PvP in this game is TERRIBLE - changes I would like to see in WoD

[Itisamuh]

Why do people still not understand that you can make or buy Crafted PVP Gear? It seems every idiot who levels their Character thinks that there is no entry level gear. 10 Minute ques btw? What Faction? Horde us 4-5 Mins and Alliance is 1 Min. Take them less seriously and they are more fun. Or ask a friend to do arena with you?

Want my honest opinion? Timeless Isle Gear shouldn't exist, and neither should Base Resilience, which should be on Gear. PVP has a Catch Up System. Check your Conquest Cap. 15,200 for me, which is great compared to Wrath and Cataclysm. Gear isn't hard to get started in BGs, especially when World Bosses drop half of it as well.

Try playing an Elemental Shaman in Random BGs. Out of all the Character's I've leveled the most frustrating/useless thing I've ever seen even with some Gear. Hunter isn't too bad to play.

Crafted gear is ridiculously expensive. Queues are in fact around ten minutes long for Horde, while instant for Alliance. Arena is no fun for many because of the lack of a solo queue option, plus needing to already have decent gear to do well. People understand these things quite well, and you probably should too.

[DingDongKing]

1. You can't make separate bgs for people with good gear and people with bad gear. The good bgs will have insane queues and the shit bgs will have very short queues, thus the situation will continue to upset people and won't really solve anything.
a) pvp in this game is a team effort. In rbgs, a player going "lone wolf" isn't helping anything. Also, "lone-wolfing" shouldn't be encouraged, otherwise you get a lot of "coolkids" going rambo and getting smashed while the opponent owns everything because it doesn't divide its forces.
b) and c) are impossible to asess by a computer system.

How did you jump from nr.2 straight to nr.4 ?

4. Ultimately useless. Someone could just be near the computer for 1 min till the bg begins and will input the correct capcha and then go fap while the game plays with his bot.

6. Plenty of people do arenas just for cap (provided you're not on a dead served). Failing to find someone in the trade chat, you can always download and use oqueue (which will be implemented by Blizzard soon, it's only logical). If you're any good at that, your rating will go up whether you like or not and then maybe you can find a partner for serious arena for rating.

What would you suggest regarding the gear gap? Maybe a Glory Level? Players within a Glory Bracket are put in similar queues. A premade with varying Glory Levels has the average taken and things go from there. Regarding the botting, yep. They can easily do that, but the truth is something needs to be done IF it is a genuinely troubling issue.

Regarding Arenas for cap, I don't particularly buy into it. For me Arenas should be about competitive play, not closing a gear cap or a system for completionists to be happy. Further more, my experience as a beginner is that a lot of people playing Arenas have absolutely no interest in helping out their team mates with advice.

They're more than happy to quit and chase rating with someone else as they choose and also just find someone else to carry them to a cap. It's not to say having an unrated queue will magically solve those problems, but I would hope that it may eliminate the e-peen issues that even 1500 rated players have.

Personally, I'd like to be able to practice Arenas without being showered with abuse because I'm a beginner who's still figure his way through things. The only way I can achieve that is by relentless practice. But having a 'rating' hanging over prospective partner isn't going to make such practice entirely possible.

[PPN]

You think the PvP is terrible because of the gear treadmill? Wait until you get full Conquest gear. You're still going to get owned in a split second while chain controlled. Now that's something to complain about. The gear system is the least of this game's PvP problems.

Yeah wait until you are full geared... Its gona be worse then not having gear asap. Even as hunter you play on the sunny side, so maybe it wont be so nad for you

And yes , just get timeless pve gear, make isle of thunder dailies, kill the rares, get the blue stam trinket from ah and you look like dangerous... Team up with a class so they leave you alone (any caster besides frostmage) and do some painfull 2s to get cqps. All comps will faceroll the caster abd you will freeshoot

[Deleted]

Personally, I'd like to be able to practice Arenas without being showered with abuse because I'm a beginner who's still figure his way through things. The only way I can achieve that is by relentless practice. But having a 'rating' hanging over prospective partner isn't going to make such practice entirely possible.

