Thread: MoP CM BiS-list

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  1. #181
    Your chest is also really bad. Even if you don't have access to the spoils one, there is a lot of better options (T16 shadow, T15 heal, Primordius, the 463 from SPM...)

    For your gloves and If you are farming the Megaera bracers, there is a pretty decent alternative that drop off Tortos.

  2. #182
    http://www.wowhead.com/item=104642 is a good alternative for hunters that dont run with engineering. same agility as the engi helm ( with a deadly socket) and only 99 secondary stats loss.

  3. #183
    High Overlord Iapetus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lyrov View Post
    why would you
    Because autocorrect changes "from" into "for" sometimes.

    I've been meaning to farm ToT more but I can that place so many times on my other toons I can't bring myself to do it. And I'm feeling pretty good about my current gear. Yes it could be better, and I still plan on farming the rest of my BiS gear, but I was pleased with my performance last time in CMs and my gear has improved a lot from that point.

    I'm a little confused by the note on the Disc page that says "Acquire this from LFR to reduce the amount of hit this item would give you." Doesn't iLvl (and thus the difficulty the item was acquired from) not matter? If I had a double upgraded heroic warforged helm and an LFR version of the same helm wouldn't they have identical stats in CMs?
    Quote Originally Posted by Nixx View Post
    That's how it starts. Next thing you know it's 3am and people are still being wrong.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shamanic View Post
    The fact that he's chirping means he's a male, and he's chirping because he wants sexy times, which he's obviously not going to get.

  4. #184
    Quote Originally Posted by Iapetus View Post
    I'm a little confused by the note on the Disc page that says "Acquire this from LFR to reduce the amount of hit this item would give you." Doesn't iLvl (and thus the difficulty the item was acquired from) not matter? If I had a double upgraded heroic warforged helm and an LFR version of the same helm wouldn't they have identical stats in CMs?
    Hit/Exp is not scaled down in a challenge mode, as a Disc priest, you are already given a 15% hit chance as a passive, and since those legs give hit, you will lose out on other secondary stats to compensate for having the hit, so to reduce the amount you lose, its best to obtain the item from LFR so the amount of hit it has is lessened which in turn, reduces the amount of haste/crit you would lose from having it.

  5. #185
    Quote Originally Posted by Iapetus View Post
    I'm a little confused by the note on the Disc page that says "Acquire this from LFR to reduce the amount of hit this item would give you." Doesn't iLvl (and thus the difficulty the item was acquired from) not matter? If I had a double upgraded heroic warforged helm and an LFR version of the same helm wouldn't they have identical stats in CMs?
    This is only true with hit/exp pieces of gear for hybrid class. Concretely, if you have any hit or expertise on your gear as a healer, the game considers the excess hit as budgeted stat, so the more excess stat you have the more your total haste/crit/mastery will be lowered.

    In other words, if you have a LFR leggings you will lose 326 secondary stats, instead of 542 with a heroic tf 2/2. That loss is fine if you have the 502 item but you probably better go with Leggings of the Exorcist if you don't.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by darktemplaru View Post
    http://www.wowhead.com/item=104642 is a good alternative for hunters that dont run with engineering. same agility as the engi helm ( with a deadly socket) and only 99 secondary stats loss.
    http://www.wowhead.com/item=81105 is better tho.

  6. #186
    High Overlord Iapetus's Avatar
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    Ooh, cool. Didn't know that. Luckily my legs are from LFR so I'm in the clear.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nixx View Post
    That's how it starts. Next thing you know it's 3am and people are still being wrong.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shamanic View Post
    The fact that he's chirping means he's a male, and he's chirping because he wants sexy times, which he's obviously not going to get.

  7. #187
    1) I'm a bit confused by the total Intellect values. Let's take the Mage sheet, total Int is ~17140 it says. Unbuffed with BiS list equipped inside a CM I have 14431 int, excluding Stat buff and flask + food.

    2) I was wondering for those who don't use the engineering neck whether the healer metagem (324 int) is better than the 216 int + 3% crit effect metagem?

