrong. One of my earliest memories of WoW. I remember wiping on the named there and then a level 27 joining our group and me being in awe at how powerful he was and how awesome it was to have a level 27 in the group. Anyway, the point being group quests have their time and place, and they could again if players had adequate ways to find groups for them.

Oh, and that group quest in Wetlands... that's where my warrior first heard of the concept of tanking. I was asked to tank the elite, to which I responded: "what's tanking?" The priest ended up tanking it. I spent hours on Alakhazam after that trying to learn about my class and about tanking.

I also had a very fun time and fond memories of doing the BC group quests with a group of some of the server's first 70's. Your mileage may vary.

OH yeah, then there's Wrath. I leveled nearly a dozen 80s when Wrath was current and I usually got groups for those elite quests in Dragonblight, and the few others sprinkled throughout other zones - Grizzly Hills, Zul'drak. When I did, it was a nice bonus and a good experience. When I didn't, no big deal. I think the key is to go with the Dragonblight model, where elite/group quests are sidequests and bonuses, not the capstone to the entire zone. You want to be able to look for groups and have opportunities to form groups while you're working through a zone, not when you are completely done with the zone save for 2 or 3 capstone elite quests.

[Barnabas]

I don't mind group quests as long as they aren't required to get the next set of quests.

[Deleted]

I think poll options are a bit weird and make no sense, when the question is ''are you with or against'' and the answers are ''yes/no'' O.o
Personally am against, dead server, no people for group quests

yeah this^^

I am for group questing to answer your question

[KrazyK923]

Those Redridge Elite quests are where I learned that rolling "Need" on cloth as a warrior because I didn't want to be "Greedy" is doing it wrong. One of my earliest memories of WoW. I remember wiping on the named there and then a level 27 joining our group and me being in awe at how powerful he was and how awesome it was to have a level 27 in the group. Anyway, the point being group quests have their time and place, and they could again if players had adequate ways to find groups for them.

Oh, and that group quest in Wetlands... that's where my warrior first heard of the concept of tanking. I was asked to tank the elite, to which I responded: "what's tanking?" The priest ended up tanking it. I spent hours on Alakhazam after that trying to learn about my class and about tanking.

I also had a very fun time and fond memories of doing the BC group quests with a group of some of the server's first 70's. Your mileage may vary.

OH yeah, then there's Wrath. I leveled nearly a dozen 80s when Wrath was current and I usually got groups for those elite quests in Dragonblight, and the few others sprinkled throughout other zones - Grizzly Hills, Zul'drak. When I did, it was a nice bonus and a good experience. When I didn't, no big deal. I think the key is to go with the Dragonblight model, where elite/group quests are sidequests and bonuses, not the capstone to the entire zone. You want to be able to look for groups and have opportunities to form groups while you're working through a zone, not when you are completely done with the zone save for 2 or 3 capstone elite quests.

I think the false assumption here is that the elite quests were what caused you to...learn to play? I'm not sure what they can't do with regular quests that they can with elite quests. Elite quests do nothing but force people together to do a piece of content that isn't end-level. It might sound nice when it first comes out, but I remember trying to level alts during Wrath where finding people to do things in Vanilla was a nightmare. Hell, it was a nightmare during Vanilla itself.

The very fact that you had to get a level 27 for that Redridge quest to beat it shows the failure of group quests. Why even have them if you just end up having a friend or a random high level, which the mob is grey to, to come in and kill it?

You want to be able to look for groups and have opportunities to form groups while you're working through a zone, not when you are completely done with the zone save for 2 or 3 capstone elite quests.

No. No you really don't. You've failed as a developer when you have people sitting there doing nothing and spamming your chat channel for help with a quest that you cannot solo. I am entirely out the game experience at that point. Doing absolutely nothing but waiting for somebody else to get to that point as they quest to help. You can say "You want to be able to look for groups throughout the zone," but a lot of those quests weren't even available until you've completed the majority of that hub. Dragonblight, I would say, is an exception to the rule, but only with a few elite quests.

Its the same argument for the removal of LFD. What it does is cause people to stop actually playing the game and sit there hoping somebody else will come along and join with them. At that point I am not playing WoW. I'm copy/pasting a "LF" message every minute or so while I watch Youtube hoping someone else comes along.

That isn't to say I personally don't have stories where it worked out either, but you don't want to develop a system where its optimal if things happen to fall the right way for people. You want to develop a system where even if things go the exact opposite way that you want where people can still relatively play uninterrupted.

