View Poll Results: Good Idea?

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  • Yes.

    22 25.88%
  • No.

    50 58.82%
  • Could Use Work (With Explanation in the Thread)

    3 3.53%
  • Could Use Work (No Comment)

    10 11.76%
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  1. #101
    The Lightbringer judgementofantonidas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MCBGamer View Post
    Ok, I am posting this here and getting feedback before I take this to the main forums. Now that everyone knows that, let me get out of the way with my idea, my idea works in a series of steps, please tell me what you think. One more thing before I go on, I am a heroic raider, you can check up on my armory if you do not believe that is the case.

    Step 1: Remove all Trash in LFR: Trash in Normal Raids is fine, I love it, it helps keep me occupied, however in LFR it is just a nightmare of wipes and /leave's. This problem could be solved by simply removing all trash, but then what about all those AFK People won't they be harder to spot?
    Step 2: After a boss is killed you are left at the boss for 10 seconds to listen to dialogue and whine about how all you got was gold from your roll.
    Step 3: After 10 seconds a window appears prompting you to "Press Ok" to Continue, basically a teleporter, you have 10 seconds to respond.
    Step 4A: (YOU DID NOT CLICK OK)
    You are teleported out of the instance at no penalty to yourself as you are either AFK or do not want to continue with the next boss.
    Step 4B: (YOU CLICKED OK)
    Teleporter takes you to the next boss in an area that will not pull the boss, think the door that closes off the front of Org before Shamans.

    This would help solve three major issues I personally have with LFR, trash being a complete nightmare that helps no one in LFR at all, it just serves to hinder a group of people who are usually already mediocre at best. This would also solve the problem of people who are trying to /follow there way throughout the entire dungeon, it would direct them out of the instance without penalty, which leads into the last issue, people who got what they wanted and want to go on with there day without staying in LFR and dealing with things they do not want to do or taking penalty. All three of these are problems that need to be fixed up, especially in the case of LFR as they eliminate all viable ways to AFK through a raid without penalizing low DPSers and it also allows an easy exit for those who are currently done. That isn't even the best part of this though, the best part is this is super easy to do and I am sure it would make a lot of people very happy.

    1. No. You want to "see" raiding then see the trash too.

    2-4 is just nonsense. as silly as it sounds those afk and quitters pay the same 15 dollars as you to afk and quit. hows that for revers psychology?


    Lawful good does not always mean Lawful nice

  2. #102
    Mechagnome Manabomb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkvoltinx View Post
    people need to grow a pair. community issue needs to be fixed and policed by the community. i am sick and tired of people demanding blizzard fix it when the community is the ones who messed it up in the first place.
    I'm sorry to say, but due to internet anonymity and a huge score of other factor's that are involved with it, the community "Shaping up" won't happen. Especially with how massive the game has become. You can't expect for there to be some kind of UN resolution for people in this game to stop being assholes when the very thought of being as asshole gets people rock hard in the pantalones.

    If there is to be change, it's to be catered around the stupidity and the dickishness of the people that run lfr. This includes bad dps, people who wipe the raid intentionally, single or groups of raid geared people fucking the lfr, bad tanks that are too busy in their lives to look up a video ON A FIGHT THAT'S BEEN OUT FOR 4 MONTHS, bad healers who are incapable of healing more than themselves and a tank and blame that on their class not being good for anything but tank healing (No shit, this has happened to me more than once, and more than just paladins.).

    Of course people will be steadfast in attempting to ruin other peoples' time. But that's apart of the game for some. It's as if none of you have ever played an old era mmo, where getting pk'd was a daily aspect and people banded together to make guilds and alliances over it. Hell, the .hack series is a really good representation of people wanting to be assholes over the internet for the sake of being assholes over the internet. It won't change, so don't expect the community to shape up until it's sub 2 mill subs again.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    1. No. You want to "see" raiding then see the trash too.

    2-4 is just nonsense. as silly as it sounds those afk and quitters pay the same 15 dollars as you to afk and quit. hows that for revers psychology?
    I'm all in favor of the people that pay the same amount of money for a game as me, but when I have to deal with them being idiotic because they are too inept at a game they can't play yet find some kind of enjoyment out of, that's MY 15$ of time they are wasting.

    Maybe there needs to be an IQ and EQ test before someone can enter a raid. "You are too short in brain power to enter". This is sarcasm of course, but it's not like the community will ever be "close knit" ever again, especially in lfr, and it's not like assholes will suddenly stop being assholes for the sake of being assholes.

    Atleast designing systems around assholes will help the problem, whether said assholes are afk for a good reason or a very, very stupid reason. Still assholes.

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Palinn View Post
    I hate to be "that guy" but it seems to me the best way to fix LFR is to just remove LFR. Flex raiding with a queue seems a lot better to me - still lets people log in/queue whenever and gives more flexibility to the instance if someone dcs or whatever. You'll never solve the afkers in LFR/dungeons problem - you have to kick them, and if there are too many in the group and/or others refuse, you'll just have to requeue for a different group. Sucks, but that's the way it is.
    No thanks - I like having a guaranteed group if I simply wait long enough, vs. having to go find a group and be judged good enough. LFR is for new 90s and alts.