Incorrect. Advertising in trade "LF partner for cap" is very unlikely to get the attention of a "pro" who will get upset if you fail. You can do that even if you don't need the cap, for as long as you want. These cappers aren't interested in ratings and will likely be just other people who aren't good geared or even interested in serious arenas. You can also use oqueue, again.

[skyclops]

Do wintergrasp which works out with quests roughly 500 honor
And tol barad roughly 600 honor with quest

[Maggibesti]

You think the PvP is terrible because of the gear treadmill? Wait until you get full Conquest gear. You're still going to get owned in a split second while chain controlled. Now that's something to complain about. The gear system is the least of this game's PvP problems.

Haha exactly. Sometimes I do arenas where I can't even move and my partner too, and I'm a monk so I can escape 2 CC, yet I'm CC'd for entire game. One CC after another, seems endless. In WoD all classes should have 1 CC each with 5 or 10 minutes cooldown.

[Deleted]

I just leveled my hunter alt to 90 and I decided to focus on PvP (I didn't play serious PvP since TBC) without doing any sort of PvE and because of that I've realised that PvP in WoW is terrible.

Of course when I dinged to 90, my whole equipement was mostly green items so I didn't expect much because I knew that I'll be one-shotted by everyone. So I decided to do some random bgs. In each fight my whole team besides maybe 1-2 people had the same gear as me so we were crushed by the enemy team.

I played almost 10 bgs for about 2-3 hours (10 minutes queues OWN btw), lost them all and now I have less than 1k honor points even that in the meantime I've killed one of the pvp rares in Krasarang Wilds and he gave me 200-300 honor points. My point is that it will take AGES for me to get full PvP gear which is the biggest bullshit I've ever seen. Someone will prodably say that I can buy a boost in arena and get free gear but that's not how it should work.

In PvE you just level an alt to level 90, go to timeless isle, get 496 ilvl gear and you're prepared for the latest content. There should a catch-up mechanic in PvP too.

We all know that in the next expansion we will get a new PvP zone that will last 24/7. So that's how PvP gear should work in WoD imo:

1. Tier 1: Honor Points gear - each item is sold for around 200-300 honor points so you can easily farm this amount and get your PvP gear straight away.
2. Tier 2: Conquest Points gear - you get those points from arenas but also every won random BG gives you 100, and every lost random BG gives you 50 (because bg is more serious PvP than arena), and rated battlegrounds give you higher amount of conquest points.
3. Tier 3: World PvP zone gear bought by the new currency gained from doing objectives on this island.

I don't know what do you guys think but imo PvP in WoW has to change because right now it's terrible.

I've also made the same topic on official WoW forums so if you support this, write something there so maybe someone from Blizzard will see it: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/9123142323

Learn to play. You little nublet.

[DingDongKing]

Incorrect. Advertising in trade "LF partner for cap" is very unlikely to get the attention of a "pro" who will get upset if you fail. You can do that even if you don't need the cap, for as long as you want. These cappers aren't interested in ratings and will likely be just other people who aren't good geared or even interested in serious arenas. You can also use oqueue, again.

It definitely doesn't attract a pro, but I'd say nine out of ten of the last people I've played with have quit after one loss or just gone berserk when I've made a rookie mistake and left. I don't think people think they need to be pros to have an inflated sense of importance and that their time is being wasted on noobs. For what it's worth oQueue is worse. I've only once found a regular partner, but the guy unsubbed a week or so after we paired.

[Ehrenpanzer]

PVE gear in PVP environment(arena or bg) worths shit and whoever claims it is viable is wrong and knows nothing about PVP. Of course going into a Bg or arena with 553 level PVE gear(scales down of course as you enter the Bg) is much better than entering with PvE green gear but both will not help you at all.
For example, I PvP a lot on my Priest as Disc, I have full Grievous gear and in random Bgs I am overpowered against PvE geared dps. Really, most of the times they can't even break my shield.
PvP power is the most important stat in PvP environment. With 0 PvP power, your heals or your dps is crap. Seriously crap. My Mage is 567 item level PvE geared. I tried to do some Bgs to get me some Honor and I was shocked when my Pyroblasts was criting for 38K. Fireball was hitting for 10K, Scorch for 6K..... seriously guys. With 0 PvP power you may survive for like 10 seconds more if you have good PvE gear but you are useless in PvP.
You want PvP gear fast without getting ganged in Bgs? Do a lot of PvE, scenarios, Hc scenarios, Random Hcs and trade Justice for Honor. Then go buy the Tyranical gear and you are good to go.

