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  1. #21
    Mechagnome Deyana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valyna View Post
    Immerseus is AoE heavy without the real option to shadowburn cleave the small adds.
    Why not. I'm really not much into simming or theorycrafting, but did manage to get Immerseus 10m #18 west which is now pushed down to #21, as ilvl 567 or something and that with GoSac and KJC. Maybe different in 25m, not sure, never tried.
    /brag

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Deyana View Post
    Why not. I'm really not much into simming or theorycrafting, but did manage to get Immerseus 10m #18 west which is now pushed down to #21, as ilvl 567 or something and that with GoSac and KJC. Maybe different in 25m, not sure, never tried.
    /brag
    The thing is that you don't gain much from GoSac on immerseus, and KJC is an obvious choice for immerseus. and it's an add fight, if people allow you to be a lot on the adds you will rank as there is so much dps to gain, the pet wo uld've made around 20k dps difference, though your havocs would be stronger in GoSac. There is strong points for both of them and GoSup only pulls slightly ahead, it doesn't make or break your dps, but as you are going to use GoSac on protectors there is little reason to not go it on immerseus too.

    Checking your logs its only natural to let you go on the adds as you are the only aoe person in the raid thus its very easy for you to rank when you deal 75% of your damage on the adds, you would've pulled ahead with GoSup then, because 75% of the damage you did was on aoe targets. And you see the same tendancy on most other people who rank... they let you deal 50-80% of the adds all by yourself and let everyone else handle the boss, and you easily do around 400-500k. And you can also see the top dps using the GoSup observer. It might not be so much, but at least its a 10-20k dps increase.
    Last edited by theburned; 2013-12-14 at 09:10 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lyeranth View Post
    Why dont we just have thrall and Malfurion whip it out and someone can measure and then we can be done with it.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Deyana View Post
    Why not. I'm really not much into simming or theorycrafting, but did manage to get Immerseus 10m #18 west which is now pushed down to #21, as ilvl 567 or something and that with GoSac and KJC. Maybe different in 25m, not sure, never tried.
    /brag
    Gratz, but you would have gotten an even higher rank with GoSup since you missed at least half the dps gain of the whole lvl75 tier. As long as you are FnBing, you are not gaining any benefit from GoSac. Definitly depending on your guilds DPS - in my case, Immerseus is at 1 HP as soon as the adds are dead, that means I´m casting some singletarget spells until the first adds are spawning and then switch to FnB.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Fanatik View Post
    Only glyph that is mandatory for the class is Siphon Life. Every other glyph is situational.
    I'd argue Glyph of Soulstone is mandatory, but I guess it might depend on fight and raid comp.

    To me, talent choices depend a lot on strat and raid comp/size. There is no one size fits all.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by ItcheeBeard View Post
    I must admit you're one of the only people I've heard say that MF is worth using on ANY fight as destro.

    EDIT: I realise now you mainspec demo so I'm assuming you meant as demo for those fights which would make alot more sense.
    I do use it on Galakras as Destruction, the adds are often dispersed enough thanks to charging everywhere that I feel the extra radius is useful and you can pretty much use it on cooldown to get full benefit from it. I certainly don't feel it's been a hinderance or net loss overall comparing my own performance with our other Destruction Warlocks who play the spec considerably better than I do - I'm not sure if they use the talent.

    Please explain your choice of go serv with destruction? I can only seeing it be viable for demo due to the synergy between goserv and your mastery.
    The actual throughput from pets is much more variable than the differences based on absolute averages would show by several orders of magnitude; with that in mind I feel like most encounters offer opportunities for extra throughput by stacking Service with procs, cooldowns and vulnerabilities (something simcraft doesn't account for), or through avoiding damage lost during downtime - even if you and your pet aren't hitting the boss, the cooldown timer is still ticking.

  6. #26
    Mechagnome Deyana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    I certainly don't feel it's been a hinderance or net loss overall comparing my own performance with our other Destruction Warlocks who play the spec considerably better than I do - I'm not sure if they use the talent.
    You can tell that to people who don't know how or don't have the time to stalk logs. :P

    And I'm with the people who say MF is useless. It's ridiculously bad.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Thelm View Post
    I'd argue Glyph of Soulstone is mandatory, but I guess it might depend on fight and raid comp.
    I mean, its nice to have if you have no other needs, but really only mandatory when:
    Is there a mechanic that could potentially kill someone if they were not at full HP when soulstone resurrected? Use soulstone.

  8. #28
    The only fight where changing a glyph or talent is huge would be Thok, get the glyph that makes Unending Resolve a 2 min CD so you can use it more and cast during the interrupts. If you know where you guild devo auras you can get a lot of casting in. Glyph of Curse of Exhaustion is good for General Nazgrim to slow the assassins and it is a good Affliction fight. I play pet sac for every fight I play destro on. On AoE fights I like to use the AoE to get a lot of embers and then use them to CB the adds/boss that needs to die. You aren't going to wipe on Galakras or Sha of Pride because you didn't have enough add damage but you will wipe if you can't go up the tower because the npc died or someone dies in the maze (people get sent to the maze right after adds come out).

    It's nice if you can play more than one spec. I know that specs aren't technically talents anymore but destro isn't perfect for every fight and locks have it easy with their stats so you don't have to go to town or anything to regem/reforge.
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  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by nsgid View Post
    What fights do you all use grimoire of supremacy or sacrifice on?

