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  1. #21
    Stop keyboard turning. You need to move with your mouse. Anyone that says otherwise is wrong.

    ZERO BUTTONS SHOULD EVER BE CLICKED EVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE. USE YOUR KEYBINDS.

  2. #22
    Ugh, I doubt the 'op' keyboard turns/clicks from rare mention of the tabooed word click. I have most of the abilities keybound but the rare ones, that i will rarely use are not keybound and I click them, eg dismantle, i dont pvp, but i have it on bars in case i need it, last time i used in raid was to disarm assasins on heroic nazgrim. I dont feel the need to was my keybind on a ability that I would rarely use.

    On topic - Practice, practice on dummies till your rotation is hardwired into your muscle memory so you never have to even think about what button to hit. For cd's and debuff uptime use weak auras.
    Another thing I suggest is, hide recount/skada in combat, it serves no purpose being up in combat, it should not be taking up screen real estate or fraction of your attention from fight.
    Playing subtlety is like ballroom dancing, just that there is an ugly monster between you and your partner (tank).
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...traws/advanced

  3. #23
    Im exactly the same as you OP. Cant get my license because of the tunnel vision and loss of focus i get. However for WoW the only thing that makes me tunnel is melee classes. For this reason i cant play tank or melee and it really frustrates me. And telling someone to not force yourself into tunneling clearly has no idea what is going on. There are tunnelers that dont care (bads/lazy) and there are tunnelers that cant help it like me and OP. I was a clicker and now a keybinder. Tunneling still remains, even with a neat UI.

    No matter how much i try to focus on something it never works out, i eventually fade out and my my mind is gone. This is not a l2play or keybind problem, this is a problem with the mind. Can it be fixed? I really don't know. I been like this my whole life and i guess its never going to change
    Last edited by pkm; 2013-12-02 at 11:09 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Validity View Post
    If rogues become shit, all they can become is a different type of shit.

  4. #24
    We'll for me its more that I look on my bars (EG short CD's or just making sure I hit right things), even if I know the binds. I notice I tunnel vision quit often.

    So remove the bars (bartender addon obviously!) would be helpfull. Trough I can't get myself to it - UI just feels wrong^^
    One reason for WoW decline I often hear is that its an old game and naturally people get bored with it. But TV is much older and people still watch that. Surely if a thing you once enjoyed keept staying fun, you would still use it?

  5. #25
    Scarab Lord nightfalls's Avatar
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    Regarding tunnel-vision for average players:

    As others discussed UI placement is pretty important but don't use it as a crutch same goes for DBM/boss mods. Also, one thing I noticed that helps is many, if not most, raid boss fights are more or less "telegraphed" now where you pretty much know when some event will happen. Learn that.

    ---

    That said, if it's that bad that you can't even drive a car and get your license, perhaps you need to be looking at having your brain checked... seriously no joke/sarcasm.

  6. #26
    High Overlord
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    In my own experience I don't think wow is the best way of practising how to deal with tunnel vision. League of Legends cured me after hours and hours of practise. (It still happens some times).

    I don't think there is a cure to tunnel vision but I do think you can train yourself to become better at almost anything. So if you have a problem were you just zone out of everything sometimes I'll share what I did in order to stop this from happening to often.

    First thing is to realise whats going on, you did that. Good! Most people don't even know what the issue is and don't think to improve at all.

    Second is to force yourself to focus on something else also. Don't try everything at the same time. Use key binds, use key binds so much that you don't need to look on your screen or keyboard. There is something called muscle memory wich is basically if you click a button an X amount of times your body/brain have learned how to click the button even on autopilot. If you are still thinking that your pushing a specific button all the time then you need to continue doing it until its not apart of your focus anymore.
    That takes time believe me.

    But when you have mastered your key binds and your almost perfectly doing your rotation without looking at your action bars or keyboard.. Then we have eliminated one thing that gets your attention allowing your brain to focus on something else entirely.
    You should then use Deadly Boss Mods or Big Wigs were you place the timers and warnings were you want them to be. Not in the middle of the screen necessarily.
    Then you focus more on your character, your character is always (almost always) in the centre of the screen. If you make sure you have vision directly below, to the left/right and above your character. With add-ons they play sounds/makes screen flash blue/red which is really helpful. If the add-on tells you to get away there is either a big ability coming up which demands you to move away or you die, or your standing in shit you shouldn't be standing in.

