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  1. #1

    Thread Exclusive For Non Subscribers: Why Aren't You Subscribed?

    Just some food for thought, not particularly interested in why people are subscribed, but why they aren't. Here's a list of my own thoughts, usually they're not reciprocated but what the hell (tldr summary at the bottom):



    - Gear resets and having everything previously accomplished flushed down the drain by 'leveling' content, compounded by the task killing trash where previously gear was earned with an epic task

    - Game isn't played as a whole but by a patch by patch basis where new patches remove the importance and therefore the access of the content for new sparse content, content skipping being the biggest offender as otherwise it would be contained to expansions rather than patches

    - There is no clear progression from dungeons to raiding, I preferred when badges were for helping people get out of heroics and into raids, I don't like that LFR was used to implement disorganized raiding, what makes raiding special is the organized nature of a mutually shared goal involving medium to heavy teamwork

    - They took away the distinguished differentiation of how rare or difficult to acquire an item was by its colour quality, it helps distinguish how impressive your accumulation of gear is or how you got it, it was a nice trophy back in the day that added depth at no cost of complexity, it only positively added to the game, why was it taken away

    - Nothing useful from leveling, it doesn't teach you anything new about the game, it doesn't intrinsically help your character like end game does, if only you could achieve some progression, this is what compounds disdain for expansion resets, it has become an expansion routine rather than an expansion opportunity

    - Too many skills, where most don't do much, debuffs/buffs with no trackable non-UI based visual representation, most of combat is engrossed in the UI intertwined with 3rd party addons to keep up with or organize the mess of bloated information, the action is in the UI and not in the game world: #MSExcel

    - Classes were founded on roles and not flavors, it seems the designers have continuously struggled to understand how to distinguish the classes while making them equally versatile, I hate Jay Wilson but D3 did manage to succeed here and with proper customization to boot

    - Complete lack of positive reinforcements for socializing and comradery with toxic behavior running amok unregulated without the community being able to do a damn thing about it

    - Guild perks achieved through arbitrary means rather than through tasks requiring any actual guild interaction and the focus of down sizing raiding now causing smaller guilds to be self sufficient so they don't socialize with other guilds destroying yet another vehicle for community interaction

    - Chestplates are still spandex, adding pandas and their giant guts you'd expect they wouldn't allow plate spandex to continue; plate kilts are still dresses, collars still move with the head instead of the chest, cloth is still made of rubber and only comes in one design: the cone

    - I don't want to buy redundant expansions so I can play the most recent expansion, any 'expansion' after the recent one has no legitimate content that is a part of end game and spending money on it is only a barrier to entry of the current expansion



    ===================



    [Recurring points brought up by other afflicted posters]:


    - When guilds split or players take a break it is very difficult to get going again as a new patch will put you behind the curve and at the bottom of the roster (not present in Vanilla/TBC's linear progression), it is also very difficult to find new friends who are on the same page by means of progression, personality and schedule (2 of 3 pre-existing problem since Vanilla)

    - The growing number of expansions on top of subscription fees is creating a huge barrier to entry for new players; convincing friends besides $$$ is also problematic as the majority of content is irrelevant making it difficult to justify forking over so much money to begin with on top of the fact no one will be there to generally support them to get up to speed both in leveling and raiding due to the prior point


    TLDR; game has some issues.
    Last edited by peedei; 2013-12-30 at 04:32 PM.

  2. #2
    More like, why are you still here?
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  3. #3
    What Samaramon said... also; Considering the problems and issues you described, i can only come to the conclusion that World of Warcraft was the only game you ever played... also i am baffled how schizophrenic some of your opinions are next to each other. Oh well. Nothing to see here...
    Draaaaaven.

  4. #4
    Moderator Shamanic's Avatar
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    I'm not subscribed at the minute because I don't intend to play right now. My guild disbanded in Cataclysm and I haven't done any group content at all in MoP, so I feel no pressing connection with people to remain subscribed on a month to month basis. If I intend to play this month, I'll sub. If I know I don't feel like it or won't have the time, I won't. Majority of MoP, I haven't been subbed because I've been playing a lot of other games, my husband quit due to working a 60 hour week most of the last year he no longer has any time at all for an mmo, and I find it boring playing an MMO with no friends /singletear.

