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  1. #161
    Quote Originally Posted by Quilzar View Post
    Are blizzard standing next to you with a gun at your head?

    Just stop with the forced bullshit.

    Your are not FORCED to do anything in a video game.
    If I want the mount, can I find it somewhere in the game? No. Can I buy it from another player in the AH (which would indeed be another issue)? No. I am indeed forced to use outside means if I want to acquire the mount, something that really removes from the game experience. I'm very much against that, due to how we're already paying a sub fee to keep the game running.

    I'm fine with item shops, and even bonus xp and etc. in games that otherwise are F2P. I completly understand that. They gotta get money somehow to keep the game running. However, we already pay a sub fee to Blizzard in order to keep WoW running, and them adding a store with stuff that truth be told should be acquireable through in-game means, is just a real damn disgrace.
    "It doesn't matter whether a cat is white or black, as long as it catches mice." - Deng Xiaoping
    Quote Originally Posted by Twiddly View Post
    ("Jersey shore" answer) she probably just wasnt good enough for you, and was intimidated by your alpha male status. Leave the room and go pump some iron.

  2. #162
    Blademaster Doftsvamp's Avatar
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    I already have all classes on 90, a few multiple (different realms ya' know) so for me this does nothing. For old Veterans who are returning to the game since i dunno... BC? (know a few) this might be cool, but then again.. Blizzard are killing there game so why should they. The thing that I fear for like many others is how grouping is going to be like, heroic dungeons, LFR, Flex, Normal runs etc. Its already bad as it is now, Lets talk about how we can solve this. **Vote Kick Them ALL** Or be gentleman's and give them tips and links to class guides and tell them politely to look it up. Lets make our community stronger and not weaker.

  3. #163
    Quote Originally Posted by Erathus View Post
    Guys lets be honest here. With the release of WoD the maximum level is going to reach the number 100. Starting from level 1 to reach that roof is a bit overwhelming and discouraging for most and especially for the newcomers. This was bound to happen sooner or later.
    How is that discouraging for newcomers? Going into a complete new world and starting to learn the game form the level they should (1). Did you not have the greatest feeling when you first started to play the game for the 1st time? ...

  4. #164
    Mechagnome Jaja's Avatar
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    Peepz be complaining just to complain.

    Don't like it, don't avail of it.

  5. #165
    The Insane det's Avatar
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    Well, I would have thought by now we have a multitude of threads on this and similar topic where ppl post their opinions as fact and clash - did we need another one?

    Something is always a bad thing to someone for some reason.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    One cause is a cognitive bias called projection bias. Essentially living inside your own head your entire life makes it exceedingly difficult to understand how others do not also live your same life, think your same thoughts, and hold your same beliefs. In many cases it's quite frustrating to try to empathize and understand why you yourself may not be the center of the universe, which generally results in one 'acting out' in various ways.
    So, in short: the internet.

  6. #166
    Quote Originally Posted by Stripeyhat View Post
    I don't understand the hate. Leveling to 90 basically offers nothing in the way of increasing a player's skill and, these days, barely takes any time at all to do. Some people are just irritatingly over-sensitive when it comes to the whole "pay to win" thing. That said, I'd prefer the game only allow you to boost one character to 90 rather than allow you to boost several if you've the money for it.
    I personally have nothing against blizzard giving out max lvl or whatever lvl characters they want.
    But it really annoys me how much attention this is getting, its like a super new cool awesome feature in the game.
    Most people just buy a bot and get to lvl 90 in 2 weeks while afk, theres also RAF, heirlooms, rested bonus, bg xp bonus, LFD bonus, quest bonus, hell there was a freaking free lvl 85 like 2 months ago.
    Can we focus in the important part? New BGs? New raids? New spells? Fixing PvP

  7. #167
    Because if someone comes along and gets instant level 90, that means they only get 10 levels to know how to play their class = they're not going to be that good, which means you wind up in dungeons, hcs and raids with loads of people dragging you down, I think the solution would be that they go to a 'new recruit camp' where they get to learn their class and role in 10 levels building up to 90 in a similar fashion to dks

