1. #1

    Why is my hunter buddy that bad? (Logs included)

    Hi all

    My friend (Aradij, see logs at the bottom) went SoO NH the first time last night. He knows most of the bosses from LFR/Flex and has ilvl 556 equipped.

    The effective DPS on bosses ist about 168k, which seems to be pretty low imho. Because I never played a hunter, I wanted to ask you experts for an advise. What is he doing wrong? Or is this DPS normal as a hunter?

    Here are the logs: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...ne/?enc=bosses

    Thanks in advance!

  2. #2
    It looks like arcane shot is his number one ability. Is he a BM hunter not using kill command? I am not seeing what I expect to be explosive shot or chimera shot in his rotation either. The primary spec ability really should be toward the top and not just spamming arcane shot.

    Nothing to get upset about really, probably just has a misspelling or extra space in his macros or something silly.

  3. #3
    He's not using his signature shot.
    He's BM, tell him to use Kill Command.
    Not just often, not very often; it needs to be on CD ALL THE TIME.

    I see a trend of about 5-7 Killcommands on every fight. Kill Command has a 6 second cooldown and is the biggest source of damage for BM hunters.
    As a freebie, he can squeeze 2 Kill Commands inside one Bestial Wrath phase (10sec). More damage and half the focus cost.
    Last edited by Exileos; 2014-01-09 at 08:06 AM.

  4. #4
    Thank you two. I guess it is a typo in his macros... The german for kill command is "Fass!", I guess he just spelled "Fass" (without the !).

    Thanks!

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Denisac View Post
    It looks like arcane shot is his number one ability. Is he a BM hunter not using kill command? I am not seeing what I expect to be explosive shot or chimera shot in his rotation either. The primary spec ability really should be toward the top and not just spamming arcane shot.

    Nothing to get upset about really, probably just has a misspelling or extra space in his macros or something silly.
    Kill command shows up as the hunter's pet's damage, not his own. He is indeed using KC (named Fass!).

    It's hard to check what's going on due to two things:
    1: the best fights for a hunter to see if (s)he is doing it right, is without a doubt Juggernaut, thok and malkorok. Those are the only fights you can't really get wildly inaccurate numbers dependant on tactic and amount of whoring done.
    The hunter in question died on both juggernaut and malkorok, and never arrived at Thok.
    2: It's all in german, man. No way am I trying to figure out what everything's named in german ;_;.

  6. #6
    From a quick look at Sha of Pride a ~300 second fight he casted a rough 160 spells(which should be near 240ish) of which were 40 Cobra Shots(which is pretty low), now assuming he has no haste so Cobra Shot takes 2 seconds to cast, that would put him at 200 GCD's used of a potential 300. To go into a bit more detail he used 26 Kill Commands of a possible 60(300/6). He used Glaive Toss 16 time of a possible 20. He also let Serpent Sting drop really early meaning that he isn't casting enough Cobra Shots which in turn will mean he is able to cast fewer other shots because he is getting focus starved.

    If I compare these numbers to my Heroic Iron Juggernaut (in which we had ~25sec) a 5min30 fight. I casted 90 Cobra Shots 45 Kill commands(which isn't the best either) and 18 Glaive Toss'. Warcraftlogs link

    So in short tell him to press more buttons an especially Cobra(to keep his resources up for other abilities) and Kill Command.

  7. #7
    As Draco said the fights are quite hard to use to measure what he is doing wrong. But using Malorok since he's at least alive for 136s out of the 3m54s fight.

    -Serpent sting uptime is 6.4%, should be aiming for 95%+.
    -Cast only 5 Glaive Toss, it's a 15 sec CD, in the time he was alive he should have fit in at least 8.
    -Cast only 9x Kill Command. It's a 6 second CD and should be kept on CD. Should be at least 21 casts of this.
    -Not casting very many Cobra Shots. Should basically ALWAYS be casting something. Hunters are one of the most spam happy classes there are at the moment, get used to it.
    -Didn't prepot, don't know whether you're expecting this for normals or not.

    I'm not going to track him down on the Armory but if he has Sha trinket and the 2pc set bonus, his rapid fire uptime should be 23-30%, will depend on his gear and how well he pools mana ready for BW spam. It's currently at 20% so not too bad, should increase automatically if he casts more shots in general.

    If it was me I would suggest he doesn't run with TotH, and instead picks either Fervor or Dire Beast. It will be a lot easier for him to manage properly while finding the ropes to the more important stuff, not to mention that both come out higher in damage in most fights.
    Last edited by Noima; 2014-01-09 at 11:32 AM.

  8. #8
    Thanks all for participation, I will forward this information and see if it will be better next time

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Dracodraco View Post
    2: It's all in german, man. No way am I trying to figure out what everything's named in german ;_;.
    You probably already know this, but in case anyone doesn't, you can mouse over the names of spells in non-English logs and the tooltip will pop up in English. Still somewhat of a hassle...

