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  1. #1

    How are you finding Flexible raiding?

    I recently re-subbed. Around 2 months ago now. I levelled on a new server. Geared through Timeless Isle and then Looking for Raid. I am currently sitting on 536 item level.

    I downloaded oQ as suggested on these forums (and other places) to have greater access to Flexible raids, and have completed Flex parts 1 + 2 twice. I have tried 5 times to join groups for Flex 3 only to find the first boss has been a brick wall for all of them. I am unable to join Flex PuGs on my server as I do not meet their gear/achievement requirements (starting at 535 for Flex 1 and 540-550 for Flex 3 onwards).

    Not having completed the raid on any difficulty other than LFR I do not feel confident in leading my own group. I have watched videos and learned as much as I can from them, but have always been the kind of raider that needs to have experienced the situations first hand to feel comfortable that all the tactics have clicked. And even when they have clicked I don't particularly want to lead a group. The whole reason I took a break was because I was sick of leading raids in my last guild.

    Is this something anyone else has experienced?

    Do I just need to continue running F1+2 and hoping for better F3+4 groups until my ilvl reaches the requirements of my server?

    Is the quality of players in Flex declining as more people get everything they need from LFR and move over to Flex?

    Or are my problems just bad luck, and your experience is completely different?

  2. #2
    Stood in the Fire caelius's Avatar
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    Well, the item level requirements for Flex groups are indeed quite high, but that's a good thing imo because a lot of lowbies swap over from LFR to flex, so in order to be successful, you have to outgear the whole thing by quite a margin. And yes, it can be said that the quality of Flex players is declining from week to week, but it's also a matter of good or bad luck - sometimes, I get to play with really awesome groups, sometimes they're a real tragedy. 8 out of 10 groups are good enough to get the job done, though. Teamspeak helps a lot, imo.
    Hint: Try to get some experience via LFR and study the encounters on the Internet; most groups tend to choose experience over item level.

    Anyway, Flex is the best thing ever as it allows raiding without fixed schedules and without having to deal with all those toxic fags on LFR. If someone doesn't behave like a decent human being -> bye, bye.

    Awesome signature by Toraah - thank you very much!

  3. #3
    Find a raiding guild, or a social guild that does flex. Go with them. Otherwise, man up and lead a group or keep doing what you're doing until you can befriend some raiders who confidently do later wings (add them!) or until you're so well geared that random ppl will take you.

    TBH this is the same as trying to get into casual raiding in any xpack, nothing new here.

  4. #4
    oQ is kind of a crap shoot. I use it a lot, and have gotten through Flex 3 & 4 with it, but it's been a stroke of luck each time. As your iLevel goes up, you'll be able to enter oQ groups with higher requirements which usually (but not always) have better quality raiders and things will start to go smoother.

  5. #5
    I ask my guild and friends that i know have good alts etc. the rest i fill with OQ. but im quite picky with who i pick, i rather wait 40mins to set up a real grp than wiping and disbanding after 2 wipes due to braindead /2-ppl

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by caelius View Post
    Well, the item level requirements for Flex groups are indeed quite high, but that's a good thing imo because a lot of lowbies swap over from LFR to flex, so in order to be successful, you have to outgear the whole thing by quite a margin. And yes, it can be said that the quality of Flex players is declining from week to week, but it's also a matter of good or bad luck - sometimes, I get to play with really awesome groups, sometimes they're a real tragedy. 8 out of 10 groups are good enough to get the job done, though. Teamspeak helps a lot, imo.
    Hint: Try to get some experience via LFR and study the encounters on the Internet; most groups tend to choose experience over item level.

    Anyway, Flex is the best thing ever as it allows raiding without fixed schedules and without having to deal with all those toxic fags on LFR. If someone doesn't behave like a decent human being -> bye, bye.
    Voice comms don't seem to be commonplace in oQ groups from my limited experience.

    I did think I could possibly just be having bad luck, especially since my sample of 5 groups isn't exactly large.

    Thanks.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Rurts View Post
    Find a raiding guild, or a social guild that does flex. Go with them. Otherwise, man up and lead a group or keep doing what you're doing until you can befriend some raiders who confidently do later wings (add them!) or until you're so well geared that random ppl will take you.