  8. #188
    Quote Originally Posted by Kathos View Post
    1) I'm a bit confused by the total Intellect values. Let's take the Mage sheet, total Int is ~17140 it says. Unbuffed with BiS list equipped inside a CM I have 14431 int, excluding Stat buff and flask + food.

    2) I was wondering for those who don't use the engineering neck whether the healer metagem (324 int) is better than the 216 int + 3% crit effect metagem?
    it explicitly says at the bottom that the intellect value is fully buffed...

  9. #189
    Quote Originally Posted by Lyrov View Post
    it explicitly says at the bottom that the intellect value is fully buffed...
    I thought it was self explanatory that Stats buff + Int flask + 300 food doesn't make up for the 2709 intellect gap...

    Got 16586 int fully buffed.

  10. #190
    literally either you're not bis or your math is working out disgustingly badly
    Last edited by Lyrov; 2014-05-24 at 06:30 PM.

  11. #191
    the list is wrong for the hunter weapon drop location. the durumu weapon does drop from durumu, not from iron quon

  12. #192
    Quote Originally Posted by veronimus View Post
    the list is wrong for the hunter weapon drop location. the durumu weapon does drop from durumu, not from iron quon
    Thanks! Fixed it

  13. #193
    Hey,

    I'd like to know the stat weight you used for Disc sheet. I assume you value Int > 2*crit since you gem for it but what about crit and haste is there a huge gap between these two? And from where you get these numbers?

    Your sheet is fine but i'm always interested in what's behind and be able to understand the choices.

    Thanks

  14. #194
    Quote Originally Posted by pinpinpula View Post
    Hey,

    I'd like to know the stat weight you used for Disc sheet. I assume you value Int > 2*crit since you gem for it but what about crit and haste is there a huge gap between these two? And from where you get these numbers?

    Your sheet is fine but i'm always interested in what's behind and be able to understand the choices.

    Thanks
    The gap is pretty big between crit & haste purely because crit just gives way more hps and dps.

    You already have a lot of haste buffs when you'll need it and gemming for haste wont really give you anything.

  15. #195
    Quote Originally Posted by Xariah View Post
    The gap is pretty big between crit & haste purely because crit just gives way more hps and dps.

    You already have a lot of haste buffs when you'll need it and gemming for haste wont really give you anything.
    Ok so is it huge enough to prefer Blossom of Pure Snow over the Valor trinket? Blossom gives a bit less in average but if the gap is huge its fine, considering that you also got more control over the proc and you can line it with Mindbender.

    Blossom of Pure Snow avg 705 crit
    Valor avg 923 haste (at max uptime)

    As I understand your word, a pretty big gap for me is something like twice the value. Thus if you only consider proc averaged value Blossom > Valor with 1 crit / 0.7 haste stat weights

    Same thing for rings, with Int 2, Crit 1 and Haste 0.7

    Iron Qon rings become better than Shado-pan assault one.
    Last edited by pinpinpula; 2014-06-04 at 06:50 PM.

  16. #196
    Blossom will not line up with your 2nd trinket which would be the darkmoon one, and haste is not terrible it's still good but not worth gemming / reforging for over crit. You already have so much haste from other stuff like Berserking / Hero / PI (when you use it) so it's just useless to reforge / gem for any haste at all over crit obviously because you still want to go haste over mastery & spirit. And more crit = more Divine Aegis and that means you can literally just dps all the time.

    For the Iron qon ring it's pretty much what you prefer I am using the Durumu ring myself and having wasted spirit but 1 socket + crit instead of crit haste without a socket. This goes for the Lei shen neck too and some other items. It's pretty much up to what you prefer yourself.

    And the trinket will put your gloves on CD which is pretty bad.
    Last edited by Xariah; 2014-06-04 at 11:49 PM.

  17. #197
    Grunt Whiterock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xariah View Post
    Blossom will not line up with your 2nd trinket which would be the darkmoon one, and haste is not terrible it's still good but not worth gemming / reforging for over crit. You already have so much haste from other stuff like Berserking / Hero / PI (when you use it) so it's just useless to reforge / gem for any haste at all over crit obviously because you still want to go haste over mastery & spirit. And more crit = more Divine Aegis and that means you can literally just dps all the time.

