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  1. #201
    The Lightbringer
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    The remake of Spriest in MoP was really really terrible. Cataclysm spriest was almost absolutely perfect. All that had to be done was to make a more powerful/fun dps CD, and increase the single target no ramp up time burst by a tiny bit. I realised that spriests were kind of shit to play already at the MoP pre-patch (like who the heck designs that shit?). After less than a month at lvl 90 I decided to reroll to warlock. And that was after maining shadow priest ever since I rerolled from holy/disc to shadow in late Tbc. At least the demo warlock was extremely fun to play in back when I raided heroic modes in 5.0 and 5.1.

    I couldn't really give a damn about numbers that much (as long as it is bearable). If I can't make it out of the 5man heroic progress stage without falling asleep because the spec I am playing is terrible then I couldn't really care less about 25man heroic BiS numbers.

    Unless they completely revamp shadow priests again, I guess I am going to play my warlock once again when I activate my account when the new expansion arrives. It's quite sad though. I have a lot of rare stuff on my priest that I would love to use but can't since the only dps spec they have is depressing to play. It amazes me how Blizzard managed to make spriests the ranged ret paladins in MoP (shit ton of procs) but without any actual cds to compensate. And all of it was because a couple of people complained about the damage being slightly affected my rng the first 20 seconds of a fight (like that ever mattered over the course of a 10 min heroic raid boss).
    Last edited by Funkthepunk; 2014-01-02 at 12:21 AM.

  2. #202
    To prove my point why Marksman Hunter had it worst just check this:

    Yes, the lowest line is marksman hunter




  3. #203
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    Quote Originally Posted by hakujinbakasama View Post
    I have an 88 Shadow Priest right now and I don't know wtf you're talking about. They don't feel any "different" than any other class at that point. Druid was the most painful to level followed closely by a tie with Shaman+Warrior. I don't think shadow is as fun or interesting as it was in TBC (didn't play priest Wrath or Cata) but it's just an awkward hybrid between Warlock and Mage.

    Also, I think people are confused by time here. Who honestly remembers leveling in TBC? (I say because Vanilla doesn't count so much for this discussion) I recall entire guides showing from what level and which spec point to spend for the most efficient and speediest leveling course. I don't think it was until Cata that honestly leveling as Protection for Paladins was a complete option. It sure as hell wasn't in Tbc and it was completely not fun at the start of Wrath.

    Frankly, I would argue that compared to leveling Blood everything sucked to level in MoP.

    [...]

    Fixed. Seriously though, I have to side with the idea that most people were already playing something else as a main so they didn't feel the sting of this. If anything, I believe people were expecting another Dk level of awesomeness and Blizzard held back A METRIC SHIT TON because of the first 3 months of Dk madness.
    I haven't played WW but I have a MW that has been played quite a bit and it's a fine spec. It might be my new favorite mob grinding spec, at least at the gear levels I have access to. Haven't tried BM at level 90 yet but I am collecting gear, will do it soon. MW is going to be different in WoD but I think that's fine. I also think WW will be a lot less broken. Blizzard would, I think, like to improve the representation of Monks so they might well be FOTM for several months come WoD.

    I couldn't stand shadow. But, some people liked it better than the old one. That's fine.

    Druid was indeed horrible to level because I just didn't want a feral spec. If I had 3 specs I would have made a kitty, but I enjoy both boomkin and resto and I think that having to use multiple addons to remember my skills and visit a trainer to get/swap that 3rd spec is just stupid. But most of my druid leveling I did by herbing, so, although it was slow, it mostly didn't matter whether combat sucked.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Kryos View Post
    To prove my point why Marksman Hunter had it worst just check this:

    Yes, the lowest line is marksman hunter
    There is SO MUCH sample bias in Top 100 parses. You can't say anything about how MM is in general from a sort of Top 100 parses.

  4. #204
    Quote Originally Posted by Normie View Post
    There is SO MUCH sample bias in Top 100 parses. You can't say anything about how MM is in general from a sort of Top 100 parses.
    It shows the best dps people where able to do with this spec. Sample size of several thousands of hunters for each spec. It's pretty accurate. And who cares about bad players dps that don't know how to play their spec?




  5. #205
    Scarab Lord
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kryos View Post
    It shows the best dps people where able to do with this spec. Sample size of several thousands of hunters for each spec. It's pretty accurate. And who cares about bad players dps that don't know how to play their spec?
    The top guilds are so finely tuned and perfectly synergised that it's often not an accurate representation of how it really plays out.

    Blizzard have said the same in the past as well

  6. #206
    Quote Originally Posted by wych View Post
    The top guilds are so finely tuned and perfectly synergised that it's often not an accurate representation of how it really plays out.