Healers (esp disc priests) are just broken beyond belief in regards to pvp..and the usual slapass bandaid "we're looking into it" fixes they tossed out have failed harder then usual.

[aabay123]

We all know that in the next expansion we will get a new PvP zone that will last 24/7. So that's how PvP gear should work in WoD imo:

1. Tier 1: Honor Points gear - each item is sold for around 200-300 honor points so you can easily farm this amount and get your PvP gear straight away.
2. Tier 2: Conquest Points gear - you get those points from arenas but also every won random BG gives you 100, and every lost random BG gives you 50 (because bg is more serious PvP than arena), and rated battlegrounds give you higher amount of conquest points.
3. Tier 3: World PvP zone gear bought by the new currency gained from doing objectives on this island.

Quite frankly, I highly don't agree with any of these. There will be no longevity in the game and people will get bored very very fast. Including myself. Getting honor gear at 200-300 a piece will get me gear capped in litterly 1 hour. That's understandable towards the end of the expansion, but it will make the players that's been around for a long time downright furious. Having honor/conquest gear at that low of a cost wouldn't make you have any kind of feeling or connection with your gear. Blizzard wants you to feel like you've actually earned something.

You did mention that you haven't done any PvP since BC and that's (in my opinion) holding you back by a very large margin. I'm not gonna sit here and suggest on how you should play seeing as you've been active for close to as long as me. But, I will suggest to go to the Timeless Isles and get some starter gear there for PvP. You can also try for a weapon in LFR if possible. Afterwards, download the addon OQ and get a premade team going that can help you out. This game is meant to be played and conquered with friends. Not by yourself.

PvP will be harder then when you once remembered it. People are getting better.

- - - Updated - - -

Healers (esp disc priests) are just broken beyond belief in regards to pvp..and the usual slapass bandaid "we're looking into it" fixes they tossed out have failed harder then usual.

Made a WW monk day one. Solved my problem with priests in general.

[Deleted]

You think the PvP is terrible because of the gear treadmill? Wait until you get full Conquest gear. You're still going to get owned in a split second while chain controlled. Now that's something to complain about. The gear system is the least of this game's PvP problems.

This is the very reason why I stopped PvPing. First they increased the burst in WoTLK, then they added more CC and interrupts in Cata and now in MoP it's a massive clusterf*** where you can be chain cc'd to no end and unable to cast anything non-instant.

[tauntor]

(I didn't play serious PvP since TBC)

This is way you think pvp is horrible. Because you arent good at it.

[Odyseas]

I geared up my hunter in 3 days. I simply flew over to krassarang wilds and farmed the mobs that give honor. You can queue your self in bg's while waiting for the mobs to respawn... Its really a piece of cake to get pvp gear, dont buy any gear from the AH unless you have absurd amounts of gold and you don't care spending some gold to make your life slightly easier. PvP is terrible for large number of other reasons:
1) Warriors being the no 1 choice for every clueless player out there. Absurd amounts of damage, ridiculous mobility and good survivability.
2) Mages might not be as easy as warriors are atm but they arent too far behind. They just pop all their cd's and just spam icelance. Next time you fight a frost mage just notice their unreasonably high burst and the fact that they can tear you appart without having to cast at all.
3) 4Offspec healing is almost as good as mainspec healing.
4) Elemental shamans can do a shitload of damage and a decent amount of heal
5) Shadowpriests are really crappy compared to all the other dps casters
6) If you play against a rogue and a monk in 2v2(healer or dps doesnt matter) you're gonna have a bad time Cant do that while stand and two disarms like a bawss.
7) Literally everyone has at least 2 CC's making it incredibly easy to keep someone CC'ed for an eternity if you are playing a good combo.
8) The damage is just ridiculous in some classes (appart from shadowpriests and aff locks).
9) Hunters can annihilate anything if they use all their CD's and there is no easy way of stopping them appart from trying to LoS them which isnt very effective if they are paired with a class which can slow you indefinitely.
10) World PvP is something that you should not even consider doing if you dont have PvE gear from normal or heroic SoO cz some genius in blizzard thought it was a good idea to give resilience as a base stat and make the stats of a PvP set far inferior compared to PvE sets. You can literally die in less than 5 secs against a really good PvE geared player.

