Our Elemental Shaman is under performing and needs help

[Vulcanasm]

Mmmmmmmmmk moving along from the stat wars because arglebargleclownfartLOOKHOWSMARTIAM is already getting old, and if two stats are close enough to argue about, it cannot possibly be the main problem or even a major one...

You want simple answers to why your Shaman is doing badly? Here's what everyone has said.

1.) Not using Flame Shock = 10% DPS loss.
2.) No Searing Totem = 10% DPS loss.
3.) No Fire Elemental = 10% DPS loss.
4.) No Echo of the Elements = 5% DPS loss, maybe more.

There. Fix those and she'll be in range of everyone else's DPS. Things like better trinkets and the Level 90 talent can come later. Fix the big stuff first.

[Deleted]

Hi Guys,

Another "Please help my guildies DPS" thread. Hope you don't mind.

Can someone please have a look at our ele shaman and let me know what the issues are with her DPS? We only have a couple of logs ATM (only 2 attempts on Garrosh were actually logged last night) but hopefully you can help explain why her DPS is so low compared to others.

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-n702eb8g4ld6hut6/

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...hlynn/advanced

I don't think it's a problem with her gear/gemming/reforging, so I'm assuming it's to do with her play style. I'd prefer for her DPS to improve rather than have to drop her as she's a good, aware, raider and a lovely person.

Any advice gratefully welcomed.

Nav

Despite most things said, and in agreement with some, i can already see the issue by just looking at her gear.
Now i'm going to come across as arrogant, but that's alright.

She needs more haste. And she needs to use UF.
Since the only logs you provided are Normal Garrosh encounters, i'll be making my argument from that.

While at first glance you would think that Garrosh is an AoE-fight, you are terribly wrong. This fight is ALL about the Single-target dps you can pull while staying alive. Adds in P1 will more or less die to residual AoE and the iron star - Albeit, keep your better suited classes on Garrosh for single-target and let your shammy and your... paladin (I think, best suited?) cleave away. Tell her to spam CL some more. And then some more. Once she is done, she needs to spam it some more.

I went resto recently myself so my current armory link won't help much, but i consistently pulled much higher numbers than your friend at or around the same gear level - Here's a link to one of old Garrosh kills, my Ilevel was 564 back then IIRC - and that was with bad Flame Shock uptime because i was just cleaving the adds in P1, since that was my job - feel free to poke around.

Even with more haste, speccing EotE and using UF, i'm guessing it's a routine and playstyle issue. She needs to come to terms with what direction her DPS is going, and as a Shaman, it's cleave where we truly shiny, as well as our utility (2x personal defensive CDs + raidwipe CDs as well) as a dps class.

Cheers.

PS: She NEEDS the Amp. trinket. Fuck it if it's LFR/Flex/Normal, it does NOT matter. The trinket is BiS in all it's forms and shapes (Bar the LFR one, but only slightly) and there isn't any other single piece of gear more worthy of her tokens.
The crit-proc one is trash and she's better off with any other trinket. Even previous tier ones. A crit proc is does not in any shape or form help the initial burst where it matters the most.

[woopytywoop]

Mmmmmmmmmk moving along from the stat wars because arglebargleclownfartLOOKHOWSMARTIAM is already getting old, and if two stats are close enough to argue about, it cannot possibly be the main problem or even a major one...

Best comment i read since a while on these forums.
I find it also quite amazing people can make such big arguments when the relative difference is so small.

for OP, most has been said already, maybe get her aura's or nameplates so she can track her flame shock better.
echo in stead of EM.
lvl 90 talent, if she has problems with ele rotation, just get PE, it's not the best but will be better than unused EB/UF.
And also she doesn't know how to do openings burst optimally (that is something she can easily practise on the dummies).
And finally, ABC, always be casting.
If you add it all up, she can improve a good 25-30%

I guess there are some priority addons she can use if she wants to practise on the dummies, she'll notice soon enough what she's doing wrong. But she has to make sure she doesn't get depended on them for obvious reasons.

But yeh, the problem is in the simple things and not in the min maxing stats etc, don't bother her with that yet.