    TBH this is the same as trying to get into casual raiding in any xpack, nothing new here.
    I don't want to change guilds. I'm with a couple of old WoW friends and RL friends who either aren't into raiding, or don't have the same amount of time to play as I do.

    Not wanting to lead a group is nothing to do with manliness. I can lead a group, I did it for years. I dislike leading groups, it lead me to stop enjoying a game I enjoyed previously. I do not want to repeat that. Not only that, but I also would not want to waste someone's time by using outdated or straight up bad tactics for encounters I have yet to experience properly.

  7. #7
    High Overlord Homnar's Avatar
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    Ony use it for alts and people that are not in the raid team within the guild. So I quite like it, great way to get some raiding done on alts and for people that cant raid 3 times a week

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Xynen View Post
    oQ is kind of a crap shoot. I use it a lot, and have gotten through Flex 3 & 4 with it, but it's been a stroke of luck each time. As your iLevel goes up, you'll be able to enter oQ groups with higher requirements which usually (but not always) have better quality raiders and things will start to go smoother.
    Yes. I figured as much. Keep plugging away seems to be the answer to my problem.

    Thanks.

  9. #9
    Stood in the Fire caelius's Avatar
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    In my experience, the groups found with oQueue are usually way worse than those found with the built-in group finder tool implemented some weeks ago. Don't ask me why, though!

    Awesome signature by Toraah - thank you very much!

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by mswhiskerson View Post
    I don't want to change guilds. I'm with a couple of old WoW friends and RL friends who either aren't into raiding, or don't have the same amount of time to play as I do.
    That's totally fine. I was once in your shoes, at the end of WotLK my guild was almost dead, but the few people that were left were old friends, didn't want to leave them. Me + a friend of mine, we befriended a group of ppl and raided with them whenever they had a spot. Fun times were had. Maybe try that (i.e. get invited to a mostly guild group, bring your A-game and be nice, add these guys and stick to them). That implies some luck on your part + a decent server, ofc.

    Not wanting to lead a group is nothing to do with manliness. I can lead a group, I did it for years. I dislike leading groups, it lead me to stop enjoying a game I enjoyed previously. I do not want to repeat that. Not only that, but I also would not want to waste someone's time by using outdated or straight up bad tactics for encounters I have yet to experience properly.
    Well, I didn't intend to question your manliness or anything. The intention is more along the lines of "it's a trade-off, if you put in more effort and do the thing you dislike, you might get better results". Anyway, putting together a flex pug isn't as bad as leading a normal raid - there's no loot drama, no roster drama, no drama of any kind at all basically. Tacs are straightforward, you can pick them up from any source and it's fine. But then again, if you don't want to lead and don't think you'd have any fun leading - just forget it. Trying to build some out-of-guild contacts would be the best idea, then.

  11. #11
    I do Flex with my guild and love it.

    Personally I find most of the Flex pugs to be laughable, its almost always someone with a 520ish ilevel demanding people have 550+. Had someone on my server doing that a couple of days ago.

    "LFM Flex 2, be pro. 550+ ilevel"

    So I armory'd the guy and he's rocking a 524 ilevel with several unenchanted/ungemmed pieces of gear including leg/shoulders. I asked him in whisper if being pro meant not enchanting or gemming one's gear, and he ignore listed me. XD

    (yes I realize this is probably an extreme case, but its still a good example of how unreasonable some people are with these PuGs)

  12. #12
    Seems to go great if you do it on Tues or Saturday. On any other day it's a bunch of 510-525 people doing it for the first time and being horrible.

  13. #13
    Have you tried openraid.eu/openraid.us (depends on where are you from)? Many staff created groups there prefer people with lower gear/no achievements. Also, if you are from EU, you can try this link, where people are creating flex groups for those who don't have the achievements yet. Once you get the achies, you'll get into groups pretty easily.