  8. #168
    Quote Originally Posted by schwarzkopf View Post
    Correct - it requires SOME knowledge of the class. It requires the person play it for a few days (or weeks or what ever).
    That's a fallacy.. My post from other thread about how I (and most people I know) got to max level on most of their chars:

    Quote Originally Posted by DemoBytom View Post
    In Wrath, I dinged my first lock as affliction, spammin drain life (that used to give you nightfall procs) + incinerate (when affli still had it). I rarely ever refreshed dots "because it does shit dmg anyway" and it's better to spam more cast-bar spells. I ran with imp (when you should have felhunter) and thought I know how to play.. That was after about 3 months of leveling to max level. I've never done an instance before max level, never really done much with others, maybe few group quests if there was anyone. I wasn't in a guild till max, I almost didn't use AH etc..
    A week or 2 later I respecced destruction, spec I never played and had to learn it to go to my first raid.
    Then I changed to demonology, another spec I never played and stayed like that for 1.5 expansion.. So ye - leveling process hardly taught me how to warlock...

    Later, in Cataclysm I leveled a DK. Leveled as blood. When I hit lv 85 I respecced frost and learned how to play it. Again - leveling process did nothing to teach me how to play the spec I later played a lot.

    Since then every class I level is just by grinding instances (Except levels +-50-58, bit of Northrend, bit of Cata). That's how I leveled my monk, 1-90 as Brewmaster spamming keg smash + breath of fire.. Sometimes a bit of Spinning Crane Kick.. Didn't care about selfbuffs I should keep etc.
    At max level - again I had to go Windwalker, spec I never tried before, and again - I had to learn it from scratch at max level.. Later the same with Mistweaver..

    In the end - my lock got everything up to and including Lich King during Wrath, my paladin healed up to and including Lich King. Then all the 4.0 instances, my DK everything up to and including Madness in Cata as main tank, now I'm main tanking on my monk and got Garrosh on farm..

    So to sum up - the whole leveling process taught me only a little how the game works, though most of it I learned at max level. Same with specs and roles - I learned it all just doing those at max level.
    Tanking my way up was a little help, and showed me basics, but then I hit my first HC dungeon and had to relearn everything, because It suddenly required some CD usage, watching up who's got aggro etc..
    I learned healing at max level only..
    So I really, really doubt that leveling process is that much needed to learn your class :? For me, at least, it taught me nothing valuable, just ate a big chunk of time.. And I really doubt that instant lv 90 will have any major impact on the quality of players you meet in LFD/LFR.. And guild Flex/normal etc are an environment when players learn/teach anyway..
    Leveling doesn't teach you how to play your class. Maybe 1 spec in most occasions, but even then - you'll most likely play it wrong.
    For half of your leveling procs you don't even have correct abilities, sometimes you use wrong ones, some come at lv 85-87 etc...
    Quote Originally Posted by Archaeon View Post
    In tbc everyone wished they were playing vanilla. In cataclysm everyone will wish they were playing wotlk.
    ^------True story!!

  9. #169
    Because people are affraid that this is only the start.
    Level 90's don't matter that much to me, it's a smart move to attract old players because it gives an easy jump-in tho.

    Ill just boost 1 of my 85's personally
    Trylb / Galesin
    Winners never quit, Quitters never win
    Nobody Said It Was Easy

  10. #170
    Quote Originally Posted by Alextana View Post
    No. I am indeed forced to use outside means if I want
    I am guessing you don't see the problem there?

  11. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by UnifiedDivide View Post
    No, you do not learn your class while leveling. You learn literally the bare minimum to get to max level. Bad players will always be bad players whether they got the account on eBay, paid for a boost or actually leveled. All players boosting a toon will have to do a DK-like starting area anyway to learn a bit of the class before going into WoD content.
    Agreed, of course you don't learn how to play the endgame of wow from the leveling experience. Through the leveling experience you do however get a closer relationship with your abilities if you level all the way of 1-100, than you would from leveling only 90-100. While it won't learn you how to play the endgame, it will indeed give the player a better starting point.
    "It doesn't matter whether a cat is white or black, as long as it catches mice." - Deng Xiaoping
    Quote Originally Posted by Twiddly View Post
    ("Jersey shore" answer) she probably just wasnt good enough for you, and was intimidated by your alpha male status. Leave the room and go pump some iron.