    For the Iron qon ring it's pretty much what you prefer I am using the Durumu ring myself and having wasted spirit but 1 socket + crit instead of crit haste without a socket. This goes for the Lei shen neck too and some other items. It's pretty much up to what you prefer yourself.

    And the trinket will put your gloves on CD which is pretty bad.
    The thing about weighting Crit and Haste is not about which you should gem/etc, Crit is obviously better, the question is - the effectivness of Haste compared to Intellect, when there is aviability of Crit/Haste item or Crit+something item that have 1 more socket. Like in example of rings.

    I myslef perfer using 2 build focuses, one with 100/80 weight and one with 100/50 weight depending if one perfer to have more Intellect or Haste.
    Last edited by Whiterock; 2014-06-05 at 07:45 PM.

  18. #198
    A very nice list of items, gave me some ideas for my own CM Gear.

    I'm curious if anyone knows about the scaling and how the stat budget works? Now I am aware that set-bonuses won't work inside CM and I thought that a piece of gear that had a set-bonus might have a slightly lowered stat budget because of it. I have however found no consistency to prove this. When i looked for BiS gear for myself for CM i used the following link when comparing items:

    Insert the following after wowhead.com
    /items=4.3?filter=sl=5;minle=463;maxle=572;ub=3;cr=80:21:100;crs=7:1:1;crv=0:1:2
    (feel free to adjust to your class, your armor type and primary stat)

    This search string in particular brings out any mail chest-piece, ilvl 463-572, for hunters, with agility and more than 2 sockets. When browsing and bringing out the 5 most interesting ones (T16 Tunic of the Unblinking Vigil, T15 Saurok Stalker's Tunic, Scales of Shaped Flesh - Ra-den, Chestguard of Relentless Tyranny - Garrosh and Ancient Archer's Chestguard - Spoils) in tabs and scaling them down to Challenge mode (463) shows the first 3 with 659 agility and the latter 2 with 739 agility. My final opinion is probably along OP's line with Ancient Archer's Chestguard as BiS.

    I found the same thing with weapons (i personally first thought the heirloom weapon would be superior but that wasn't the case) Voice of Quilen has a higher agility budget than any other ranged weapon at ilvl 463 with 2 sockets (eye of the black prince).

    Boots, I would say Dreadrunner Sabatons instead of the boots from Ra-den (2 red sockets)

    For trinket #2 if not alchemist, the Assurance of Consequence is a really nice choice. CD reduction and with an ICD. (not RPPM)

    Someone here already mentioned the Swarmcall Helm, really nice one, didnt see that myself, thanks.

    Shoulders made no difference in base agility, neither did gloves imo, go with tier 16 gloves or whatever has red sockets

    One final opinion from me would be to change one ring if you really want to go all out min-maxing with Ra-Den's Swift Seal which has a socket bonus with agility making it slightly more desirable than Reality Ripper Ring.

    Hope this helps someone!

  19. #199
    Quote Originally Posted by rydan View Post
    Boots, I would say Dreadrunner Sabatons instead of the boots from Ra-den (2 red sockets)
    You win 40agi / 120mastery / 183hit, but at a cost of 481crit. That's too much in my opinion, even if considering that agi is x4 superior to crit (and that's far from true), Raden boots are still better.

  20. #200
    Grunt Whiterock's Avatar
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    @Rydan

    Wowhead's data is accurate for all non-RandomEnchantent gear.

    The stat-budjet is fixated for every item of every type, but there are indeed some items stand off, such as:
    -Some weapons from Throne of Thunder that have +80main stat at cost of 80 stamina
    -Some gloves with 1 socket (think it was cloth or mail ones) had 80 more mainstat
    -Headless Horseman helm has loads of bonus strength at cost of stamina and crit/hit.
    -Those Agility chests you meantioned, have 80 more agility.
    -And as side note - Some of SoO gear scales with ilvl non-linear, aka for most items the secondary stat ratio stays the same on any ilvl, but for some of those (mainly rings) - ratio changes.

    As for boots - don't forget that crafted 2socket ones have 120mastery as bonus, while Ra-den have 120 mainstat, as Kylael mentioned.

    Edit: oh, and don't forget that 458 gear (such as alch trinket) do count in The upgrade brings them above 463

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