    I personally like flexible raiding - dont have to run with certain amount of people, can go whenever, can do it multiple times per week, the difficulty is something what LFR should be imo (perfect to get to know the tactics, fairly easy and forgiving about mistakes, but won't allow as much slacking as lfr does currently). Oh, and I personally understand people who want higher ilvls in their pug raids - it just allows people not to be so good and still get the kills.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by mswhiskerson View Post
    Is this something anyone else has experienced?
    the solution to all of your problems is extremly easy - find a guild which does flex alt runs - there is ton of such guilds and they will not only take u but very often they will drag u through normals too -_-

    flex was supposed to be another *social/easy" guild raid mode not pug raid mode - thats why most pugs fail cause they were never target audience of flex -_-

    Quote Originally Posted by caelius View Post
    In my experience, the groups found with oQueue are usually way worse than those found with the built-in group finder tool implemented some weeks ago. Don't ask me why, though!
    because its hard to find that tool and idiots didnt find it yet -_- if they arent told they wont find it for a long time assuring that numebrs of people will be lower but much better quality -_- so if someone is to dumb to find it himself dont show those people how to use it - they will destory the tool liek they made openraid group suck liek hell in 50 % case nowadays to the point good people stay away from it -_-
    Last edited by kamuimac; 2014-01-12 at 05:33 PM.

  15. #15
    The Insane det's Avatar
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    Remember that you can always run your own flex runs and allow ppl to has as low an ilv as you have. This might make many people in your ilv range that have trouble finding groups also happy.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    One cause is a cognitive bias called projection bias. Essentially living inside your own head your entire life makes it exceedingly difficult to understand how others do not also live your same life, think your same thoughts, and hold your same beliefs. In many cases it's quite frustrating to try to empathize and understand why you yourself may not be the center of the universe, which generally results in one 'acting out' in various ways.
    So, in short: the internet.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by mswhiskerson View Post
    I recently re-subbed. Around 2 months ago now. I levelled on a new server. Geared through Timeless Isle and then Looking for Raid. I am currently sitting on 536 item level. I am unable to join Flex PuGs on my server as I do not meet their gear/achievement requirements (starting at 535 for Flex 1 and 540-550 for Flex 3 onwards).
    Is the quality of players in Flex declining as more people get everything they need from LFR and move over to Flex?

    Or are my problems just bad luck, and your experience is completely different?
    OK, first point. You meet the requirements for the first 2 wings of flex on your server. You need to gear up more to do flex 3 and 4. That's one of the reasons you're hitting a brick wall. The groups you get into are all geared much like you are and it's not good enough for the last 6 bosses, unless you're playing with nothing but quality players.

    The quality of players in flex is declining because the good players don't need anything from flex any more, not because the bad players have moved into it. Just keep working on getting more gear and pretty soon you should be able to get into flex 3, and if that goes well and you make friends with some people who run flex regularly(on your server) you can get into a flex 4 w/o the achievement.

    Biggest thing I can tell you at your gear level is to try to run more flexes, even if you don't need the loot, on your own server. It'll get some people familiar with you and increase the chances of you getting into a decent flex 3/4 without having to get all the gear.

  17. #17
    Flex is the new lfr, enjoy.
    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRet

    "This server shutdown was so epic not even Illidan was prepared for it"

  18. #18
    I would consider starting a flex on OQ yourself, do a little research so you can brief people well so you get the fights down.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by caelius View Post
    Anyway, Flex is the best thing ever as it allows raiding without fixed schedules and without having to deal with all those toxic fags on LFR.
    no the kind of people you mentioned (u probably be one of them urself) are now in flex and on mmoc

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    OK, first point. You meet the requirements for the first 2 wings of flex on your server. You need to gear up more to do flex 3 and 4. That's one of the reasons you're hitting a brick wall. The groups you get into are all geared much like you are and it's not good enough for the last 6 bosses, unless you're playing with nothing but quality players.
    Malkorok is an execution check and a light healing throughput check, certainly not a brickwall for any group capable of killing Nazgrim on flex. Usually groups wipe on Malkorok because they're not dealing with Breath of Y'Shaarj properly or sometimes because healers can't keep the raid up during Bloodrage (mostly because raid CDs aren't coordinated...)

    I ask for 540+ item level for my weekly flex full run and we absolutely crush all the gear checks. I'm confident that with proper execution you can do everything but maybe flex Garrosh with a group that has a 525 average item level or so.

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