Do you think Stance of the Gladiator will successfully allow prot to be viable dps?

[Traveler Voltin]

if it actually works. i might have to make a 5th horde warrior. dang it.

[Sam the Wiser]

I'm waiting for this to be tested to make a warrior. I'm hoping blizzard sticks with it tho.

[Traveler Voltin]

outside of orcs what horde race seems gladiatorish?

[ro9ue]

I think if this is successful this might open up the possibility for other multi-role specs such as enhancement or demo tank and even a bear dps. I support this.

[Deleted]

I could see bear dps, but enh or demo tank wont happen. You need entirely different or more tools to make it work. And atm they are taking away things to make it simpler not harder. It easier and vialbe to make an adjustment or add say a tank/dps spec in the classes that can already tank. Outside of those its very difficult and i dont think they would ever spend the time needed to make something like this work when there is far more important things to work on.

[Luko]

So, let me make sure I'm not missing anything here.

I'm a geared Prot Warrior. I'm level 100. I've taken the appropriate level 100 talent. I can now switch into gladiator's stance and queue into LFR (for example) as a damage role and pull competitive DPS? (theoretically)

[Zaithor]

I'm so excited to dps as prot. I just wonder if it will require tank or dps stats to deal optimal damage. Either way, if this makes it to live, prot will be my main spec again!

So, let me make sure I'm not missing anything here.

I'm a geared Prot Warrior. I'm level 100. I've taken the appropriate level 100 talent. I can now switch into gladiator's stance and queue into LFR (for example) as a damage role and pull competitive DPS? (theoretically)

That seems to be the case. Though "competitive" to blizzard in this case might mean "competitive with the lowest dps specs". We wont know until we see it.

outside of orcs what horde race seems gladiatorish?

Tauren likely come after Orcs. Hell, everything except for male belfs.

[Deleted]

I hope they make it the lvl 90 tier, I wanna level as this to 100

[Luko]

That seems to be the case. Though "competitive" to blizzard in this case might mean "competitive with the lowest dps specs". We wont know until we see it.

That's totally fine with me. Maybe it's because I'm a tad old school and always imagined my warriors with sword and board, but a shield wielding melee DPS has me giddy beyond belief. Hell, I even gave into the GW2 hype a few years back based entirely on the fact that I could "dps" as a shield warrior.

I couldn't care less if the gladiator concept was designed to be a chart topper, if I can queue up and perform better than I would showing up to DPS in current content as Prot, sign me the hell up.

[Delekii]

I used my included character boost on a warrior the day I read the announcement.

I fucking hate warrior, but only because I don't like the imagery of the reckless buffoon that both dps specs currently portray.


I really liked leveling as prot, but HATE "active" tanking (ie: do dps, only these abilities don't do dps), so my warrior (and dk and monk and paladin) mostly don't get played. If gladiator ends up being a function dps plate spec that uses a shield, I will use it exclusively.

[Landsoul]

A lot of people here are probably concerned with whether or not Gladiator Stance will be optimal DPS out-of-the-box if it is tuned to compete with Arms/Fury. Arms/Fury gear will NOT be optimal for Gladiator. Without bonus armor items, it will be a few percent behind it's capability.

i. You will likely not be able to pickup the bonus armor items first due to the actual tanks requiring them.
ii. You will likely not be able to pickup a shield ahead of real tanks
iii. 1h melee weapons are at least shared now between all melee classes (exception of Ret)

Another concern is that any DPS Warrior might be stuck in this role regardless for the added tank comp flexibility. This I'm afraid is a very REAL possibility to maximize Mythic raid resources. They could always pickup bonus armor accessories from LFR, Flex, Heroic, Valor, or Dungeons since it's all on separate lockouts.

[Traveler Voltin]

Tauren likely come after Orcs. Hell, everything except for male belfs.

ok well i am thinking forsaken or goblin at this point.

anyway going to be interesting to see how it works.

[Ansi]

A lot of people here are probably concerned with whether or not Gladiator Stance will be optimal DPS out-of-the-box if it is tuned to compete with Arms/Fury. Arms/Fury gear will NOT be optimal for Gladiator. Without bonus armor items, it will be a few percent behind it's capability.

i. You will likely not be able to pickup the bonus armor items first due to the actual tanks requiring them.
ii. You will likely not be able to pickup a shield ahead of real tanks
iii. 1h melee weapons are at least shared now between all melee classes (exception of Ret)

Another concern is that any DPS Warrior might be stuck in this role regardless for the added tank comp flexibility. This I'm afraid is a very REAL possibility to maximize Mythic raid resources. They could always pickup bonus armor accessories from LFR, Flex, Heroic, Valor, or Dungeons since it's all on separate lockouts.

This is a valid point and weird issue for progression raids, both normal and mythic. Gladiator warriors could be slightly alienated because they 'steal' loot from tanks, when they could be rolling fury or arms instead. Will be interesting to see how this turns out.

On the other hand it's a plus for regular tanks who can easily go dps.