And before the inevitable charge is thrown at me, let me finish by saying I only feel this way about questing in the world. Dungeons, Scenarios, and Raids were always billed as group-content from the very alpha of the original game. Group Quests sound like a good idea in premise, but it fails far more in practice than it succeeds for it to be worth it. Even in other games. My biggest gripe in SWTOR (Before they ruined the game with their f2p system) was the reintroduction of group/elite quests.

[Lime]

Group quests were never mandatory. No idea where this idea crawled from.

It is mandatory for completing the quest chain. It is not mandatory for questing overall. He wasn't specific so it depends on what context you give the question.

[Wilian]

It is mandatory for completing the quest chain. It is not mandatory for questing overall. He wasn't specific so it depends on what context you give the question.

When he says mandatory and gives no context then I'll deal with it at face value. And even if he says "mandatory to finish quest line", I'll deal on a level of "mandatory to progress in game". Besides, that point is easily solved by having solo quest lines separate from quest lines that would be entirely group centric.

[Darkinfinity]

When he says mandatory and gives no context then I'll deal with it at face value. And even if he says "mandatory to finish quest line", I'll deal on a level of "mandatory to progress in game". Besides, that point is easily solved by having solo quest lines separate from quest lines that would be entirely group centric.

Seems you are willing to defend your opinion to death...
Sure I'll admit, it wasn't mandatory. Even questing isn't mandatory. Why not grind all the way to max lvl, because questing isn't mandatory?! So if questing isn't mandatory, group quests were also never mandatory. Yeah, you were right I guess...


But....if you wanted to achieve a certain goal like: get that last tank piece or if wanted to enter a dungeon/raid (attunement quest for example), you had to do some quests. And some of these quests were group quests. So if you wanted to achieve your goal, the group quest was mandatory.

[Arenis]

I certainly hope they reïntroduce them.
And that they also make an offline version of WoW, so that all those loners can go there and stop destroying the MMO feel.

[Wilian]

Seems you are willing to defend your opinion to death...
Sure I'll admit, it wasn't mandatory. Even questing isn't mandatory. Why not grind all the way to max lvl, because questing isn't mandatory?! So if questing isn't mandatory, group quests were also never mandatory. Yeah, you were right I guess...

That's just stupid extreme-stand to take. All I ever said that group quests weren't mandatory to progress in the game during leveling and it's absolutely correct, no one can dispute that. Your whole retarded comment of"Well if group quests mandatory well then quests aren't mandatory and you could farm XP!!" while true, is not relevant to the discussion of group quests AND reeks of the typical political talk of "lets swing the pendulum so far to a certain direction that the former moderate position seems like the opposite now"

[Darkinfinity]

That's just stupid extreme-stand to take. All I ever said that group quests weren't mandatory to progress in the game during leveling and it's absolutely correct, no one can dispute that. Your whole retarded comment of"Well if group quests mandatory well then quests aren't mandatory and you could farm XP!!" while true, is not relevant to the discussion of group quests AND reeks of the typical political talk of "lets swing the pendulum so far to a certain direction that the former moderate position seems like the opposite now"

1. Know when you encounter sarcasm.
2. Please quote a whole post or things might seem out of context.

[The Flavour Cat]

Please bring them back, especially to the early levels (mainly 1-60). Group quests introduce the newbie to co-operation and interaction with other players that they will eventually learn when they hop into their first dungeon/raid. I like that idea that the rares of the Isle of Thunder and Warbringers employ-the more people attacking them, the health will increase, so it poses that challegne that the game lacks in places because part of it was removed for the Cataclysm re-vamp.

[derpkitteh]

i wouldn't mind some group quests. but if they'd do it, i'd want them to make it so you're not punished for grouping. no reduced xp, all quest items shared, stuff like that.

[Wilian]

1. Know when you encounter sarcasm.
2. Please quote a whole post or things might seem out of context.

You should probably train on your sarcasm.

I left the latter part out because the discussion so far has obviously been about leveling experience, not end game. In any case, what attunements were out-door group quests? Was there ever any, because I only remember instance quests.

[Hottage]

Group quests never left, they just got put inside instances and made repeatable... and renamed to "scenarios". They even made the group quests available with heroic mode!

[Wilian]

Group quests never left, they just got put inside instances and made repeatable... and renamed to "scenarios". They even made the group quests available with heroic mode!

The problem with those is that they were soloable from the get-go and when they added heroic scenarios they added ilevel requirement that made the next step soloable too.

It was nice idea but execution was fucked up.