  4. #104
    Mechagnome Manabomb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wych View Post
    Trash when done right can add a lot of atmosphere and help pacing in a dungeon, it can also introduce players to boss mechanics prior to the fight.

    Funnily enough the 1 raid without trash (ToC) is widely viewed as the worst raid of all time
    It's a running contender with t7 of the same expansion and t14, but you're right it was bad. Fortunately that was an entirely different time and also, a lot of people who never would have touched raiding (ToC or otherwise) in wotlk or early cata, now can raid via lfr.

    If you are looking for atmosphere and pacing in lfr, then you might as well run flex or future normals, because there is no such thing as immersion (catchy buzzword though) in lfr.

  5. #105
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    1) They could just nerf the hell out of the trash, but leave it in place. Probably a much easier solution on their end.
    2) I'd rather they just disable /follow in LFR.
    3) They should just do a hybrid ready check / queue dialog, and teleport you out if you fail it. With the new LFR scaling technology this might be ok.

    I really do think they should require proving grounds Bronze in the spec you're playing in order to queue LFR as that role, and they shouldn't allow you to switch roles in LFR. (Switching what role you want gear for is fine.)

    I'll go one better - healers should have to have silver and tanks should have to have gold. I'm tired of people queuing as tank and then saying, "First time here. Explain fight?" <-- how about you read the journal if you're an experienced tank, or if you're like me and just tank once in a while, how about you run it as DPS first to see the mechanics?

  6. #106
    LFR should just be removed. It promotes laziness.
    Last edited by DizzyMonk; 2013-12-30 at 09:00 PM.

  7. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by MCBGamer View Post
    Back on topic to Sith's post: As I already said above, I am against the idea of LFR even existing, its dumb, shows content to people who don't deserve it most of the time and is awful, but why not instead of keep on this "LFR IS DUMB REMOVE IT" train, why not just man up and say, "You know what, if you want to do it, do it right Blizzard."
    What a fucking asshole. Thankfully people like you are, what, five percent of the playerbase? Nobody gives a fuck what you think, not even Blizzard.

  8. #108
    Quote Originally Posted by BlahBlahFrigginBlah View Post
    much easier way to fix lfr.

    add a 1 week cooldown debuff against using any random dungeon/lfr/bg by being kick-removed from any dungeon.

    suddenly people would realize they're accountable for their actions and shape up.
    Thats the stick. I would suggest the carrot. How about a +% chance of a piece of loot if you stay for a kill after a wipe? Needs to be abuse preventable like it only kicks in after the 60% of the bosses health is depleted.

  9. #109
    The Lightbringer
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manabomb View Post
    It's a running contender with t7 of the same expansion and t14, but you're right it was bad. Fortunately that was an entirely different time and also, a lot of people who never would have touched raiding (ToC or otherwise) in wotlk or early cata, now can raid via lfr.

    If you are looking for atmosphere and pacing in lfr, then you might as well run flex or future normals, because there is no such thing as immersion (catchy buzzword though) in lfr.
    Disagree, I only did SoO on LFR and I enjoyed the story moving through the city, a lot more than I would have if I just ported to each boss room

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Qalaq View Post
    What a fucking asshole. Thankfully people like you are, what, five percent of the playerbase? Nobody gives a fuck what you think, not even Blizzard.
    Aye unfortunately people like him are the issue in MMOs, not bad players.

    "You don't deserve this stuff, I do i'm a special snowflake now tell me how great I am"

  10. #110
    Herald of the Titans UnifiedDivide's Avatar
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    Why is it that every time someone posts their "solution" to LFR, they're always a normal or heroic raider? And why do they always seem to think people in LFR don't "deserve" to see "their" content?
    And the amount of supposed "solutions" in this thread is hilarious. I'm immensely glad some of you don't make games for a living.

    Why is trash suddenly something to be removed? LFR is meant to at least simulate the raiding content. Trash is a part of raiding. One raid that didn't have it is seen as the worst one ever. Irony is fantastic!

    The biggest issue with almost any area in the game is the assholes playing it. They've been around since beta and the only difference today is that you're exposed to a wider range of people rather than just the morons on your server. Claiming LFR is what made people like that is amusing at best.

    The OP mentioned that using the time excuse is stupid and that anyone saying it is just lazy. I beg to differ. If I see that my LFR queue is gonna be an hour, do you honestly believe I sit and watch my screen doing fuck all for that hour just waiting for my queue to pop? No. I can get all kinds of housework done in that time! So yes, it's a perfectly valid excuse.

    The only "fix" that LFR needs, is keeping normal mode heroes and heroic raiders out of it. In WoD, it's literally meant to be "tourist mode". You shouldn't be needed in there. If people are having problems getting bosses killed, they'll have to actually learn what is happening and why they're dying.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dezerte View Post
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  11. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by UnifiedDivide View Post
    Why is it that every time someone posts their "solution" to LFR, they're always a normal or heroic raider? And why do they always seem to think people in LFR don't "deserve" to see "their" content?
    And the amount of supposed "solutions" in this thread is hilarious. I'm immensely glad some of you don't make games for a living.