    Also, which fights would you say Archimondes vengeance is better than Kil'jaedans cunning?

    The reason i ask this is because we're starting to do more heroic progression and I would like to maximize my damage and use the talents that are best for each fight. So if you all have a certain talent for the last two tiers that you change each fights, let me know so i can give it a try! But for normal modes i dont ever change from Grim of sac and KJC. Thanks all!
    If I play destro, I have KJC, if I play demo, I have AD - just find it easier to handle. The only fights I feel I have to play specific specs is destro (siege+garrosh) and demo (klaxxi).
    I do every fight with soullink (except thok with pet shield), and every fight as destro with sac (except fel imp for thok, and eyeball for interrupting mc's on garrosh). As demo I use supremacy on thok/klaxxi, everything else service.
    UR duration glyph for thok, everything else is 10% mitigation glyph.

    I never play affliction - nothing against it, just since I feel I need demo for klaxxi, and destro for siege/garrosh, I cbf respeccing for the second night.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fanatik View Post
    (Glyph of soulstone) I mean, its nice to have if you have no other needs, but really only mandatory when:
    Heh, nah, that is when you say "I am wipe recovery" and ss before the pull
    Last edited by rijn dael; 2013-12-15 at 11:01 PM.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Deyana View Post
    You can tell that to people who don't know how or don't have the time to stalk logs. :P

    And I'm with the people who say MF is useless. It's ridiculously bad.
    I doubt if enough competent Warlocks have really tried to exploit the talent to produce a viable dataset. A lot of people seem to regard Demonology as ridiculously bad based on available parses.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    I doubt if enough competent Warlocks have really tried to exploit the talent to produce a viable dataset. A lot of people seem to regard Demonology as ridiculously bad based on available parses.
    Fair sure both evrelia and sparkuggz have said in their guides that it's worthless for destro.

    Not saying their opinion is gospel but, yeah.

    Welcome to WoD Please enjoy your stay!

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by ItcheeBeard View Post
    Fair sure both evrelia and sparkuggz have said in their guides that it's worthless for destro.

    Not saying their opinion is gospel but, yeah.
    Yeah, that'll be why there's no parses and why Observer is always best pet by a million DPS :\

  13. #33
    MF is about as useful to destro as KJC is for demo, which should give an idea of how useful MF is for destro, it isnt worthless but its close.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    I doubt if enough competent Warlocks have really tried to exploit the talent to produce a viable dataset. A lot of people seem to regard Demonology as ridiculously bad based on available parses.
    so what? just guess and say it´s good because you are doing about the same dps as your other destros? especially on galakras, destros dps it an up and down from try to try. got trinketproccs up while able to shadowburn cleave? - hallelujah
    That´s no "I read it on guide xyz", thats simple logic. Rain of fire does nearly no dps since it´s mainjob is to generate embers. double this damage and it will still do nearly no dps. You´ll just get WAY more dps from KJC or AV. Trying it out on a "real" bossfight is definitly not the right way. Just do 5 tries with the same setup, and I bet the dps differences are about the same as from switching KJC to MF

  15. #35
    Mechagnome Deyana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valyna View Post
    Rain of fire does nearly no dps since it´s mainjob is to generate embers. double this damage and it will still do nearly no dps.
    This, and since the fight has so many opportunities to shadowburn, your embers go up and down too fast to even notice the little gain you might get from RoF. And let's be honest, the adds are stacked well most of the time, as long as you have a tank there doing his/her job.

  16. #36
    I can't think of any encounter in SoO where MF would lead to a net dps increase over AV for Destro, at least not in any strategy I've seen. I'm not a big fan of KJC for Destro either, since it doesn't help you one bit if you get a proc during movement; you won't be able to Chaos Bolt anyway.

  17. #37
    Blademaster Swo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EvreliaGaming View Post
    I can't think of any encounter in SoO where MF would lead to a net dps increase over AV for Destro, at least not in any strategy I've seen. I'm not a big fan of KJC for Destro either, since it doesn't help you one bit if you get a proc during movement; you won't be able to Chaos Bolt anyway.
    Finally someone who agrees with me. Almost been afraid to post in here again since I was the only one who would choose AD over KJC.

  18. #38
    Mechagnome Deyana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swo View Post
    Finally someone who agrees with me. Almost been afraid to post in here again since I was the only one who would choose AD over KJC.
    I kind of agree too, but I'm still using KJC because it's the most universal and convenient choice and while I might lose dps on some bosses, it's needed for others (talking about heroic) and being in non-hardcore guild means I can just go with default setting without changing before every boss. Did most of the normal SoO with AD but heroic requires way too much moving.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by EvreliaGaming View Post
    I can't think of any encounter in SoO where MF would lead to a net dps increase over AV for Destro, at least not in any strategy I've seen. I'm not a big fan of KJC for Destro either, since it doesn't help you one bit if you get a proc during movement; you won't be able to Chaos Bolt anyway.
    What did you use for H Garrosh? AD or KJC?

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by varren View Post
    What did you use for H Garrosh? AD or KJC?
    I used KJC purely because we had locks baiting the weapons, which meant I was moving pretty much constantly. Garrosh is the only fight I've used KJC on (for any spec) this tier.

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