  12. #172
    Quote Originally Posted by Zellviren View Post
    I've no idea what the RAF numbers are, but I'd guess you're overestimating them. My point here (and why I tried to rephrase in the post you quoted) is that the levelling curve should be worthwhile and bring new players into the game properly rather than ditching them in at the deep end. Learning a rotation, earning gold, working on professions, experiencing the story and getting to know other players all help immersion, which should be the hallmark of an MMO.

    My question to you is this:

    If you believe skipping 1-90 is fine, and Blizzard believes the same, why are they not removing it entirely?
    Leveling is a staple of RPGs, and while the community here is hyper-focused on end-game; it's really not representative of the community as a whole. There's a not insignificant proportion of the playerbase who enjoy it, and for whom leveling alts of different race and class combinations is basically their game. I don't doubt that there are plenty of players at max level who also enjoy leveling; I mean it doesn't exactly take long to find threads here that complain about how leveling is too easy and too trivial. Removing the whole experience altogether then would adversely effect a lot of players, which is bad for the game.

    That's why the whole thing looks grubby to me. Rather than fixing something that's imperfect, as you've rightly implied, they're leaving it in as an inconvenience that people will likely be allowed to pay money to avoid.
    Some will, but just like you think I'm overestimating how many people are using existing workarounds - even convenient in game things like the XP pots, DMF buff, heirlooms etc - I think you're overestimating how many players will make use of this feature.

    It's cynical.
    I disagree, I think it's streamlining existing systems and making them more readily available. Sure, I'd love for them to fix things, but Cataclysm tried and failed horribly at doing that; I don't think it would be a good use of resources to do that when people are still going to regard it as an inconvenience whatever they do to it because what they actually want to be doing is playing with their friends at the level cap.

  13. #173
    Titan Winter Blossom's Avatar
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    Yes, there will be a ton of players walking around in the world that are clueless about their new 90. But, any person who really cares about playing WoW will take 30 mins to read up on their new class. You don't need weeks to learn what your spells do.

    *New 90's in PvP may take a couple of days though.

  14. #174
    Stood in the Fire Cylom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quilzar View Post
    hahahaha

    You think you learn that from leveling 1-90?

    OT: Haters love to hate, EVERY single thing blizzard does will be hated on and people will moan and bitch about it, I don't think I have seen a single announcement that people have not moaned and bitched about.

    I remember when they announced everyone could play ever race regardless of if you owned the expansion or not (Goblins, Worgens etc) and people complained about that.
    I remember reading every spell my mage got back at Wrath, and thinking how would I benefit from using it.

    Learnt how to win duels vs paladins dk and warlocks, because of howmany times I dueled them/fought allys in open world.
    Or how to cast poly every time I saw a pack with a moon icon on top of it, when running dungeons.

    But because of how blizz changed stuff today
    I killed my brother's mage at lvl 90, using Unstable affliction only and my defensive cds, maybe he is just that bad but I don't really think anyone could be that bad when he is max level back at Sub-cataclysm.

    What can I say, I love Female Gnomes.
    Quote Originally Posted by ShimmerSwirl View Post
    People don't come back because the game is homogenized with no meaningful progression. Everyone is a winner, all your actions are irrelevant.

  15. #175
    Quote Originally Posted by Cylom View Post
    I remember reading every spell my mage got back at Wrath, and thinking how would I benefit from using it.

    Learnt how to win duels vs paladins dk and warlocks, because of howmany times I dueled them/fought allys in open world.
    Or how to cast poly every time I saw a pack with a moon icon on top of it, when running dungeons.

    But because of how blizz changed stuff today
    I killed my brother's mage at lvl 90, using Unstable affliction only and my defensive cds, maybe he is just that bad but I don't really think anyone could be that bad when he is max level back at Sub-cataclysm.
    And people like you can still do that right?

    They are not removing the spell book or anything right?

    Terrible players will still be terrible, players who want to be good will want to be good.

    You can level 1-90 spamming frost bolt.

  16. #176
    Old thinking a lot of it. I'd guess a lot of people that levelled themselves to 90 feel jealous that someone can bypass that effort with the click of a button. Some people might also not have a problem with the 1 time free 90 boost but the paid option for multiple characters.