    Why is trash suddenly something to be removed? LFR is meant to at least simulate the raiding content. Trash is a part of raiding. One raid that didn't have it is seen as the worst one ever. Irony is fantastic!

    The biggest issue with almost any area in the game is the assholes playing it. They've been around since beta and the only difference today is that you're exposed to a wider range of people rather than just the morons on your server. Claiming LFR is what made people like that is amusing at best.

    The OP mentioned that using the time excuse is stupid and that anyone saying it is just lazy. I beg to differ. If I see that my LFR queue is gonna be an hour, do you honestly believe I sit and watch my screen doing fuck all for that hour just waiting for my queue to pop? No. I can get all kinds of housework done in that time! So yes, it's a perfectly valid excuse.

    The only "fix" that LFR needs, is keeping normal mode heroes and heroic raiders out of it. In WoD, it's literally meant to be "tourist mode". You shouldn't be needed in there. If people are having problems getting bosses killed, they'll have to actually learn what is happening and why they're dying.
    One of the reasons its normally raiders who offer suggestions, and this one actually tried to be as neutral as possible, is because the intended audience for LFR just isn't going to take the time to think these suggestions through. Its sort of like PTR testing, the intended audience as stated by Blizz doesn't test it. The only people who test it are raiders, griefers since you cant be punished, and un-subbed players who want to see content. (And those people make LFR players look amazing)

    While you do the right thing with the hour long queue, not many people do that. So it is a problem. Its sort of like telling the community to shape up. Its ideal but will NEVER happen.

    Anyways, if LFR rewards are brought down to heroic dungeons and open world content (or those are brought up, idc either way whatsoever, I just don't think they'll have non-raid content drop tier) that should solve most of the community problems.

    The problem currently with LFR IMO is I'd say for its intended audience, very few actually enjoy raid style content. Most of those people are in Flex now. That leaves people who prefer questing and other activities but are forced into LFR for the best solo gear in the game. But they'd rather be doing something else.

    The problem with random group finders (which is still a good addition to the game and shouldn't be removed), and notice that Blizzard is moving away from them now, they want them to be a last resort, is that it gathers too many different types of players together in the same place.

    When people want to entertain themselves, they want to and expect it to follow what they have in mind to do. This creates a problem where you grab multiple different attitudes into the same room. For example look at the threads about "is it ok to solo lowbie instances as a dps or not?" Before group finders, go go go people and slow and steady players didn't interact really. So they didn't hate one another because they basically didn't even know they existed.

    LFR exacerbates the issue by grabbing Sooooo many different people together. You have raiders who are used to competency and accountability and want to get through as fast as possible. You have people that love the lore and want to see it. You have people that don't care about the fights and just want the gear. You have people who want to "enjoy the experience." You have people that want to learn how to play. The list could be endless. None of those people are right or wrong, its just that putting them all together is of course not going to end well. And then of course with 25 people, its a griefer's paradise.

    Once Blizzard narrows the audience of who will want to do LFR further, it'll be a much better experience for all.
    Last edited by Krazzorx; 2013-12-30 at 10:50 PM.

  12. #112
    Mechagnome taishar68's Avatar
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    In my opinion, the biggest problem with LFR is that the people who complain about it the most lose sight of the fact that LFR was not intended for them.

    In the OP, we get a disclaimer-"I am an Heroic Raider", which is written in the context of "I know what I am talking about". For my two bits, that would have added more credence to the argument if the OP was an LFR raider, and thus the intended target audience.

    It is not a perfect analogy, but imagine a major league baseball pitcher, like Jason Verlander, deciding to play semi pro ball for some practice, and then complaining about how bad the other players are, questioning their commitment, etc. If you are an heroic raider, you do not need LFR, it is a choice. Now, I will get the obligatory "you don't know what it's like for high end guilds and the demands for gear blah blah" but I challenge that; if the guild is that good, they don't need LFR 2-piece bonuses or trinket procs to beat content. You don't even have to be an Heroic guild to beat normal without LFR, and once you're clearing and gearing normal, LFR becomes moot. Flex only makes it less necessary.

    So we come back to choice. If you choose to join LFR, do so knowing who the target audience is: casual players. They may not gem right or gear right, they may not know what all their spells do. They may go AFK (I have rarely experienced this phenomenon, but according to the forums it is a pandemic...so I guess I am an outlier).

    I will concede that if you need your legendary quest items, LFR is the fastest and easiest way to go, and thus it is somewhat a necessity, but in my opinion we'd be better off designing the legendary quests in a way that doesn't make grinding the bosses in LFR necessary.

    Just my thoughts.
    Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

  13. #113
    what if when the boss is on 5% hp, and i suddenly have to go to the toilet? or my doorbell rings? i won't be able to click the "okay" button and i'll be kicked from the raid even though i was there for 95% of the boss.

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