[Requiel]

A lot of people here are probably concerned with whether or not Gladiator Stance will be optimal DPS out-of-the-box if it is tuned to compete with Arms/Fury. Arms/Fury gear will NOT be optimal for Gladiator. Without bonus armor items, it will be a few percent behind it's capability.

i. You will likely not be able to pickup the bonus armor items first due to the actual tanks requiring them.
ii. You will likely not be able to pickup a shield ahead of real tanks
iii. 1h melee weapons are at least shared now between all melee classes (exception of Ret)

Is this assuming that bonus armor will be as OP as it looks like now or that bonus armor is truly a bonus I.e. 2 secondaries + bonus armor?

[Archimtiros]

I disagree.

I do too!

That post was written a long time ago during a much earlier iteration of Gladiator Stance. See some of my more recent posts on the subject or my SentryTotem writeup covering the spec.

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Is this assuming that bonus armor will be as OP as it looks like now or that bonus armor is truly a bonus I.e. 2 secondaries + bonus armor?

Bonus Armor is a secondary stat in place of another (ie: instead of Crit you'd have + Armor).

[Requiel]

Bonus Armor is a secondary stat in place of another (ie: instead of Crit you'd have + Armor).

that's why I asked if he was assuming that

[Archimtiros]

A lot of people here are probably concerned with whether or not Gladiator Stance will be optimal DPS out-of-the-box if it is tuned to compete with Arms/Fury. Arms/Fury gear will NOT be optimal for Gladiator. Without bonus armor items, it will be a few percent behind it's capability.

i. You will likely not be able to pickup the bonus armor items first due to the actual tanks requiring them.
ii. You will likely not be able to pickup a shield ahead of real tanks
iii. 1h melee weapons are at least shared now between all melee classes (exception of Ret)

Another concern is that any DPS Warrior might be stuck in this role regardless for the added tank comp flexibility. This I'm afraid is a very REAL possibility to maximize Mythic raid resources. They could always pickup bonus armor accessories from LFR, Flex, Heroic, Valor, or Dungeons since it's all on separate lockouts.

I don't know that this is true. Numbers aren't even close to completely tuned yet, and it would be very easy to tune them with or without the expectation of having Bonus Armor items (or if Bladed Armor will even work in Glad Stance or be turned off like Unwavering Sentinel).

Likewise, whether or not your guild gives a Shield to a Gladiator DPS before a Tank is a guild gearing decision. Many guilds gear DPS before tanks (with regard to competitive slots such as Tier, extreme bonuses not withstanding). Other guilds, like mine always gear their tanks first.

And as for Warriors getting stuck in this role, I mean that's what dual spec is for and really is another guild decision. Your bench and flexibility of players comes into play. Especially with stats being brought closer in line, it would be very easy to go from complete DPS to tank with just a couple Trinket changes. Not having Bonus Armor on your Fury set may bring down your survivability a smidge, but no more so than having your Frost DK go Blood, or your Mistweaver go Brewmaster like we currently have.

- - - Updated - - -

that's why I asked if he was assuming that

lol sorry misunderstood you. And didn't even realize it was you, else I would have responded on skype. I am very distracted today.

- - - Updated - - -

That seems to be the case. Though "competitive" to blizzard in this case might mean "competitive with the lowest dps specs". We wont know until we see it.

Everyone has a different idea of what competitive is as well. Unless you are 20%+ weaker, I'd say you are pretty close. These days even being 5% off is considered an outrage when really you can see a bigger difference with (bad or good) trinket procs and RNG.

[Deleted]

I could see gear becoming a problem for Gladiators as they share gear with tanks, but the spec will be great for guildless players like me who just want to enjoy the game without the troubles guilds bring as with oqueue and openraid, gearing without a guild is really easy, i obtained full flex tank gear within a few weeks when SOO arrived and considering their making normal mode flex, any gear outside heroics will be without any issues.
Im hoping for a return to the Icecrown Citadel golden PuG era where there where countless of PuGs beating Heroic bosses even, Blizzard should put that as their goal.
That with having a single spec that can tank, dps and pvp with just swapping out some talents completely revives my interest in the game.
Protection Warriors in WoD are shaping up to be the most interesting thing ive ever seen this class get.

[Requiel]

I could see gear becoming a problem for Gladiators as they share gear with tanks, but the spec will be great for guildless players like me who just want to enjoy the game without the troubles guilds bring as with oqueue and openraid, gearing without a guild is really easy, i obtained full flex tank gear within a few weeks when SOO arrived and considering their making normal mode flex, any gear outside heroics will be without any issues.
Im hoping for a return to the Icecrown Citadel golden PuG era where there where countless of PuGs beating Heroic bosses even, Blizzard should put that as their goal.
That with having a single spec that can tank, dps and pvp with just swapping out some talents completely revives my interest in the game.
Protection Warriors in WoD are shaping up to be the most interesting thing ive ever seen this class get.

the only thing that the both share exclusive to the other spec is necks, rings, capes & shields, most of these are minor pieces in the overall gear set. most of the other plate gear will be shared with other dps and tank classes/specs. so the gearing problem isn't as bad as most people think it is (for specifically prot v glad).

[Flaks]

I think if this is successful this might open up the possibility for other multi-role specs such as enhancement or demo tank and even a bear dps. I support this.

I wouldn't hold my breath. I'd imagine Gladiator Stance warriors will be the only example of this for a long time yet if it even manages to work out. I'm thinking on the level of at least a couple of expansions before they spread the love to other classes/specs.