Greymane/Malachi256 2016 MAKE MMO-CHAMPION GREAT AGAIN!
Sec of Defense: Detritivores
"Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."
It has never meant anything outside of the mind of elitist players who want to feel special in way other than being a player someone can look up to.
It can never go back to what it never was in the first place.
There were epics pre-60 in vanilla, so even with a single tier of raid content it wasn't true.
Epic was NEVER Epic.
The community is the problem here, something people keep trying to blame the game for.
Timeless Isle and content similar should reward rare gear because when it rewards epic gear it sets an improper precedent that purple gear is absurdly easy to obtain which is completely false because it requires time and commitment to obtain good purple gear through either LFR and beyond.
Through the first 90 levels green gear is easy to obtain, blue gear takes time and commitment and purple gear is exceedingly rare. However when you hit 90 purple gear becomes as common as green gear initially which completely defeats the purpose of gear colours. So once again I say either properly define and commit to the gear colour precedent or remove them entirely if they no longer serve a purpose.
Last edited by Yimereh; 2013-12-07 at 06:23 AM.
"Properly define and commit to the gear colo[u]r precedent"?
There are so many things implicit in and wrong with that statement that I don't even know where to begin.
This "issue" has been around since classic. Even then most people had plenty of epic gear (especially after t2 came out), epic gear was only rare because raids where of 40 people and less items dropped. You do the math.
Item-level has taken over as the mark of quality, I don't mind. It is very obvious that a warforged item is much better than an item from LFR for example, so who cares if they both have the same color.
Furthermore, this has been consistent with the way this game has operated since late WotLK. Just because you believe that gear acquisition should happen more slowly doesn't suddenly make that idea a "fact," nor does it make the current reality "false." When you make these arguments I picture my shivering daughter insisting that the weather is perfectly fine, that she doesn't need a jacket, and that maybe I should consider ditching my own. They're just not convincing. Wishful thinking and nostalgia is not the same as fact.
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Item level is the dividing factor, and frankly nobody cares whether or not a newly dinged character can have full epics. They certainly can't have 560+ on ding.
The colors need to be tied to the actual rarity of items rather than quality.
People need to get over the gear color (and themselves). It doesn't matter, and it shouldn't matter what other players have either. Worry about your damn self. Live your life by that. If you want to concern yourself with someone else, then worry about HELPING them, not putting them down or making sure you stand out as better than them.
The question is, why do some people put so much stock in the item color? Would people really turn down a blue item that was better then their epic? Actually, scratch that question because I've seen people who have done just that and held onto their tier gear from the previous expansion until they could get epics.
It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion. It is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed, the hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning.
I see the logic you're using, OP, but I honestly think it really doesn't have much of an impact on the vast majority of new players.
Oh, I may be on the side of the angels, but don't think for one second that I am one of them.
Colour is just an archaic system, it;s more to do with the tags now (flex RF, heroic) they are what indicate effort.
My guild usually gets a few heroics down. I can't remember anyone actually caring about loot for a long time besides maybe a trinket here and there. For me the last piece of loot that I actually was excited about was Skull of Guldan in BT. Purple lost its meaning a long time ago.
Everyone's an atheist, some people just take it one god further.
"I don't want someone who has the knowledge, skill, or even personality necessary to be president. I want someone who can speak his bigoted mind without worrying about offending people!"- The batman
You should hate that at some point in the coming expansion you're going to replace your "epics" from MoP with a "better" gear that you could possibly get as a reward by obtaining a dozen dinosaur livers or something else trivial. You will be trading some of the best pieces in the game for crap gear because the message the game sends to the player with green text is exactly that: This is gear that you will want to get rid of as quickly as you can. If the green text were removed--if all green/blue/purple/orange were totally removed--that would be one less jarring element in the gearing/progression system. It wouldn't fix it but it would remove something that I believe no longer has any meaning or place in the game.
I play on an RP server so my main has a history, a history that stretches across all expansions and a story that does not respect the boundaries between BC/Wrath/Cataclysm/MoP, etc. The gear resets between expansions are a problem with the gearing system generally that I have little respect for and of which the text color on the piece is just a small part. It's the system we have and despite the lobbying that people do on forums I don't expect it to change. In the best of all possible games, gearing would be a cohesive system that would respect your past accomplishments and instead of tossing off old gear like yesterday's trash it would make a certain amount of real world sense that it lacks now. Transmogrification has improved this quite a bit for players like myself but nonetheless we're constantly reminded that transmogrification is basically a thin veneer layed on to cover up the disparities in the system as a whole. Once you get to end game, your character as such stops progressing, it stops gaining experience as it experiences various events and the only thing you have to show for this is the rather impersonal reward of better stuff. It's gear progression, not character advancement.
It's a complicated subject that I can't do justice to in a few paragraphs so sorry about that. But my problems with the gearing system in WoW (and other games) is larger than just the colors used. It has to do with the messages the game sends you and has more to do with the lack of actual character advancement in the game which at end game is simply replaced with the artificiality of gear with better stats. Much more satisfying to me would be a system where the character itself would improve with experience, the gear should matter much less if at all. It's not a better staff, it's a staff that you learn to use in new ways and can bring new hard-won skills to.
That said, given the system we have, upgrades are upgrades whether or not the color changes and good players will take it even though players trash 'legendary' gear for the additional power of new 'green' gear. No I don't care about that but at some level I do very much care about the messages sent and how it leads to a much less seamless and immersive experience and how it has less to do with your character and everything to do with your possessions. Hope this explains in a minor way where I'm at. Gearing in WoW and how it corrupts your character's storyline of progression and personal advancement is probably the thing I like least about the game.
Someday I'd like to see a really serious conversation started up with the devs about this but at the end of the day it's probably a different game I'm asking for. But I think that to the extent that systems like gear take you out of the personal space that is "you" in the game it probably affects long-term retention and investment in your character.
[OK, so I failed at keeping it short, sorry. It's a topic that I think about a lot and if I ever leave the game it will more likely be due to this than anything.]
Last edited by MoanaLisa; 2013-12-07 at 08:41 PM.
Someone mainly playing flex is going "LFR shouldn't drop epics, only REAL raids should, like flex".
The next guy raids normal and says "Flex is easymode, only hard raids should drop epics, like normal".
And the third guy says "Only heroic is truly epic raiding and deserves epic loot".
You will never come to an agreement, thats the problem. If they'd change things to what the OP proposed you'll have the same kind of threads one week after that.
The problem is that the item color is now tied to it's quality rather than its rarity. Having both ilvl and purple on the same piece of gear is redundant.