    In short, I'm not subscribed because of me and the social situation (my guild didn't disband because the game had problems, it was a very tight knit 10 man guild, we raided for 5 years, but ultimately people had finished university and gone out to get jobs and families, increasingly couldn't make raid nights and we decided as a group decision to just call the raid group quits), not because of the game.
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  5. #5
    - I don't want to buy redundant expansions so I can play the most recent expansion, any 'expansion' after the recent one has no legitimate content that is a part of end game and spending money on it is only a barrier to entry of the current expansion
    It would please you to know that buying WoW without MoP now gives you everything except for MoP. Also, WoW without MoP is like ten entire dollars. And MoP is... what? $20? Fuck, eBay says ten bucks for MoP as well! Researchisreallyhard

    Too many skills, where most don't do much, debuffs/buffs with no trackable non-UI based visual representation, most of combat is engrossed in the UI intertwined with 3rd party addons to keep up with or organize the mess of bloated information, the action is in the UI and not in the game world: #MSExcel
    They have vastly pruned the number of useless spells classes have. Many buffs are now straight up auras, as well. Fights are also intensely about paying attention to your surroundings, it's not an information overload at all like it used to be. Fights tend to have craptons of mechanics flying all over the place that mean you actually have to watch them, rather than stare at numbers and ticking timers. In WoD, they're even getting rid of haste breakpoints and reforging, making min-maxxing even more about your ability to do a fight properly and nail your rotation than it ever was before, rather than worry about the numbers on your gear.

    I'll give you a point that the default buff/debuff tracking system on the UI is essentially garbage, but come on man.
    Last edited by Herecius; 2013-12-27 at 10:19 AM.

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  6. #6
    Herald of the Titans inboundpaper's Avatar
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    I actually forgot to buy gametime like 4 times this year.
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  7. #7
    game looks boring and unappealing, MoP has absolutely nothing that would catch my attention, regardless I would never waste my money playing during this time in any expansion when nothing interesting is happening or being added to the game.
    looking forward to WoD though, definitely at least the first month should be interesting.

  8. #8
    Currently I'm not subscribed because I've done everything I have wanted to do in MoP and paying a monthly fee is not worth it to just mess around without any real purpose.

  9. #9
    Because I can't play the 5-hours per day, 6 days a week that my guild and IRL friends all played in to be mediocre at best. It is a hella fun game, but as far as I'm concerned, if I can't beat someone with skill alone, there is no point in playing or restarting and grinding for 5 months to get a full current-season-elite set and actually be able to compete. Same with raiding guilds; they'll only accept players who have server first achievements from the current or last patch.

    I bought BlizzCon tickets this year assuming that Blizzard was going to announce Titan, but they announced that they were no longer developing it with their main team a little after selling all their BlizzCon tickets... I don't mind too much, I had fun.

    I think Blizzard is the very best video game producing company in the world ATM. I play StarCraft every week in GM, hearthstone too. Their MOBA is pretty fun, but when you bring 5 pro gamers and go 40-0 in twenty minutes it leaves little room for real competition.

    My final thoughts on Blizzard's development schedule is that they may be waiting for the swath of "space-MMOs" to hit the market (Eve Valkyrie and Wildstar in 2014, StarCitizen in 2015) before releasing their own superior version like they did with WoW vs Ultima, DAoC, Lineage and Everquest and rule the market. In all likelihood the MMO-genre is going to die with WOW if this is not the case unless they have a cross-platform MMO in the works.

    I love the game, but I don't have the time to be as good as I need to be to feel like I'm having fun, whereas I can pickup Battlefield 4 and try for Division 1 in whatever I feel like working on.

  10. #10
    Over 9000! Frozenbeef's Avatar
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    Sub ended yesterday, not going to renew it until pre wod patch / events come in... completed everything i wanted to do in mop and with nothing new in sight may as well divert my attention to other games i still need to complete. I've loved all the wow expansions, it's the 12month breaks with nothing new that i hate, every expansion they say they have planned for it and nothing changes

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Samaramon View Post
    More like, why are you still here?
    Or more like, why are subscribers posting in a thread for non-subscribers

    I'm currently unsubscribed because the Mists expansion just didn't do it for me. I didn't like the theme, I didn't like the new races, I didn't like their faux-Asian voices, and I found Pandaria as a continent quite bland, tedious and uninteresting to level in. I did it once, but I couldn't do it again with alts like I could in other expansions.

    Bots in PvP was another thing that bugged me. So. Many. Bots. Not just that, but the fact other players didn't care there were bots making our team lose.

    Oh, and the amount of buttons is ridiculous.

  12. #12
    Funny thread title. Unsubing isn't a big deal, that's just something to do. There's no need for an "exclusive" thread where you get to cry out all your frustrations without having to fear disagreement.

