View Poll Results: Do you think the rewards you get satisfy/justif the effort put in to acquiering them?

Voters
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  • Yes! I love my vanity items!

    123 70.29%
  • No, vanity items doesn't satisfy my needs!

    52 29.71%
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  1. #1

    Thumbs down Progeression & WoW, the sad truth...

    This is just my opinion, but i think it is sad that a game like WoW offers almost no progression after you completed main quests, raids, professions, (you get the point), in other words the state MoP is in now.
    The only real thing we can keep as a PERMANENT REWARD are the VANITY ITEMS, except a few, (pets, mounts, items, SoO Looms, transmog), meaby gold for some, and this makes me a bit sad that a huge game like WoW has nothing more to offer, and for many these "things" are useless!.

    Players put so much effort & grind in acquiring the current "top" items, witch renders almost useless after the current patch/expansion has passed.
    Come on Blizz, VANITY ITEMS, srsly?

    Edit: I think many voters vote YES on the poll because they have poured so much money in to their mounts & other vanity items. The poll was meant to be targeted at rewards you get in game, not things you buy with real money, sry for not clarifying that in the poll!
    Last edited by Yygers; 2013-12-23 at 10:36 AM.

  2. #2
    Scarab Lord roahn the warlock's Avatar
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    main quests, raids, professions, achievements, brawlers, pvp, roleplaying. You mean the game?
    It was never Hardcore Vs Casual. It was Socialites Vs. Solo players

  3. #3
    What would you like instead as a form of progression?

    If you have a complaint, it's always nice to offer a possible solution instead of just "I DON'T LIKE THING."

    The way I see it, aside from collectibles and achievements like we can obtain now, something like "Paragon Levels" is the only "permanent" form of level-cap progression that isn't one of the things Warcraft already has that comes to mind, and even that would be "reset" with a new expansion.

    I mean, I like collecting dyes in Guild Wars 2, but that's just vanity items.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by roahn the warlock View Post
    main quests, raids, professions, achievements, brawlers, pvp, roleplaying. You mean the game?
    Yes i MEAN the game World of Warcraft..

  5. #5
    What would you like them to do? I think that they are at a good spot right now.
    I would not mind a little more to do (outside of raids), but I think they are working on it, and that garrisons will help with that.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Daetur View Post
    What would you like instead as a form of progression?

    If you have a complaint, it's always nice to offer a possible solution instead of just "I DON'T LIKE THING."

    The way I see it, aside from collectibles and achievements like we can obtain now, something like "Paragon Levels" is the only "permanent" form of level-cap progression that isn't one of the things Warcraft already has that comes to mind, and even that would be "reset" with a new expansion.
    I'm not a game designer so i bet my opinions about what the game would need aren't that good, but something that felt like you really got some "bang out of the buck" you put in that is not useless would be a good thing imo.

    Paragon levels would be a cool thing, there would be a way to actually make your character better at something, make it feel more powerful, a good idea i might add

  7. #7
    Inevitable and unavoidable consequence of the end-game not remaining as the end-game.
    At least there are options now through transmog to offer some value to gear which otherwise might not have had any beyond vendoring/disenchanting.

    What else would you suggest if not cosmetic items ?
    Wow has always had useless items, including any item of gear that is replaced by an upgrade.
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  8. #8
    Gear isn't really seen as the reward for most raiders. It's seen as a means to progress through harder content.

  9. #9
    If they fix the PvP CC issues this won't be a problem as more people will enjoy it again, and it rarely gets stale (when you're not spending 75% of your time in CC )

    Well, its always been the "grease" that fills any time I ever have when I'm bored (read: can't decide which of the things I want to do most ;p)
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  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by lunchbox2042 View Post
    Gear isn't really seen as the reward for most raiders. It's seen as a means to progress through harder content.
    No matter how it is viewed by the players, gear is a real reward for killing bosses.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Yygers View Post
    I'm not a game designer so i bet my opinions about what the game would need aren't that good, but something that felt like you really got some "bang out of the buck" you put in that is not useless would be a good thing imo.

    Paragon levels would be a cool thing, there would be a way to actually make your character better at something, make it feel more powerful, a good idea i might add
    Paragon levels are just like normal levels without a number attached. They have a finite limit, so when new Paragon levels or new regular levels get added, they're invalidated much like gear. They're "just" a mandatory grind.

    It's very important to express what you think a solution would be.
    What do you feel like is missing? What do you think would be something non-cosmetic and non-achievement that wouldn't be replaced, diminished, or invalidated at the start of a new expansion that they could implement as a form of progression?
    Last edited by Daetur; 2013-12-22 at 04:47 AM.

  12. #12
    Pandaren Monk
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    No, I get you OP, I do, nothing hurts worse than trading in those hard won heroic 25 gears for quest greens within one moment of stepping off the boat into a new xpac.
    But you know what's even worse?
    When you never change your gear b/c you have best in slot. Sure it's the best, but you want an upgrade...you know, so you can 'progress'.
    Now imagine a best in slot that stayed over the course of many xpacs.
    SUPER boring.
    If progression was not reset every xpac, that's kind of what we'd be looking at...going by the perma progress ideals anyhow.
    I don't feel as burnt by that gear reset in pve as much as I do in pvp, every season it's the same shit, grind honor, get honor gear, grind arena, get arena gear, reset, repeat.
    I dunno, some days it's a drag, some days I love it.
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  13. #13
    WOW has a lot of silly issues but I don't really consider this to be one of them.