I can keep typing for days if I want to but the point is, there are so many flaws in the PvP system atm that is really not worth it.

[xindralol]

...
I'm not even sure how to respond to that. [re: "because bg is more serious PvP than arena"]

well the thing is success in BGs is to a great extend not skill-based which makes it - in many minds - less 'serious' pvp than arena (just look at self-proclaimed RBG 'hero' balaixxxxx-what's-his-name)
imo pvp in general has gotten worse and worse ever since wotlk for a variety of reasons. now with ghostcrawler gone maybe something will change, though at this point I have my doubts about the very possibility of a 'fix'

[Nuditea]

I just leveled my hunter alt to 90 and I decided to focus on PvP (I didn't play serious PvP since TBC) without doing any sort of PvE and because of that I've realised that PvP in WoW is terrible.

Of course when I dinged to 90, my whole equipement was mostly green items so I didn't expect much because I knew that I'll be one-shotted by everyone. So I decided to do some random bgs. In each fight my whole team besides maybe 1-2 people had the same gear as me so we were crushed by the enemy team.

I played almost 10 bgs for about 2-3 hours (10 minutes queues OWN btw), lost them all and now I have less than 1k honor points even that in the meantime I've killed one of the pvp rares in Krasarang Wilds and he gave me 200-300 honor points. My point is that it will take AGES for me to get full PvP gear which is the biggest bullshit I've ever seen. Someone will prodably say that I can buy a boost in arena and get free gear but that's not how it should work.

In PvE you just level an alt to level 90, go to timeless isle, get 496 ilvl gear and you're prepared for the latest content. There should a catch-up mechanic in PvP too.

We all know that in the next expansion we will get a new PvP zone that will last 24/7. So that's how PvP gear should work in WoD imo:

1. Tier 1: Honor Points gear - each item is sold for around 200-300 honor points so you can easily farm this amount and get your PvP gear straight away.
2. Tier 2: Conquest Points gear - you get those points from arenas but also every won random BG gives you 100, and every lost random BG gives you 50 (because bg is more serious PvP than arena), and rated battlegrounds give you higher amount of conquest points.
3. Tier 3: World PvP zone gear bought by the new currency gained from doing objectives on this island.

I don't know what do you guys think but imo PvP in WoW has to change because right now it's terrible.

I've also made the same topic on official WoW forums so if you support this, write something there so maybe someone from Blizzard will see it: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/9123142323

Why do you think people bot in battlegrounds? Nobody can be bothered doing the amount of battleground's that are required because it takes way too many to get your gear. It's stupid.

There's too many factors involved... you have:

• Ranging from 1-10 minute queue times (instant for Alliance, 10 minutes for Horde).
• Chance that you win or lose the battleground (Horde wins 3 to 4 times as many games as Alliance on my battlegroup).
• ~50 honor for a loss, ~300 honor for a win.

Taking in these factors, just getting a shitty ring can take forever. If they can't do anything about the queue times, they need to adjust how much honor we receive from winning or losing.

You also need ~16 pieces to be fully geared, so that's ~27,000 honor points. Assuming you win ALL of them, that's 90, yes, 90! games to get fully geared.

Averaging it out to ~25 minutes a game as well, that's almost TWO days of 90 WINS.

I suggest increasing the honor from a loss to 125 and the honor for a win to 500. Capturing a flag should credit 150 honor to your team, capturing a base should credit 40 honor to your team, kills should credit 5 honor to your team.

[aabay123]

now with ghostcrawler gone maybe something will change

I doubt that. They still have a different lead on their PvP team. It isn't going to change much. The thing is though, most of the changes come from the community and blizzard makes changes based on our feedback. I'm sure we can both come up with things they never did touch when we felt like they should have (like frost mage burst). They did listen to us on BM hunter nerf though.