    A lot of people need to realise times have changed. The game already has 90 levels and although one can argue it doesn't take long to reach 90, a lot of new people joining the game want to jump right into the relevant content. You don't even learn classes while levelling anymore, another old argument that doesn't really apply in todays WoW. I mean, how could you? You don't get the majority of your spells until level 70-80.

    Either way, doesn't bother me personally.
    Last edited by Xucuroz; 2014-01-17 at 01:38 PM.
    We are warriors, born from the light
    An army for freedom, defenders of life
    Warriors, euphoria will rise
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  17. #177
    Quote Originally Posted by schwarzkopf View Post
    Correct - it requires SOME knowledge of the class. It requires the person play it for a few days (or weeks or what ever).
    SoR and RaF would like a word with you.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Xucuroz View Post
    Old thinking a lot of it. I'd guess a lot of people that levelled themselves to 90 feel jealous that someone can bypass that effort with the click of a button. Some people might also not have a problem with the 1 time free 90 boost but the paid option for multiple characters.

    A lot of people need to realise times have changed. The game already has 90 levels and although one can argue it doesn't take long to reach 90, a lot of new people joining the game want to jump right into the relevant content. You don't even learn classes while levelling anymore, another old argument that doesn't really apply in todays WoW. I mean, how could you? You don't get the majority of your spells until level 70-80.

    Either way, doesn't bother me personally.
    Agreed. It takes what 72 hours to hit lvl 90? Even if you level it yourself, there is still no knowing how to play that class at end game until you hit end game. If end game is 100, and I can buy the first 90 levels, that gives me 10 levels to adjust to my class and then all the time in the world to learn how to raid with it. Especially when raiding rotations are far different from leveling.

    Also, for those who use RaF or SoR, for their instant 80s, who level them to 90s, apparently, some of these people think you know nothing about your character or your class. Maybe you should all weigh in and let them know how easy the 10 levels were and what iLvL you are currently sitting at
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkvoltinx View Post
    sure you can have Dreanei warlocks

  18. #178
    People in LFR will become so bad though! Because the leveling experience is just too valuable for people to learn how to play their class!

    I know when Blizzard radically changed classes between expansions, I purposely deleted my max level characters to level them fresh, because otherwise it would have been impossible for me to learn how to play with them again! No matter how much you understand the abilities by looking in your spellbook and reading the descriptions, you simply cannot fathom how they can possibly work without 90 levels of spamming one or two of them! Characters that skip will forever be bad!

    Plus also, it's called an MMORPG, so you need to go through 90 basically solitary levels of spamming one or two buttons. People that don't want to do that are clearly playing the wrong game, and should quit... because I say so!
    Some of the arguments I've seen so far...

  19. #179
    The positive things of this new feature as I see it: increased motivation to play the game for some newcomers. If they're smart, they will try out a few different classes at low level first to be sure the one they choose is a class they like.

    Once they have this character they will know how much better gameplay is at high levels, which will motivate them to level a new character all the way from 1-100. For veterans it's simply a convenient bonus for those that don't enjoy leveling.

    The negative: Starting a class at level 90 can be overwhelming and the learning curve is significantly steeper (atleast initially) this can demotivate some people, or make them bad players at max level. Perhaps Blizzard should have made the character a lvl 80 or 85 to give people a little more time to get to know their class before max level. Conclusion: some beginners can handle it, some can't.
    There is also the concern that this will eventually be a paid service which I agree would be excessive.


    This is all speculation of course, we won't know for sure until the feature is out.
    Last edited by theorangebox; 2014-01-17 at 02:58 PM.

  20. #180
    It's not a bad thing in the sense that if someone else can acquire it, go ahead. Nor is the idea that there will be some influx of bad players relevant, because you really don't need to display any amount of skill during the leveling process as it currently stands

    But it cheapens an already hilariously shallow game. A free 90, and purchasable multiple 90s afterwards, is Blizzard saying "yep, the bulk of our content isn't worth investing in as a player".

    That stance is supposed to make me want to continue subbing to this game? Pass.

    /in other news, I wonder how hard they're kicking themselves for wasting time revamping old world content in Cata.
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