    I mean you're supposed to replace all your gear as time goes on and constantly have to work to get new and better stuff because if you could just get the best stuff and that be the end of it, you'd have nowhere to go. You'd hit your peak and then get bored as you could no longer get stronger. Having to constantly replace your junk to improve is very important.

    It would be nice to be able to keep certain things you worked hard for and upgrade them to more current standards, but honestly transmog basically does that but without all the hullabaloo. You don't have to upgrade your quel'delar to current standards because you can get a wep that already has those stats and make it look like your quel'delar and it accomplishes the exact same thing as being able to upgrade your old gear. It is a shame you can't do it to legendaries, which kind of sucks, but at the same time you'd see so many people running around with warglaives they farmed up at level 90 it would kind of suck.
    I like ponies and I really don't care what you have to say about that.

  14. #14
    If I look back, yes I got absolutely nothing out of clearing Raden pre-5.4. He should have dropped something we'd keep forever, like a mount, cool vanity item, etc. something that remains unavailable after the content is no longer relevant. As far as gear goes, it's a means to make the content you're raiding easier, and for a small amount of time the next tier of content (or leveling) easier to start with, not a permanent reward, and I am personally fine with that.

    I do wish they'd make sure the end boss of every tier dropped something worth keeping.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Daetur View Post
    Paragon levels are just like normal levels without a number attached. They have a finite limit, so when new Paragon levels or new regular levels get added, they're invalidated much like gear. They're "just" a mandatory grind.

    It's very important to express what you think a solution would be.
    What do you feel like is missing? What do you think would be something non-cosmetic and non-achievement that wouldn't be replaced, diminished, or invalidated at the start of a new expansion that they could implement as a form of progression?
    They could make unlimited paragon levels with a exponential XP curve that made it ALMOST impossible to go over a hypothetical limit? As i said im not a game designer and i bet my ideas are far from the developers, that's why i'm careful to make suggestions about what the game needs.

    But, a way to improve your character (meaby a new stat of some sort?), something that made you feel your character actually got better without it being a mandatory thing (min/max)?

    From mpov, there are allot of things they could do, but that doesn't mean the game actually would benefit from it. Like i said, i'm not a game designer, that is up to them to come up with.

  16. #16
    kor kron wolf seems pretty vanity since it wont be able ot get 6.0

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Yygers View Post
    They could make unlimited paragon levels with a exponential XP curve that made it ALMOST impossible to go over a hypothetical limit? As i said im not a game designer and i bet my ideas are far from the developers, that's why i'm careful to make suggestions about what the game needs.

    But, a way to improve your character (meaby a new stat of some sort?), something that made you feel your character actually got better without it being a mandatory thing (min/max)?

    From mpov, there are allot of things they could do, but that doesn't mean the game actually would benefit from it. Like i said, i'm not a game designer, that is up to them to come up with.
    You can't break min/maxers with how the end game is setup to focus on individual performance and hard numbers. You'd need more randomness in raid encounters like a random ability the boss gains. Getting players to accept that type of randomness in encounters will draw complaints as well. The playerbase in WoW expects or always looks for a certain path to victory. Once that is done then guides appear for classes, raids, pvp, etc to help other people get on that path.
    Last edited by Barnabas; 2013-12-22 at 07:35 AM.

  18. #18
    You basically just said, "There's nothing to do in this game but the game." If you don't like what WoW has to offer, gtfo. There are tons of things to do in this game, especially compared to many other P2P MMOs. There are many ways to progress your characters besides raiding and PvP. Progression doesn't always mean 'making better', it can mean making 'more complete'. Find patterns you don't have. Pets. Mounts. Farm transmog gear. Do scenarios and aim for Gold. Do achievements. Get all of your non-combat pets to 25. Catch all rares in the wild. Fuck dude, the list goes on. What the hell else are you wanting?

    Usefulness and uselessness are choices. Something you may find useless, someone else may strive for. You may hate raiding and love PvP, someone else maybe be the opposite. I personally never understood people who spend countless hours burning themselves out trying to do heroic raids, only to have to replace their hard-earned epics with quest greens and new dungeon blues within a few months when the next expansion hits. But again, that's just me. They obviously feel it's worth the time and the effort, more power to them.
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  19. #19
    I'm seriously confused what else could be added. WoW has been at the forefront of MMO expansion ideas. Yes, other MMo's have had new thoughts and new processes, which Blizzard has accepted as something that is needed to move forward (LFD, area loot, etc..) but people seem to want something completely new from a MMO that's nearly a decade old. For Blizzard to keep this game viable, not only graphics, interface, ,but also story line for several million people, is nothing short of complete success with their business model. Is it perfect? No. Is it the best out there? Yes. No matter what people say, this game offers the most complete package overall. Complaining that this game has everything that other MMo's have yet does them right and sets the standard just doesn't make sense to me....
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  20. #20
    Beating the content is supposed to be the reward for progression raiding... that's why the difficulty and snowflake syndrome is such a sticking issue.
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