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  1. #41
    Old God Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orbitus View Post
    I would trust his data over your no data post.
    You're right, it's just a feeling I have from how present Horde fans are especially at Blizzcon and from polls like that http://www.mmo-champion.com/poll.php...do=showresults. My feeling is 66% Horde 34% Alliance.

    Also the data doesn't take into account how many people exclusively play Alliance or Horde or play both.

    edit: most poll results seem to be at Alliance 45% Horde 55%

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/poll.php...do=showresults
    http://www.mmo-champion.com/poll.php...do=showresults
    And this one 60% Horde 40% Alliance
    http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...iance-VS-Horde

    but there is one poll that takes into account that some players play both factions, there it's 45% exclusively Horde, 32% exclusively Alliance
    http://www.mmo-champion.com/poll.php...do=showresults

    and this one has 50% Horde 30% Alliance with 20% playing both
    http://www.mmo-champion.com/poll.php...do=showresults
    Last edited by Nindoriel; 2013-12-05 at 02:23 AM.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Orbitus View Post
    I would trust his data over your no data post.
    I will now make a post stating the opposite... trust me? Doubt it... since it doesn't go with your opinion.
    When you call yourself an Indian or a Muslim or a Christian or a European, or anything else, you are being violent. Do you see why it is violent? Because you are separating yourself from the rest of mankind. When you separate yourself by belief, by nationality, by tradition, it breeds violence. So a man who is seeking to understand violence does not belong to any country, to any religion, to any political party or partial system; he is concerned with the total understanding of mankind.

  3. #43
    My data is realmpop which pulls directly from the wowarmory.

    Really hard to mess that up.
    It's about watching a company gleefully flinging away its goodwill with both hands and engaging in a pissing contest with its customers. It's about coyness, and a lack of straightforwardness. It's about rude, flip responses to valid questions, using third-party media instead of an official site. It's about a loss of trust, and the perception of untruthfulness. It's about an attitude that has begun to border on complacency and deceitfulness. -Roycroft the Human Rogue (Paraphrased)

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Potassiumgluconate View Post
    My data is realmpop which pulls directly from the wowarmory.

    Really hard to mess that up.
    Well, the thing is is that it counts characters even if people don't play them anymore. For example, it probably counts my blood elf priest I haven't played since the start of Cata.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrt View Post
    Well, the thing is is that it counts characters even if people don't play them anymore. For example, it probably counts my blood elf priest I haven't played since the start of Cata.
    Not hard to test that. I just used realmpop to filter out any characters below 88.

    We end up with a ratio of 48% Horde to 52% Alliance Overall.

    Top Horde Race:
    Blood Elves again, at a perfect %30
    Alliance, humans at %33 and Night Elves at %20
    It's about watching a company gleefully flinging away its goodwill with both hands and engaging in a pissing contest with its customers. It's about coyness, and a lack of straightforwardness. It's about rude, flip responses to valid questions, using third-party media instead of an official site. It's about a loss of trust, and the perception of untruthfulness. It's about an attitude that has begun to border on complacency and deceitfulness. -Roycroft the Human Rogue (Paraphrased)

  6. #46
    Old God Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Potassiumgluconate View Post
    My data is realmpop which pulls directly from the wowarmory.

    Really hard to mess that up.
    Really hard to take that data seriously. Someone can have Alliance characters, yet almost exclusively play Horde and see himself as a Horde player. Best example is a friend of mine. He's Horde, finds Alliance completely boring. Whenever you ask him what faction he is he would say Horde. Yet he has some Alliance characters, some even around level 70, because he just felt like rolling a human or a worgen, to see the starting zone or to see if there is anything interesting about the Alliance story.

    The amount of Alliance characters also doesn't tell you how many Alliance players there are. Maybe one faction has more players that like to play alts. PvE servers for example generally have higher Alliance populations while PvP server have higher Horde populations.
    Last edited by Nindoriel; 2013-12-05 at 02:14 AM.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    Really hard to take that data seriously. Someone can have Alliance characters, yet almost exclusively play Horde and see himself as a Horde player. Best example is a friend of mine. He's Horde, finds Alliance completely boring. Whenever you ask him what faction he is he would say Horde. Yet he has some Alliance characters, some even around level 70, because he just felt like rolling a human or a worgen, to see the starting zone or to see if there is anything interesting about the Alliance story.

    The amount of Alliance characters also doesn't tell you how many Alliance players there are. Maybe one faction has more players that like to play alts. PvE servers for example generally have higher Alliance populations while PvP server have higher Horde populations.
    Someone beat you to that point already. Refined the search on the database to players level 88 and up and came back with effectively the same data.
    It's about watching a company gleefully flinging away its goodwill with both hands and engaging in a pissing contest with its customers. It's about coyness, and a lack of straightforwardness. It's about rude, flip responses to valid questions, using third-party media instead of an official site. It's about a loss of trust, and the perception of untruthfulness. It's about an attitude that has begun to border on complacency and deceitfulness. -Roycroft the Human Rogue (Paraphrased)

  8. #48
    Old God Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Potassiumgluconate View Post
    Someone beat you to that point already. Refined the search on the database to players level 88 and up and came back with effectively the same data.
    And? I wasn't talking about low level characters.