[Deleted]

That's why all top 10 WoL shamans gem/reforge into pure haste right? Where exactly are you getting your information from?

on totemspot

[hatchetman240]

Hi! I just got my first garrosh kill last week and I was raid leading, so my numbers were bad because the first couple of kills I'm keeping an eye on where everyone is instead of on my weak auras, but here's a comparebot of her vs me:

http://raidbots.com/comparebot/52b1b...3001438#damage

Her FS time is bad, if I can keep it up 86% of the time (even with phase changes and all the other stuff we're doing) then so can she. Even my 86% is probably bad, but I have no idea what the roof is on FS uptimes for this fight. Anyway, that's huge DPS loss in itself. By proxy of all my FS uptime and because I cast it on CD, I got off almost twice as many LBs as she did for the given time. She's simply not tracking her FS and other CDs. She's getting off one fewer ascendance than is possible in the given time, and that's a lot of DPS missing as well. She specced for EB that fight, she failed to use it much also because she's not watching her CDs. She should get endus' weak aura array, I use it myself and my uptimes skyrocketed when I began using it.

Strictly speaking at her ilvl UE>FE or EB, especially on this fight. Don't fool yourself into thinking it's an AOE fight. Iron stars do most of the AOE for you.

Also she never even hit shamanistic rage, so she wasn't mitigating any damage, and you need this on a number of spots. I could be using mine more as well, but she used none. She should be specced for SBT or Astral Shift each has their uses.

I took the liberty of simming her with reforge. Her current Scale Factors:
Int=6.35(0.22) SP=0.00(0.00) Hit=8.55(1.20) Crit=2.85(0.22) Haste=3.81(0.22) Mastery=3.00(0.22)

Her reforge shows a fractional single target increase of about 1% if she reforges 5000 mastery over to haste. Pretty minor, and that's sim DPS which wont translate to a real 1% with lag (and especially not with her CD tracking in its current state). The increase in single target will eventually be better with better trinkets, so you can pretty much exclude her haste/mastery ratio choice as being the culprit. It's her CD tracking.

[Volitar]

6 Flameshocks in 10mins..allofmywut.

[ACRL]

2.) No Searing Totem = 10% DPS loss.

Retard /10


[Infracted]

[hatchetman240]

to be fair, the searing totem is actually doing consistent damage, so it COULD be 10% of a players DPS if they're doing a lot of things wrong.

[Anzen]

1.) Not using Flame Shock = 10% DPS loss.
2.) No Searing Totem = 10% DPS loss.
3.) No Fire Elemental = 10% DPS loss.
4.) No Echo of the Elements = 5% DPS loss, maybe more.

Generally:

1.) No Flame Shock = Between 15-20%+ DPS loss (depending on mastery and haste).
2.) No Searing Totem = About 1-2% DPS loss.
3.) No Fire Elemental = About 3-4% without PE DPS loss.
4.) No Echo of the Elements = I doubt it's as high as 5%.

The shaman is just playing badly.

2.) No Searing Totem = 10% DPS loss.

Retard /10

No need for that

[Deleted]

Thanks to this thread recently found out stacking into mastery w/o a cape and meta gem is a bad idea.

Out of interest, can you guys give any tips on a decent opener with UF+EoE specced? Main is a mage and usingmy shaman as an alt for raids.

[fearom]

Thanks to this thread recently found out stacking into mastery w/o a cape and meta gem is a bad idea.

Out of interest, can you guys give any tips on a decent opener with UF+EoE specced? Main is a mage and usingmy shaman as an alt for raids.

Depending on if you're lusting or not.

3 seconds fire ele totem > 2-3 seconds potion (depends on haste) > Lightning bolt (pre-cast) > Storm Lash + Lust (same time) > Flame shock > LvB > UE > Ascendance > spam LvB.

This can be altered slightly if you have a lava surge proc, use it before you hit Ascendance. This rotation is pretty much the optimal opener.

- - - Updated - - -

Oh and, by the way. With UF spec'd never hold your UE - always cast it on cooldown. Waiting for LvB or Lava Surge procs is actually a dps loss. Make sure you hit it on cooldown.

[Vulcanasm]

Retard /10

Shrug. Do you dispute that those are the four most important things to fix?

If they aren't the biggest issues, then what else should she work on?