    Blizzard have said the same in the past as well
    I don't think you're getting this sir. See, I know the math behind the game so I don't need to see what a "human" was able to do. /end sarcasm

  7. #207
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    Quote Originally Posted by hakujinbakasama View Post
    I don't think you're getting this sir. See, I know the math behind the game so I don't need to see what a "human" was able to do. /end sarcasm
    At the end of the day the main thing that matters is how it plays out for the average Joe, not in a perfect world on a spreadsheet and not for the top few players

  8. #208
    Fire has suffered quite a bit tbh. Made completely Worthless in 5.1 then buffed again in 5.2-5.3. Then nerfed again in 5.4 even thought its still relatively competitive

  9. #209
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kryos View Post
    It shows the best dps people where able to do with this spec. Sample size of several thousands of hunters for each spec. It's pretty accurate. And who cares about bad players dps that don't know how to play their spec?
    I don't think you understand what "sample bias" means.

    If the best players only play what is perceived to be the best spec, then the other specs will be played by less skilled players. So, the "bad spec" parses are NEVER from the best players. You will NEVER see what MM is capable of in this kind of chart.

    That's the first thing.

    The second thing is that if a spec is subject to RNG (say, if a good pull works out to a 50k advantage over the course of a fight) then when you pick only the best parses from a spec, you get a wholly unrealistic view of its AVERAGE capability.


  10. #210
    Shrug, they all seemed pretty good to me.

    I can't quite put my finger on it but I enjoyed my Prot Warrior less in MoP. I seriously don't know why.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blachshma View Post
    For spec, I'd say holy priests had a pretty terrible expansion overall.
    Damn Ghostcrawler wanted all the suck to himself!
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

  11. #211
    Quote Originally Posted by wych View Post
    At the end of the day the main thing that matters is how it plays out for the average Joe, not in a perfect world on a spreadsheet and not for the top few players
    I've tried explaining this concept to people on other subjects and you'd be surprised how much the average Joe cannot understand "intervals."

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mormolyce View Post
    Shrug, they all seemed pretty good to me.

    I can't quite put my finger on it but I enjoyed my Prot Warrior less in MoP. I seriously don't know why.

    Damn Ghostcrawler wanted all the suck to himself!
    I believe that Prot Warriors and Holy Priests suffer from the same illness. ALL THE BUTTONS are belong to us!
    They both have TOO much shit. It doesn't matter if that 1 spell is situational, you're going to need it. Because the moment you don't have it on a bar, that is exactly when the moment will fucking arrive.

  12. #212
    Quote Originally Posted by hakujinbakasama View Post
    I don't think you're getting this sir. See, I know the math behind the game so I don't need to see what a "human" was able to do. /end sarcasm
    Those are all real players doing the dps - it's all done by humans.

    Here you have the average dps (no top, no low) of all the players (not just top players) and what a surprise - Marksman is still sh*t.
    Last edited by Kryos; 2014-01-02 at 01:20 AM.




  13. #213
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kryos View Post
    Those are all real players doing the dps - it's all done by humans.
    You're ignoring what everybody is saying though about sample bias and how it's not representitive of the average player

  14. #214
    Quote Originally Posted by hakujinbakasama View Post
    I believe that Prot Warriors and Holy Priests suffer from the same illness. ALL THE BUTTONS are belong to us!
    They both have TOO much shit. It doesn't matter if that 1 spell is situational, you're going to need it. Because the moment you don't have it on a bar, that is exactly when the moment will fucking arrive.
    Yeah button bloat is an issue, but it's no worse than it was in Cata.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

  15. #215
    Quote Originally Posted by Normie View Post
    I don't think you understand what "sample bias" means.

    If the best players only play what is perceived to be the best spec, then the other specs will be played by less skilled players. So, the "bad spec" parses are NEVER from the best players. You will NEVER see what MM is capable of in this kind of chart.
    The best players don't play MM because it's just not worth playing lol.

  16. #216
    Quote Originally Posted by wych View Post
    You're ignoring what everybody is saying though about sample bias and how it's not representitive of the average player
    I posted the statistics of the average players after that. Same basic result - Marksman Hunter = bottom dps spec.




  17. #217
    The Patient wxcopy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saberstrike View Post
    In PvE: NO ONE. This expansion was perfect for PvE. Everything is viable.

    In PvP: Monk. This is why.
    totally ot, but the human representation is over the top. FIX RACIALS NOW.

  18. #218
    Quote Originally Posted by wxcopy View Post
    totally ot, but the human representation is over the top. FIX RACIALS NOW.
    The racial isn't that much of a big deal anymore. Most of my friends that pvp a lot just like the look of humans.

  19. #219
    Quote Originally Posted by Kryos View Post
    I posted the statistics of the average players after that. Same basic result - Marksman Hunter = bottom dps spec.
    I think you're confusing MM with Frost... or possibly Frost... it's so hard to tell.

  20. #220
    From the classes/specs I tried its Shadow Priest for me as no. 1 followed by ww monk. I also didnt like the start of MoP as a bear tank, the new tree split up was confusing and tbh I liked it more before when I could utilize skills as cat and bear depending on the situation rather than how now the class seems half crippled considering druids are supposed to be true hybrids.

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