    There is no way to be perfect at everything. But you cannot master everything at once either. Make a plan for what you want to become better at and execute the plan as mentioned. I just threw out some examples, but in general the best way to deal with a big problem like this is for you I would then eliminate as much as possible in order to see things maybe from a different picture.

    I can tell you a little bit about how League of Legends (LoL) changed my attention and reaction times. League of Legends is a very fast paced game, 2 seconds is literally a long time in that game. And in order to have good mechanics in the game you need to have a good reaction time. The map has 10 players in total were there is 5 players on each time, this might not sound like a huge deal to you considering raids have 25 players. But imagine if all 25 players had to execute their abilities perfectly and it had to be timed perfectly without getting tunnel vision once. That just seem impossible to me. Thats why mmo games are a bit different then moba games.
    But remember to take breaks, your brain can only handle some time of pressure until you are unable to focus. So until you build up the stamina you need breaks. 10 minute breaks are really good to disconnect, have a meal, drink or a cigarette if your a smoker.

    Anything that calms your head down

    I really hope this helps and I can assure you that this is something we all are going through several times a week.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by cetraben View Post
    Add a new keybind every few days, until i've got all the core abilities sorted, and then add new situational ones (interupts, dispels etc). Takes a while, and running LFR a lot helps with this also.
    You're better off changing a lot at the same time than gradually. You'll likely find you can refine the keybindings later on in such a way that they're better (more ergonomic, more consistent or logical, easier to follow up, same as alts have it, etc). This moves the "changing one core ability at a time" to the future (@ the refining stage) while still allowing a big, one time learning curve where all is new.

    As for tunnel vision get rid of everything which doesn't matter for you. Weakauras replacing actionbars and such is one. Disabling all kind of addons which aren't needed or distract is another (you don't really need MSBT near the middle of your screen). Refine your UI. Configure your bloody addons. Tell your bossmod to shut up about stuff you don't care about, but be vocal about stuff you do care about. More often than not, less is more.
    Last edited by lolalola; 2013-12-02 at 11:36 AM.
    "When i am done with you, you won't trust your own mind."

  8. #28
    A few pointers on getting rid of Tunnel Vision

    Awareness
    The first thing you need is to be aware of your surroundings. What is your role? Who is next to you? What to DPS? What to Avoid? etc.
    Take a look at your party/group. Even if it is random BG/PUG, look up the group comp.

    Your role is important. It seems that tunnel vision is a very common problem for DPSers. Healers can have that issue too (if they keep staring at raid UIs).

    To make this easier, clean up your UI. Remove clutter caused by Addons, unit frames, combat text etc. If you like some features in the UI or any addon, keep those up. Also, keep you camera distance maxed out. sometimes, rotate you camera angle to the top so you can see the area easily.. Enemy nameplates are a good solution for targeting , especially when adds or lots of enemy players are near you.

    Gameplay
    Keybinding (and mouse turning) helps; you can react to situations faster as well as increase your overall activity by pressing more abilities.

    Mindset
    IMO, this is probably the most important step for getting rid of the tunnel vision habit.

    Don't stress yourself. Play the game to have some fun.

    Look at your spell book and see what tools you have other than DPS. What Snares do you have? CC? Stuns? etc. Then once you have figured these out, use these whie questing / doing your dailies. Ad these to you bars, and keybinds.

    Instead of wanting to zerg everything mindlessly, think out of the box a little. What other things can you do to help your group? Volunteer to do some bitch duty even if it means losing some dps. In PvP, be more inventive by using CC or try to focus o BG objectives.

    Ask around for tips

    This always helps. get feedback from others on what needs to be done after a wipe or losing a 2v2 game. You will be surprised at what you can learn from others correcting your mistakes.

