1. #1

    Heroic? Hardmode? confused.

    I'm currently farming the terrorblade recolour in ulduar 25 but i have only just found a friend to help me kill thorim, could somebody explain to me which mode http://www.wowhead.com/item=45473 drops in? I've read conflicting info, some say hard mode which i BELIEVE is getting to thorim in under 6 minutes, correct? Wowhead says NORMAL mode, does this mean I have to wait out a whole 6 minutes before i get to thorim?
    Is 25 man classed as heroic? So confusing!

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by hatethisbit View Post
    I'm currently farming the terrorblade recolour in ulduar 25 but i have only just found a friend to help me kill thorim, could somebody explain to me which mode http://www.wowhead.com/item=45473 drops in? I've read conflicting info, some say hard mode which i BELIEVE is getting to thorim in under 6 minutes, correct? Wowhead says NORMAL mode, does this mean I have to wait out a whole 6 minutes before i get to thorim?
    Is 25 man classed as heroic? So confusing!
    Note: Heroic modes did not exist in Ulduar, so all Ulduar gear is listed as dropped in Normal mode.

    Hard Mode Thorim is reaching Thorim in under 6 minutes, correct. That way, when you start the fight with him, Sif is still alive. You must be on 25 man to get this particular piece.
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    If a building's about to collapse, you can debate whether it's better to demolish it or repair it, and you can make political-agenda arguments either way. Disputing gravity itself to claim it won't fall down is not a political position, it's just ignorance.

  3. #3
    Mechagnome Shedi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    504
    That item only drops from the Hard mode version of the encounter, so you have to finish the Gauntlet before Sif disappears.

    <Avalerion> - Top EU 6 hours per week raiding guild (14/14HC) recruiting for Mythic!

  4. #4
    The Patient Lombra's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    203
    Back then 25 man was actually labeled heroic mode, and 10 man normal mode, but no, Ulduar has no modes that we today refer to as heroic. Hard mode refers to defeating the encounter in a specific way, that you get more/different loot. For Thorim, hard mode means reaching him within a certain amount of time (before Sif goes away). Hard mode (at least in Ulduar, not sure about other raids) should only mean additional loot though. You still get as much normal loot.
    You must come with me, young ones, for I am the grim reaper.

    Defias Brotherhood-EU

  5. #5
    There is no heroic mode in ulduar (it used to be that 25-man mode was called heroic). Instead there were hard modes, something in the fight that had to be activated or achieved that would make the fight harder and drop better loot. In the case of thorim the team in the corridor needs to get through it at a certain speed, which made the fight harder. at level 90 it should be very easy to do.

    http://www.wowhead.com/achievement=2978 <- is the achievement for activating hard mode thorim. If you get that achievement when the person doing the corridor gets to the end, you did it right.
    http://www.wowhead.com/achievement=3183 <- is the achievement for beating hard mode
    http://www.wowhead.com/achievement=2958 <- is the meta achievement that has hard mode achievements for all bosses that have a hard mode (some of them don't)

    Needless to say, that system never made it to the next tier...
    I don't think this matters nearly as much as you think it does.

  6. #6
    I see, thanks for the speedy replies guys, so the chest has a chance to drop regardless of if i make it to thorim in 6 minutes or less, as long as i run in 25 man mode, am i right?

  7. #7
    Legendary! Spl4sh3r's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    6,734
    First of all, why are people saying that 25-man back in the day were refered to as Heroic? It wasn't.

    As for the chest, you have to do it within 6 minutes on 25man for it to drop. You can easily see it on wowhead since the chest piece is one of the pieces with highest ilvl. Higher ilvl means it dropped from hardmode.

    239 = 25man Hardmode
    232 = 10man Hardmode
    226 = 25man Normal
    219 = 10man Normal

  8. #8
    Warchief Akraen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    SC, USA
    Posts
    2,130
    Damn I've been playing for too many years.

    When you notice new generations come in not knowing how past tiers worked. I had over 500 days played back then, even.

  9. #9
    The Patient Lombra's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    203
    No. It is a hard mode drop. It can't drop if you don't reach him in time. Ulduar 25 normal loot is lv 226 (or 232 for weapons I think). Wowhead doesn't really label hard mode loot I guess. Check the comments or know which item levels are relevant.
    You must come with me, young ones, for I am the grim reaper.