  13. #13
    I am Murloc! Airwaves's Avatar
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    Got bored. Simple as that. Almost 9 years of playing does that to you.
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  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Herecius View Post
    It would please you to know that buying WoW without MoP now gives you everything except for MoP. Also, WoW without MoP is like ten entire dollars. And MoP is... what? $20? Fuck, eBay says ten bucks for MoP as well! Researchisreallyhard



    They have vastly pruned the number of useless spells classes have. Many buffs are now straight up auras, as well. Fights are also intensely about paying attention to your surroundings, it's not an information overload at all like it used to be. Fights tend to have craptons of mechanics flying all over the place that mean you actually have to watch them, rather than stare at numbers and ticking timers. In WoD, they're even getting rid of haste breakpoints and reforging, making min-maxxing even more about your ability to do a fight properly and nail your rotation than it ever was before, rather than worry about the numbers on your gear.

    I'll give you a point that the default buff/debuff tracking system on the UI is essentially garbage, but come on man.
    It's the principle of handing over $$$ for nothing, WoD might be the expansion I come back to and I don't want to fork over $$$ for MoP when I explicitly stopped playing because of it. So 1) MoP never appealed to me and 2) if I get WoD paying for MoP gives me nothing. The way WoD is shaping up when it launches I wouldn't mind paying for that expansion, but I would never fork over cash for the catastrophie that was Cataclysm and the foreign pandering that was MoP. It's all to do with ethics.

    As far as spells go yes they have done pruning but action bars are still full, there's still heavy redundancy to class design at the moment where skills are added to fill down time rather than giving other spells more depth. For example it is possible for a single button to have 3 unique and distinguished uses:

    - A) Tap: when the skill is tapped it uses multiple combos attacks
    - B) Hold: when it is held down it charges an attack
    - C) Chain: after finishing a combo or charged attack a new state temporarily replaces the primary skill

    WoW still doesn't utilize chains that can radically consolidate skill bloat without having to remove skills. D3 had a very interesting system of giving you a finite amount of skills you can choose and then a single customization among 6 choices for that skill, it opens up a lot of choice and customization that WoW continuously keeps removing. Charged skills can have a lot of depth but I'd have to bring up another game to explain which would go offtopic very fast.

    The classes every patch begin to feel more similar to each other as their foundation was built on roles rather than flavors so balancing them causes them to become similar, the classes in Diablo are all very unique with their own unique class mechanics while also being balance for versatility equally, the demon hunter specifically has much more depth than the WoW hunter despite being based on the same premise of a ranged class that uses traps, rapid fire would be less interesting though if Diablo was tab target.
    Last edited by peedei; 2013-12-27 at 10:51 AM.

  15. #15
    1. The subscription. No other game I play requires one, so I simply can't justify the monthly fee for WoW with so many good, cheaper options.

    2. Grinds. I'm sick to death of grinds, such as leveling and gold making, and especially gear grinds. They just get in the way of my fun.

    3. Class balance. The ever revolving balance wheel gets old after a while. I want to win or lose based on my skill and my opponent's, nothing else.

    4. Bad questing model. SWTOR provides a much better and more immersive story, so I can't even enjoy questing in WoW anymore.

    5. PvP content. Or lack thereof. As someone who primarily plays for PvP, the lack of good new PvP content doesn't leave me too eager.

    6. Flying mounts. CRZ and realm mergers brought me a glimmer of hope, but world PvP won't ever be good as long as flying mounts exist.

    7. Bots. They make random BG's pretty close to random, and don't ever seem to get dealt with in large enough quantities to matter.

    8. Faction balance. Some months I can't lose, and some months I can't win. Mass faction pooling can cause queues to get unbearable too.

    9. Uninteresting story. I won't say WoW doesn't have good lore, but MoP isn't anywhere near as interesting as some past expansions.

    10. Age. I've played this game for many years now, and after this much time the MMO magic is simply gone, regardless of all the rest.

    11. The community. As time goes by, people get more and more stuck up and judgmental. I don't have any patience for this mentality at all.

    12. Friends quitting. Everyone I used to play with either doesn't PvP anymore, or doesn't play at all. Playing alone isn't much fun.

    13. Endless CC. I don't mind some classes having more CC than others, if they're built around it. But right now I'm CC'ed more often than not.

    14. Healing. It's my firm opinion that healing has gotten more and more OP in PvP every expansion, and it's reached the breaking point with MoP.