  9. #29
    I forgot to mention don't be complacent. Care. Target to improve. If it is a very hard fight and you control a certain part but fail on another try to put focus on the other. This is often where people fail at the first and this can be frustrating but sometimes a fight is so difficult; its a learning curve with baby steps.
    "When i am done with you, you won't trust your own mind."

  10. #30
    I get tunnel vision playing heals simply because I have to continuously pay attention to 25 bars on my screen. It is circumvented a bit by the Grid addon but still, health drops so quickly in so many places on those grid bars that looking away could spell doom for someone taking continuous damage. I try to keep the stuff I want to look at in the corners of my screen so I dart between them and catch the middle as I go by or in the periphery.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Adp View Post
    I get tunnel vision playing heals simply because I have to continuously pay attention to 25 bars on my screen. It is circumvented a bit by the Grid addon but still, health drops so quickly in so many places on those grid bars that looking away could spell doom for someone taking continuous damage. I try to keep the stuff I want to look at in the corners of my screen so I dart between them and catch the middle as I go by or in the periphery.
    I find that weird. I'm the exact opposite. I tend to tunnel vision while playing melee. Ranged and healing, I find myself in shear boredom and noticing every mistake. Tanking, it depends since you practically do nothing and of course, there is always atleast a 20 foot boss in front of you. Always felt the same way playing sports as well.

  12. #32
    If you want an addOn, maybe try Forte, i don't particularly like it, maybe you may like

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by ttak82 View Post
    A few pointers on getting rid of Tunnel Vision

    Awareness
    The first thing you need is to be aware of your surroundings. What is your role? Who is next to you? What to DPS? What to Avoid? etc.
    Take a look at your party/group. Even if it is random BG/PUG, look up the group comp.

    Your role is important. It seems that tunnel vision is a very common problem for DPSers. Healers can have that issue too (if they keep staring at raid UIs).

    To make this easier, clean up your UI. Remove clutter caused by Addons, unit frames, combat text etc. If you like some features in the UI or any addon, keep those up. Also, keep you camera distance maxed out. sometimes, rotate you camera angle to the top so you can see the area easily.. Enemy nameplates are a good solution for targeting , especially when adds or lots of enemy players are near you.

    Gameplay
    Keybinding (and mouse turning) helps; you can react to situations faster as well as increase your overall activity by pressing more abilities.

    Mindset
    IMO, this is probably the most important step for getting rid of the tunnel vision habit.

    Don't stress yourself. Play the game to have some fun.

    Look at your spell book and see what tools you have other than DPS. What Snares do you have? CC? Stuns? etc. Then once you have figured these out, use these whie questing / doing your dailies. Ad these to you bars, and keybinds.

    Instead of wanting to zerg everything mindlessly, think out of the box a little. What other things can you do to help your group? Volunteer to do some bitch duty even if it means losing some dps. In PvP, be more inventive by using CC or try to focus o BG objectives.

    Ask around for tips

    This always helps. get feedback from others on what needs to be done after a wipe or losing a 2v2 game. You will be surprised at what you can learn from others correcting your mistakes.
    This response is awesome. Many traders will say the same thing about trading.

  14. #34
    Pretty good advices so far in this thread.

    Besides what's been written and from personal experience I noticed that several events helped me be a better player which, amongst others, also reduced my tunnel vision tendencies.

    Being a pve hero, stepping into arenas ( to a lower extent bg's ) really improved my personal positioning in relation to both the terrain and dynamic entities ( teammates and enemies alike ).
    Apart from that, the mindset of wanting to become better & improve should extend to all other games/activities and you will up your standard to limits you couldn't fathom of reaching beforehand. What I mean by this is playing other games on the highest difficulty possible as much as possible ( bar "artificial" difficulties ) and give it a try with an RTS - coming back after macroing for long hours to a game as "simplistic" as wow felt quite relaxing ... even in a heroic/raid leading setting.
    My Twitch channel streaming Heroic content from Mage PoV. Armory. -Currently- retired. Dotabuff.

  15. #35
    Hi, OP. I can solve your problem. Hide your action bars.