    Defias Brotherhood-EU

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Spl4sh3r View Post
    First of all, why are people saying that 25-man back in the day were refered to as Heroic? It wasn't.

    As for the chest, you have to do it within 6 minutes on 25man for it to drop. You can easily see it on wowhead since the chest piece is one of the pieces with highest ilvl. Higher ilvl means it dropped from hardmode.

    239 = 25man Hardmode
    232 = 10man Hardmode
    226 = 25man Normal
    219 = 10man Normal
    Ahem when WotLK was first announced they said 10 man raiding = normal mode
    25 man raiding = Heroic mode

    but then when people were going crazy for the ulduar hard modes they ADDED a heroic mode specifically in Trial of the Crusader where you had 10/25 norm mode and 10/25 heroic mode if in doubt pull up the world first kills and youll find it WAY back for heroic naxx
    Those who want never get....those who get never need....and those who need get sweet FA

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Spl4sh3r View Post
    First of all, why are people saying that 25-man back in the day were refered to as Heroic? It wasn't.
    Um, yeah... it was. For Naxx, OS, EoE and Ulduar, Blizzard referred to 25-man as heroic and 10-man, normal. When ToC was released, Blizzard implemented heroic modes as we know them today because they weren't happy with the hard mode design in Ulduar.

    Get your facts straight.

    Quote Originally Posted by WoWWiki
    It is recommended new groups tackle this quarter last. Patchwerk is a considerable healer test on Heroic difficulty and Thaddius is a considerable DPS check on Heroic difficulty. The trash clear to Patchwerk is long but Grobbulus and Thaddius have short clears. Gluth has no trash whatsoever.
    Naxxramas

    Obliterated.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Spl4sh3r View Post
    First of all, why are people saying that 25-man back in the day were refered to as Heroic? It wasn't.
    Yes it was.

  13. #13
    Mechagnome Yells's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    South Korea
    Posts
    505
    Quote Originally Posted by Spl4sh3r View Post
    First of all, why are people saying that 25-man back in the day were refered to as Heroic? It wasn't.

    As for the chest, you have to do it within 6 minutes on 25man for it to drop. You can easily see it on wowhead since the chest piece is one of the pieces with highest ilvl. Higher ilvl means it dropped from hardmode.

    239 = 25man Hardmode
    232 = 10man Hardmode
    226 = 25man Normal
    219 = 10man Normal
    For Nax and Uld it most certainly was 25=heroic 10=normal. Even the achievements were labeled that way.

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...iippy/advanced
    I'd prefer my orcs to stand up straight.

  14. #14
    You can read the old wowhead comments, up until ToC heroic = 25 normal = 10.

  15. #15
    nvm........
    Last edited by Pacer; 2013-12-24 at 11:43 PM.

  16. #16
    "Heroic" only existed in 5m dungeons, until ToC when a split between 10/25 normal and hc (so 4 types) was first introduced. Before that, there was a splits between 10 and 25m raiding existed but neither was referred to as 'heroic'.

    So, if you think 'heroic raiding' existed before ToC, you are simply wrong. The closest thing was the hardmodes in Ulduar, which were not actually different fights but offered different loot depending on how you completed the encounter. And those still were not referred to as heroic, but as 'hard mode'.

    For those talking about 'just look at wowhead comments'.... What wowhead comments do you see that refer to heroic raiding pre-ToC? Because I can't seem to find any that were made BEFORE introduction of ToC. Not that I would expect any. None of the achievements refer to 'heroic' raiding either, but to '25-player mode'. See for example http://www.wowhead.com/achievement=1402#comments

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Callypso View Post
    "Heroic" only existed in 5m dungeons, until ToC when a split between 10/25 normal and hc (so 4 types) was first introduced. Before that, there was a splits between 10 and 25m raiding existed but neither was referred to as 'heroic'.

    So, if you think 'heroic raiding' existed before ToC, you are simply wrong. The closest thing was the hardmodes in Ulduar, which were not actually different fights but offered different loot depending on how you completed the encounter. And those still were not referred to as heroic, but as 'hard mode'. - -
    [/url]
    Unfortunatelly you are wrong. You can easily verify this by looking at old videos. 25-man kills are refered as heroic kills. E.g. Heroic mimiron - firefighter by Exdous.