  9. #49
    I am Murloc! prwraith's Avatar
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    Now if you can put forth a good argument for why there's 2 factions aside from "this is how its always been" you'll have my attention.

    Because there sure as hell isn't a lore reason for it anymore. They good and well wrote themselves out of a reason for conflict.

  10. #50
    [QUOTE=Potassiumgluconate;24076407]No. What was said is that it's something they do take into consideration but realm types trump faction balance because they can't combine pvp and pve servers.

    Yes, I see they jumped at connecting Mal'Ganis and Kel'thezad, 2 or the the most imbalanced servers in the US for opposite fractions and both are PVP. They are connecting based on pop levels overall, not balance.

    Slip

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by prwraith View Post
    Now if you can put forth a good argument for why there's 2 factions aside from "this is how its always been" you'll have my attention.

    Because there sure as hell isn't a lore reason for it anymore. They good and well wrote themselves out of a reason for conflict.
    Its more interesting. If you want to play with your alliance friends just transfer, or reroll. You can't put forth a good argument as to why things could change, I bet.
    When you call yourself an Indian or a Muslim or a Christian or a European, or anything else, you are being violent. Do you see why it is violent? Because you are separating yourself from the rest of mankind. When you separate yourself by belief, by nationality, by tradition, it breeds violence. So a man who is seeking to understand violence does not belong to any country, to any religion, to any political party or partial system; he is concerned with the total understanding of mankind.

  12. #52
    I don't want to play as an Ugly Drooling Monster.

    So that eliminates all the horde races except Blood Elves and Pandas, I hate pandas.

    I think a huge portion of the player base feels the same way. The horde for the most part is gross, and that is unappealing to a lot of people.
    Every man is born as many men and dies as a single one

    -Martin Heidegger

  13. #53
    Old God Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HammondQ View Post
    I don't want to play as an Ugly Drooling Monster.

    So that eliminates all the horde races except Blood Elves and Pandas, I hate pandas.

    I think a huge portion of the player base feels the same way. The horde for the most part is gross, and that is unappealing to a lot of people.
    To some maybe. To many not. And I don't see what's so gross about any of the races, except the Forsaken.

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by prwraith View Post
    Now if you can put forth a good argument for why there's 2 factions aside from "this is how its always been" you'll have my attention.

    Because there sure as hell isn't a lore reason for it anymore. They good and well wrote themselves out of a reason for conflict.
    Hey, you have my vote. 3-faction PVP games are a lot more fun imo.
    It's about watching a company gleefully flinging away its goodwill with both hands and engaging in a pissing contest with its customers. It's about coyness, and a lack of straightforwardness. It's about rude, flip responses to valid questions, using third-party media instead of an official site. It's about a loss of trust, and the perception of untruthfulness. It's about an attitude that has begun to border on complacency and deceitfulness. -Roycroft the Human Rogue (Paraphrased)

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Potassiumgluconate View Post
    Horde Race Balance:
    25-30% Blood Elf
    ~15% Tauren
    ~14-17% Undead
    ~14% Orc
    ~12% Troll
    ~9% Goblin
    ~6.5% Pandaren
    Let me put it this way: what ratio of Blood elves do you think would faction change? 1 in 2? 1 in 3? 1 in 5? 1 in 10?

    Alliance Race Balance:
    ~30% Human
    ~19% Night Elf

    ~13% Worgen
    ~13% Draenei
    ~8.5% Gnome
    ~8% Dwarf
    ~6.5% Pandaren
    Why aren't you considering that a lot of people that want to play as High elves are Alliance already and would probably either make an alt or race change his Alliance character?

    The top two played races are humans and blood elves. Blood elves have a neutral faction that works with the alliance, thus making them a possible candidate for the Alliance. There is no faction equivalent for the humans.
    But blood elves being still available in the Horde would mean people who like the Horde but want a pretty race will still remain Horde.
    Also, are humans popular because they are humans, or because of their racials? In realmpop.com, if you check human representation it increases from average 31% to 35% in PvP realms, and decreases from 31% to 28% in PvE realms.

    [*] Third most popular race is Night Elves - the only Elf option for the Alliance.
    Wouldn't some of those just change elf races?

  16. #56
    High Overlord Voldur's Avatar
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    Alliance players want high elves because of legolas (he is cool, btw) and because elves are seen traditionally as a "good" race. Will they get them? Hardly because they have Night elves, and they are already too similar to the blood elves.

    Regarding the race distribution between each faction, it will probably change the moment the player models get upgraded. Playing something that resembles an orc instead of a hunchback green gorilla for example will have an effect on what race the people want to play imo.

  17. #57
    I think it's unlikely at this stage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Potassiumgluconate View Post
    If Blood Elves become a neutral faction, or high elves become a race of the alliance I will upload pictures of and film myself taking off my socks after a hard day of work, and then eat them.
    I like this thread.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

  18. #58
    Blademaster bladez's Avatar
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    Regarding server faction balance. I play on Dunemaul~US and have since Classic. Played Alliance back then as well. In Vanilla/BC the server was like 75%+ Horde and has stayed Horde heavy to this day. With the addition of the connected realms/server merges, this inbalance has increased greatly in the hordes favor. For instance Timeless Isle has at least a 10 - 1 advantage of Horde. Not as bad as say, Illidan, where I currently have my 2 new horde 90's. (Who both happen to be Belfs o.O ) I never played a horde toon seriously before MoP( I cheated for my 1st 1 lol, I needed a character slot to make a Pandaren so I server/faction changed my 85 lock) My point is, I love how Blizzard decided to merge/connect a already horde heavy server with more horde heavy servers -_- I exclusively played Alliance until MoP and still don't play my Horde toons very often compared to my Alliance ones.

    On the issue of High Elves becoming a playable race or w/e. Peeps seem to forget that Blood Elves are a sub race of the High Elves. High Elves have been in game since Classic as well. High Elves as a playabe race would make more sense than a lot of other talked about possibilities. Makes more sense than Panda's lol, I mean, Pandaren's were made as a joke pretty much for Warcraft 3.
    -Dunemaul~US~Alliance-~ Society of Benevolence~-Warder~90 Fury/Prot Warrior-Grizwiz~90 Feral/Guardian Druid-Keenedge~90 MM/Surv Hunter-Garyu~90 Unholy/Blood DK-Jacenorcbane~90 Holy/Ret Palidan-Kablaa~90 Fire/Frost Mage-Spearsister~90 Enhance/Resto Shaman-Illidan~US~Horde-Unleash the Dragon~Malphia ~90 Demo/Destro Warlock

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by HammondQ View Post
    I don't want to play as an Ugly Drooling Monster.
    Then you're not welcome in MY TRUE HORDE!!!! RAWR!!!

    And hey, what about goblins?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Lemonpartyfan View Post
    Its more interesting. If you want to play with your alliance friends just transfer, or reroll. You can't put forth a good argument as to why things could change, I bet.
    Mechanically or lore-wise?

    Mechanically, for zero factions: The war has no impact whatsoever on the game world, is not needed for instanced PvP, and only serves any real purpose whatsoever on PvP servers (which usually devolve into ganking). I can round up a bunch of friends and go slaughter Alliance cities and NPCs, and it won't make any difference whatsoever. On the other hand, dissolving faction lines would expand grouping possibilities, open up racial possibilities (I'd love to play another gnome, but my guild is Horde so I don't have the option; no, goblin doesn't count), open up collection possibilities, and generally make many things possible that aren't possible now without any kind of real loss, particularly on PvE servers (keeping in mind that I oppose ganking, and don't consider its loss painful).

    Mechanically, for multiple factions: Faction imbalances will always exist, and while connected/virtual realms address the problem, there are some great meta-political options for having multiple factions.... shifting alliances are a blast, and far more cutthroat than anything WoW has now or has ever had, regarding PvP. The factions of today are only tenuously held together at any rate, and if the factions weren't clearly separated by race you could have some interesting and logical groupings (Pandaren + Night Elf + Tauren, for instance). Everything that is supposedly great about world PvP would be even better under such a system; just wait until one group becomes dominant, and then all others band together to take it down, just to turn on each other when someone else takes power.

    Lore-wise, Horde: While the Horde has backed a new warchief, Sylvanas and Lor'themar have little reason to do so. Their last warchief brought them to the brink of war with pretty much the entire world, and in particular the last warchief's actions painted a giant target on the Blood Elves, and closed off diplomatic options with the Kirin Tor and Jaina... and, yes, with the Alliance as a whole. While Vol'jin never supported Garrosh, and only gave him a chance because of Thrall, that's hardly a basis for trust. Thrall named Vol'Jin as warchief.... great, except he also named Garrosh as warchief, so again, not much of a foundation for support there. For the Forsaken, it's always been a matter of convenience and mutual defense, with questionable value to the rest of the Horde.

    Lore-wise, Alliance: I've never understood why any other race pledges loyalty to the Human King. He was, at first, a warmonger, and now all of a sudden is all about peace and honor (game perspective; I'm not paying Blizzard to tell me lore points that should be in-game, so I judge him only by how he's presented in-game). Even if that's an improvement, it's not exactly reliable or consistent... and he has the interests of his people in mind, first and foremost, followed by the interests of the Alliance. Yes, I know, the original Warcraft game was about Orcs vs. Humans, but that's not a reason for the Night Elves to continue to ally with the Alliance over all others. The Horde's capital and dominion is primarily in Kalimdor, they're on the front lines.... now, after the defeat of Garrosh, is the perfect time to use those diplomatic ties through the Cenarion Circle to open new dialogues between Darnassus and Thunder Bluff, as well as between Darnassus and Orgrimmar, for the sake of preventing any future outbreaks of war... something that Varian is clearly not willing to do (he's still taking advice from Jaina, who's gone completely homicidal, probably because Blizzard's plan calls for the second-in-command to be a warmonger for the sake of dramatic tension) since his parting words were not a promise or hope for a better future, but a threat and an ultimatum.

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