There is no known language in which "helpful" equates with "SEE HOW SMART I AM" or "HA-HA, UR WRONG". In fact most well-adjusted people consider both capitalized statements the exact opposite.

[miffy23]

The main points of what she's doing wrong were pointed out clearly. The people wanting to debate Haste vs Mastery in T16 BiS gear may want to take it elsewhere, it has little to no significance here.

[Lavalashlol]

Depending on if you're lusting or not.

3 seconds fire ele totem > 2-3 seconds potion (depends on haste) > Lightning bolt (pre-cast) > Storm Lash + Lust (same time) > Flame shock > LvB > UE > Ascendance > spam LvB.

This can be altered slightly if you have a lava surge proc, use it before you hit Ascendance. This rotation is pretty much the optimal opener.

- - - Updated - - -

Oh and, by the way. With UF spec'd never hold your UE - always cast it on cooldown. Waiting for LvB or Lava Surge procs is actually a dps loss. Make sure you hit it on cooldown.

I'm gonna change your opening some because some of the things aren't optimal. 3 seconds fire ele> pre pot> pre cast Lightning bolt> UE with UF> Lava Burst> Flame Shock( so both are buffed and your LvB if it overloads will also be buffed and get the benefit of having the FS on it)> Storm Lash> Ascendance>LvB spam. If you're lusting on the pull pop it with your UE cast.

Also just to clarify his last quote, never hold UE outside of Ascendance, don't use it in ascendance though.

[Deleted]

Thank you so much, been struggling with an opener for a few days now and just used that on Siegecrafter and worked like a charm.

Another question, is earth elemental worth using? I never see any mention about it.

Been using UE on cd too thank you for the tips.

[jimmyolsen]

Thank you so much, been struggling with an opener for a few days now and just used that on Siegecrafter and worked like a charm.

Another question, is earth elemental worth using? I never see any mention about it.

Been using UE on cd too thank you for the tips.

An Earth Elemental without PE is worth about as much as a searing totem. So essentially, it's better than a lightning bolt, but not as good as an Earth Shock on your priority list. With PE, it's nearly equivalent to an Earth Shock, so should still fall in the same spot on your priority list.

Overall, it is only going to account for about 1% of your total dps so it's not the biggest concern in the world if you aren't dropping it, but it should still get dropped when you can.

[Deleted]

Ok brilliant, that clears that up.

Now a question on gear/stat prior... I'm sitting at 545 ilvl (half healer gear, one healer tier piece stillto be replaced) but I have 30% haste and 50% mastery. I have no meta gem or legendary cloak yet and every guide I've looked at said to preferably go haste>= mastery or concentrate on haste until you get themeta gem andslowly reforge into mastery.

Any tips?

[fearom]

Ok brilliant, that clears that up.

Now a question on gear/stat prior... I'm sitting at 545 ilvl (half healer gear, one healer tier piece stillto be replaced) but I have 30% haste and 50% mastery. I have no meta gem or legendary cloak yet and every guide I've looked at said to preferably go haste>= mastery or concentrate on haste until you get themeta gem andslowly reforge into mastery.

Any tips?

This is basically spot on with what you want to do mate. Until you have your meta, don't even consider mastery. The true answer to this is that you need to SimC your character if you want exact results. Otherwise, (if you cannot be bothered [don't blame you, alt]) than you should try to simply stack haste. This will be (statistically) a single target beneficial compared to using mastery. That being said SoO has a large amount of cleave, so I would be aiming for enough haste to feel comfortable with your cast times, then just leave the rest in Mastery.

[Deleted]

UE with UF> Lava Burst> Flame Shock( so both are buffed and your LvB if it overloads will also be buffed and get the benefit of having the FS on it)

Are you really sure about this part? I'm trying to do this with the training dummies and my Lava Burst hits harder if I do Flame Shock > UF > Lava Burst rather than UF > Lava Burst > Flame Shock

[Lavalashlol]

Are you really sure about this part? I'm trying to do this with the training dummies and my Lava Burst hits harder if I do Flame Shock > UF > Lava Burst rather than UF > Lava Burst > Flame Shock

The reason you're doing it is to buff both the FS and the Lava Burst which will net you higher dps because if it overloads, the overload also gains the buff, and your FS is ticking for more so over the 30 seconds it will net you more damage that just one LvB being buffed