    Ok, here's the long version:

    Someone made an UI once without any action bars, explaining their reasoning in a video. I was curious about an interface without any main action bar displayed, just some sidebars for out of combat stuff. The explanation goes something like this:

    You have your keybinds set, everything important is done via keyboard. What exactly is the reason you're still looking at the action bars? The answer is as simple as it sounds stupid: To check your cooldowns.

    There are addons for that, you could write WeakAuras for them. There's a ton more efficient ways to check the cooldown of your abilities. Once you've done them (a clunky example would be a cooldown bar addon), you hide the action bars and after a couple of horrible trys, you learn to a) trust your fingers to know where each spell is on their own, b) realise that now you're bored, not having something to look at and by magic you'll notice things that you haven't noticed before, c) ideally, you'll start to learn to play your character properly.

    Anticipating cooldowns by timings, getting a "feel" for when your short 6s cooldowns are ready again and just confirming that with an addon and if you put the extra 5 mins into it, you may even want to strategise the fight for your class, evaluating when you want to use which 3m cooldown (do you have a burst phase somewhere? use it then, not when it's off cooldown!).

    All those things improve you as a player and make you more independent.

    Edit: Meh, I can't leave this post I keep adding stuff... so here's my personal story, I'm not a super duper Top 20 raider, but I can tell you this, I'm a DK and I only need to glance at my runes/runic power to evaluate the "situation" that I am in and thus use the spells accordingly. I don't "watch" my bars or my resources, I check my current "resource status" every 2s or so, because once I've done that, I can easily predict which 2-4 or 5 spells I'm gonna cast next. That is where you want to be at. Have your class in your system so that you have 80% mind time for the boss mechanics and your raid and 20% mind time invested in your actual character, because most of that should really be done on autopilot. Classes are not hard to play these days.
    Last edited by Slant; 2013-12-02 at 12:08 PM.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Slant View Post
    Hi, OP. I can solve your problem. Hide your action bars.

    Ok, here's the long version:

    Someone made an UI once without any action bars, explaining their reasoning in a video. I was curious about an interface without any main action bar displayed, just some sidebars for out of combat stuff. The explanation goes something like this:

    You have your keybinds set, everything important is done via keyboard. What exactly is the reason you're still looking at the action bars? The answer is as simple as it sounds stupid: To check your cooldowns.

    There are addons for that, you could write WeakAuras for them. There's a ton more efficient ways to check the cooldown of your abilities. Once you've done them (a clunky example would be a cooldown bar addon), you hide the action bars and after a couple of horrible trys, you learn to a) trust your fingers to know where each spell is on their own, b) realise that now you're bored, not having something to look at and by magic you'll notice things that you haven't noticed before, c) ideally, you'll start to learn to play your character properly.

    Anticipating cooldowns by timings, getting a "feel" for when your short 6s cooldowns are ready again and just confirming that with an addon and if you put the extra 5 mins into it, you may even want to strategise the fight for your class, evaluating when you want to use which 3m cooldown (do you have a burst phase somewhere? use it then, not when it's off cooldown!).

    All those things improve you as a player and make you more independent.

    Edit: Meh, I can't leave this post I keep adding stuff... so here's my personal story, I'm not a super duper Top 20 raider, but I can tell you this, I'm a DK and I only need to glance at my runes/runic power to evaluate the "situation" that I am in and thus use the spells accordingly. I don't "watch" my bars or my resources, I check my current "resource status" every 2s or so, because once I've done that, I can easily predict which 2-4 or 5 spells I'm gonna cast next. That is where you want to be at. Have your class in your system so that you have 80% mind time for the boss mechanics and your raid and 20% mind time invested in your actual character, because most of that should really be done on autopilot. Classes are not hard to play these days.
    Don't fully agree. It can help, but not necessarily and there are alternatives. There are addons which put the CD remaining on the actionbar, or lighten it up during proc. If you hide useless keybinds (like say Slow Fall) and you use say a Naga and combine CDs near same spot the actionbar becomes very much akin to a Weakaura. It is at this point the difference is so minor its a matter of preference. To achieve this though requires a lot of configuration as well as different addons.
    "When i am done with you, you won't trust your own mind."