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by mediic View Post
    You probably already know this, but in case anyone doesn't, you can mouse over the names of spells in non-English logs and the tooltip will pop up in English. Still somewhat of a hassle...
    Yep, but not worth the effort when giving it a quick glance becomes "mouse over every ability, remember german word for that ability, check whats up"

  11. #11
    We did a little Flex tonight: http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/...g8#view=replay

    Is he performing well now?

    Thanks all for participation!

  12. #12
    He seems to be doing a lot better on Sha but it could be a thing where he plays better as SV compared to BM. He can improve his ability usage(aka press more buttons so you're doing something all the time) but that is a matter of time to get used to. Also looking at Iron Juggernaut 258Kdps seems reasonably good.

  13. #13
    Vast improvement on Juggernaut his active time is up to 99.6% which means he is at least hitting some kind of button all the time.

    The difference in DPS between aMoC and Blink Strikes is very small with BS actually simming higher at decent gear levels. What it also does is free up 60 focus to spend on arcane shots which will reduce his rapid fire CD by an extra 16 seconds. Not to mention he will no longer need to plan and pool an extra 60 focus into his rotation or potentially delay reapplying BA or keeping ES or GT on CD because of being focus starved.

    His serpent sting is still only at 75.4%, ask him to try work on getting it up above 90%. It can drop off during big chains of ES procs, but he should be reapplying it manually especially if he is capping focus during these proc chains. Prioritizing cobra shot over say glaive toss to ensure that this stays up is also worthwhile in some situations.

    Other then that A++ for improvement.

  14. #14
    Herald of the Titans Joyful's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noima View Post
    It can drop off during big chains of ES procs, but he should be reapplying it manually especially if he is capping focus during these proc chains.
    He should reapply manually, but NOT during LnL no matter what focus level he has

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Joyful View Post
    He should reapply manually, but NOT during LnL no matter what focus level he has
    I always prio refreshing SS if I reach 100 focus during those long chains...you don't agree?

    I always see it as dropping focus so it isn't wasted, and gaining the focus that will regen passively and from the SS ticks. Finishing the LnL chain with a higher focus level then I would have done if I had to drop SS at this point. Usually gives an extra arcane shot (CD on RF) before I have to CS again. Trade off I guess is RnG on your later LnL procs and whether putting ES back on CD 1 GCD later will effect you, or whether you will get another LnL proc before it's full CD runs the course anyway.

    Personally I prefer to run with the way I do it, but I can't see there being any noticeable DPS difference either way.

  16. #16
    To get a hang for the balance of focus gaining and dumping I can recommend the FaceShooter addon. It shows you what shots to cast next. It's not perfect but it should lead to quick improvements especially on single-target fights like Juggernaut, Malkorok and Thok.

  17. #17
    Herald of the Titans Joyful's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noima View Post
    I always prio refreshing SS if I reach 100 focus during those long chains...you don't agree?

    I always see it as dropping focus so it isn't wasted, and gaining the focus that will regen passively and from the SS ticks. Finishing the LnL chain with a higher focus level then I would have done if I had to drop SS at this point. Usually gives an extra arcane shot (CD on RF) before I have to CS again. Trade off I guess is RnG on your later LnL procs and whether putting ES back on CD 1 GCD later will effect you, or whether you will get another LnL proc before it's full CD runs the course anyway.

    Personally I prefer to run with the way I do it, but I can't see there being any noticeable DPS difference either way.
    Explosive shot does more damage and as long as you use the highest damaging attack, it doesn't matter that you overcap on focus since you still do the most damage you can per GCD.

  18. #18
    He simple isn't using things on cooldown. Taking a look at the sha of pride kill. He did not die. He did a total of 26 kill commands during that fight, his most hard-hitting ability as BM. Because I can't be bothered to take the time to check how often he was imprisoned, I'll just say he lost 3 kill commands due to it through the fight. 20 whole kill commands are still nowhere to be found, which means he is taking around 10-11 seconds to press the button, when it is on a 6 second cd.

    Ask him how he tracks his abilities. If he doesn't track them effectively, introduce him to something like TellMeWhen, it's easy to configure, plenty guides on youtube if he gets stuck. Having a visual image of the spell pop up on your screen and stay there until you press it should start helping him to improve.
    Last edited by Alth; 2014-01-11 at 05:25 AM.

  19. #19
    There's several addons out there that will notify your friend when a cooldown is ready such as kill command, I would recommend doomcooldownpulse, power auras or omniCC.

  20. #20
    High Overlord Coldbeer's Avatar
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    Any rotation helper for hunter can help him.

    any idea of updated rotation helper?

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