    15. The auction house. The economic side of MMO's, more than anything else, is something I don't have the slightest bit of patience for.
    Last edited by Itisamuh; 2013-12-27 at 10:55 AM.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by inboundpaper View Post
    I actually forgot to buy gametime like 4 times this year.
    Can you remember why?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyHellfire View Post
    Funny thread title. Unsubing isn't a big deal, that's just something to do. There's no need for an "exclusive" thread where you get to cry out all your frustrations without having to fear disagreement.
    It's actually a pretty nifty way to accumulate data without having to deal with people arguing over trivial matters.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by peedei View Post
    - Game isn't played as a whole but by a patch by patch basis where new patches remove the importance and therefore the access of the content for new sparse content, content skipping being the biggest offender as otherwise it would be contained to expansions rather than patches

    - There is no clear progression from dungeons to raiding, I preferred when badges were for helping people get out of heroics and into raids, I don't like that LFR was used to implement disorganized raiding, what makes raiding special is the organized nature of a mutually shared goal involving medium to heavy teamwork

    - Too many skills, where most don't do much, debuffs/buffs with no trackable non-UI based visual representation, most of combat is engrossed in the UI intertwined with 3rd party addons to keep up with or organize the mess of bloated information, the action is in the UI and not in the game world: #MSExcel

    - I don't want to buy redundant expansions so I can play the most recent expansion, any 'expansion' after the recent one has no legitimate content that is a part of end game and spending money on it is only a barrier to entry of the current expansion
    Huh? Most of those are not the case anymore as of MoP and are the only reasons I stayed subbed for so long. You must have been gone for a long time.

    As to why I'm not subbed anymore? Most friends have already quit and made it very clear they are never coming back. There's no community left either. Flex definitely brought pugging and socializing back a bit but too little too late, by now I just don't care. PvP is attrocious, the piling up of new CCs/CDs with every expansion that the devs do finally caught up to them (as many players had previously warned) and has turned PvP into an utter mess where you can barely see glimmers of fun flash for a few seconds before it is all over or you are stuck in a never ending CC chain.

    Another reason being WoD isn't bringing anything new to the game outside Garrisons and the gimmicky secondary stats which the devs' insistence in downplaying is bizarre and actually selling some people out of the idea. Why care about these new stats being added that the developers themselves go out of their way to guarantee me I'll rarely see it and won't affect my gameplay? That's ass backwards marketing if I ever saw it.

    Though WoD does have the new continent and raids that are staple to all expansions and is bringing a ton of very needed fixes. Fixes along the lines of multiple lockouts, personal/traditional loot system, multiple path raids, item squish, etc, etc. All amazing great things that fix problems with the game as a balance patch would but not add anything actually new to it. Hell some are just previously stupid decisions being reverted (lock outs, raid designs...). Pretending those things are new content would be the same as calling balance patches new content. In comparison to every other expansion WoD offers the least. Previous expansions have all had new zones and raids, stats readjustments/additions, questing redesigns, raiding size/system changes, on top of new races/classes and brand new features that actually affect gameplay (heroics, scenarios, arenas, etc) so Blizzard has proven they can do better, and as a consumer I want more for my money, not less.

    Quote Originally Posted by peedei View Post
    - A) Tap: when the skill is tapped it uses multiple combos attacks
    - B) Hold: when it is held down it charges an attack
    - C) Chain: after finishing a combo or charged attack a new state temporarily replaces the primary skill
    Looks like someone's been watching Wildstar DevSpeaks. My favorite is the Crowd Control one. Having an actual way to get out of or deal with CC based on your input/skill is a godsend compared to You can't do that while stunned.
    Last edited by Hyral; 2013-12-27 at 11:17 AM.

  18. #18
    Most of the people I know stopped playing and the game did not feel fun anymore.

    Quit in later cata, tried the MOP 10day trial, was ok for about a day then it lost its appeal.

    Dont see the entertainment value as enough to buy MOP and to buy a $15 sub.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by peedei View Post
    It's actually a pretty nifty way to accumulate data without having to deal with people arguing over trivial matters.
    "Accumulate data"? You a hobby analyst or what?

  20. #20
    Herald of the Titans Lovestar's Avatar
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    The combat system just isn't fun. It has too many buttons that don't exist for any reason except to add more buttons, and it blatantly comes through in the gameplay, and it feels dull and tedious after a very short time.

    That's really it, to be honest. If WoW's combat system still felt fun compared to newer, fresher games that have tidied-up and streamlined the extraneous waste, I'd probably be on-board. But even GW1, which came out in 2005, has a more interesting RPG combat system than WoW.

    The fights themselves, and a lot of the utility tools (Disengage, Blink, freestyle Evocate, etc) are actually a lot of fun, though. So I still pop in periodically to try new content out or mess around for a few days. I just can't stay subbed because it's so repetitive and unsatisfying to actually "play" at the core level.

    Like I log in, head to a new questing area, start spamming Arcane Shot and... my heart just kind of sinks and dies. Then I camera-flip Disengage and I'm briefly happy. Then I go back to BA > Arcane Shot > ExploExploExploExploExploExploExploExploExploExplo > Arcane ShotArcane ShotArcane ShotArcane ShotArcane Shot and ... ugh.

    idk. It's hard to explain. Attacking and fighting stuff in WoW just doesn't feel satisfying.

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