  17. #37
    Get an add on that allows you to set your hotbars to "mouseover" and don't display ANY buttons you use in your main rotation/priority. Use tell me when or weak auras to display important abilities with cooldowns or charges. Keybind everything that can ever be required on the move. This will get you to learn your rotations/priority to muscle memory and focus more on your environment.

    I only have two 7 buttons hotbars on my screen and most of these are abilities that I swap in an out on a fight by fight basis (and a couple I allow myself to click) and it really has helped me focus on the raid and not my rotation.

    I see slant also said the same thing. Good to see I'm not alone!

  18. #38
    Legendary! Blueobelisk's Avatar
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    Close recount. Tunnel vision will be defeated.

    Looking for graphic artists and one sound composer. PM me for details. (No pressure. Despite what the above post is like, I'm actually a nice guy.)

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by straws View Post
    Ugh, I doubt the 'op' keyboard turns/clicks from rare mention of the tabooed word click. I have most of the abilities keybound but the rare ones, that i will rarely use are not keybound and I click them, eg dismantle, i dont pvp, but i have it on bars in case i need it, last time i used in raid was to disarm assasins on heroic nazgrim. I dont feel the need to was my keybind on a ability that I would rarely use.

    On topic - Practice, practice on dummies till your rotation is hardwired into your muscle memory so you never have to even think about what button to hit. For cd's and debuff uptime use weak auras.
    Another thing I suggest is, hide recount/skada in combat, it serves no purpose being up in combat, it should not be taking up screen real estate or fraction of your attention from fight.
    This sort of misunderstanding about learning is the problem. When you practice you need to learn about the movements and the environment in which you make them. You need to practice contextually, ie practice in a similar environment to the one you will play in. Practicing your rotation on target dummies helps with the movements, but not with the environment. You need to learn how to switch your attention around the screen, how to filter and process the right information, and how to respond correctly to various stimuli. Say you practice 3 point shooting in basketball on an empty court. When you go into a real game situation with teammates and opponents you will do poorly, because you only learned the shooting skill in isolation, not in context with other people. The same thing is true in wow, you need to learn in a similar environment. Practice in LFR, proving grounds, pvp, not just on dummies - try to get close to a raiding environment.

    I hate the phrase muscle memory, because muscles don't have memories, the phrase focuses on the production of the movement not the planning, the brain is much more important than the muscles, and people use it as a buzzword when they don't understand learning.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Feezee View Post
    This sort of misunderstanding about learning is the problem. When you practice you need to learn about the movements and the environment in which you make them. You need to practice contextually, ie practice in a similar environment to the one you will play in. Practicing your rotation on target dummies helps with the movements, but not with the environment. You need to learn how to switch your attention around the screen, how to filter and process the right information, and how to respond correctly to various stimuli. Say you practice 3 point shooting in basketball on an empty court. When you go into a real game situation with teammates and opponents you will do poorly, because you only learned the shooting skill in isolation, not in context with other people. The same thing is true in wow, you need to learn in a similar environment. Practice in LFR, proving grounds, pvp, not just on dummies - try to get close to a raiding environment.

    I hate the phrase muscle memory, because muscles don't have memories, the phrase focuses on the production of the movement not the planning, the brain is much more important than the muscles, and people use it as a buzzword when they don't understand learning.
    But it IS muscle memory. It's performing a physical task on autopilot and is a fair way to explain the concept.

    From wikipedia

    "Muscle memory has been used synonymously with motor learning, which is a form of procedural memory that involves consolidating a specific motor task into memory through repetition. When a movement is repeated over time, a long-term muscle memory is created for that task, eventually allowing it to be performed without conscious effort. This process decreases the need for attention and creates maximum efficiency within the motor and memory systems"

    Also pro basket ball players will still spend hours practicing 3 pointers, pro footballers (soccer) will practise penalty kicks for hours. And by the same standard practicing your rotation on a dummy WILL help your game play as long as it's supplemented with OTHER forms of practice and routine. Of course the best practice is to raid but OP DOES raid so there's nothing wrong with him supplementing that with some time at the dummies.
    Last edited by ItcheeBeard; 2013-12-02 at 03:40 PM.

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