    Quote Originally Posted by Spl4sh3r View Post
    239 = 25man Hardmode
    232 = 10man Hardmode
    226 = 25man Normal
    219 = 10man Normal
    This is quite right expect weapons were 232 from 10man hardmode and 25man normal mode. Other 10man hardmode items were 226 ilevel. Kinda confusing now that I think about it.

    Quote Originally Posted by hatethisbit View Post
    I'm currently farming the terrorblade recolour in ulduar 25 but i have only just found a friend to help me kill thorim, could somebody explain to me which mode http://www.wowhead.com/item=45473 drops in? I've read conflicting info, some say hard mode which i BELIEVE is getting to thorim in under 6 minutes, correct? Wowhead says NORMAL mode, does this mean I have to wait out a whole 6 minutes before i get to thorim?
    Is 25 man classed as heroic? So confusing!
    That item is deffinetely 25 hard mode item. Even if it was normal mode 25man item, you would get it if you killed hard mode. There's no point really skipping hard mode just to get specific loot as you get more items from hardmode and it won't exclude any items from normal mode loot table
    Last edited by luc54; 2013-12-24 at 05:05 PM.

  18. #18
    Pandaren Monk Of-the-horde's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Frankfurt am Main
    Posts
    1,928
    Quote Originally Posted by Spl4sh3r View Post
    First of all, why are people saying that 25-man back in the day were refered to as Heroic? It wasn't.

    As for the chest, you have to do it within 6 minutes on 25man for it to drop. You can easily see it on wowhead since the chest piece is one of the pieces with highest ilvl. Higher ilvl means it dropped from hardmode.

    239 = 25man Hardmode
    232 = 10man Hardmode
    226 = 25man Normal
    219 = 10man Normal
    If you had played the game back then you would have known. 25 was HEROIC.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Callypso View Post
    "Heroic" only existed in 5m dungeons, until ToC when a split between 10/25 normal and hc (so 4 types) was first introduced. Before that, there was a splits between 10 and 25m raiding existed but neither was referred to as 'heroic'.

    So, if you think 'heroic raiding' existed before ToC, you are simply wrong. The closest thing was the hardmodes in Ulduar, which were not actually different fights but offered different loot depending on how you completed the encounter. And those still were not referred to as heroic, but as 'hard mode'.

    For those talking about 'just look at wowhead comments'.... What wowhead comments do you see that refer to heroic raiding pre-ToC? Because I can't seem to find any that were made BEFORE introduction of ToC. Not that I would expect any. None of the achievements refer to 'heroic' raiding either, but to '25-player mode'. See for example http://www.wowhead.com/achievement=1402#comments

  19. #19
    Mechagnome Shedi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    504
    Quote Originally Posted by Callypso View Post
    "Heroic" only existed in 5m dungeons, until ToC when a split between 10/25 normal and hc (so 4 types) was first introduced. Before that, there was a splits between 10 and 25m raiding existed but neither was referred to as 'heroic'.

    So, if you think 'heroic raiding' existed before ToC, you are simply wrong. The closest thing was the hardmodes in Ulduar, which were not actually different fights but offered different loot depending on how you completed the encounter. And those still were not referred to as heroic, but as 'hard mode'.

    For those talking about 'just look at wowhead comments'.... What wowhead comments do you see that refer to heroic raiding pre-ToC? Because I can't seem to find any that were made BEFORE introduction of ToC. Not that I would expect any. None of the achievements refer to 'heroic' raiding either, but to '25-player mode'. See for example http://www.wowhead.com/achievement=1402#comments
    The achievement texts have been changed, they used to say Heroic instead of 25-player.

    <Avalerion> - Top EU 6 hours per week raiding guild (14/14HC) recruiting for Mythic!

  20. #20
    "Before Patch 3.2.0, Heroic mode raids, unlike their instance counterparts, did not dictate difficulty. Instead 10-player raids were considered "normal" mode, and 25-player raids to be "heroic". Heroic raids are not intended to be "harder" than the 10-player version of the same raid, instead simply tuned for the larger number of players. Heroic raids do still drop higher quality equipment than the normal-mode counterparts, by the logic that it is more difficult to form a good 25-player group. The currency tokens dropped in each mode can be used to buy items of similar quality to the boss-dropped items."

    inb4 lolwowwiki...

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •